FFRR in 2016

[Shackleton]

So my uncle who bought my Vogue SE new in '91 has just ordered a new FFRR! I'm excited I have to say. Realise though that I don't know anything about them, not even the LR model designation, so I need to cram It's a 3.0 TDV6 Vogue, he hasn't told me what he spec'd up, but it will be Havana premium metallic with a Santorini black roof.

So, what can you tell me about them? The brochure says it'll do 40mpg combined and it's faster than my Esprit to 60mph but that wouldn't be difficult. Are they any use?

George

PS - that means between us we have an early two door, a RRC Vogue SE, a P38 DHSE and this coming RR whatever you call it. And my D2. Something's going to have to give.

[L19MUD]

L405 is the model designation, replacing the L322 which ran from 2002 up to 2012

They are 'a bit' of a step up from the P38!! Quiet, refined and economical for something so big. they really shed a lot of weight going from the L322 to the L405 which makes it handle a lot better. In some places the weight loss is a little noticeable but if the two are not next to each other you wouldn't know

I am sure you will love it

[Shackleton]

Thanks! I'm sure I'll love it if I ever get to drive it

In the meantime I remembered Wikipedia... 450kg+ less than the V8 diesel L322! (specifically the Vogue TDV6 L405) The Top Gear review says the body is all alu and 300kg of the weight is lost there, putting it in the weight class of a Discovery 2. I'm trying to imagine a D2 with 256bhp / 600Nm. Anyway that means the TDV6 is enough engine, in turn saving another 100kg. So the fuel tank can be smaller saving another 25kg on a full tank. The TDV6 gets 40+ mpg.

I've never been a P38 man, I never got on with the interior.

Interestingly I also read about CSK criticising SUV owners and saying his design was never meant to be a status symbol. I've been mulling over whether to go auto in my rebuild of my two door or not, I think I'd miss the long stick now

[GBMUD]

People say that while the 3.0 TdV6 is adequate, it is no 4.4 TdV8.

Chris

[Ed Poore]

I agree with what Chris says. People have said that the TDV6 is the better overall, being a lighter engine it's more responsive and given the weight loss more than adequate to shift it around.

The TDV6 is on paper quicker than my 3.6TDV8 but that is a heavy car.

But... it's not a V8!

The best place for knowledge is unfortunately over on fullfatrr.com where they seem to spend most of the time polishing and changing wheels. There are some exceptions though.

Now that the 405 is out the 322s are coming down in price that people are doing stuff themselves. Unless I run out of time or it is going to be a pain of a job on my own on the side of the street I try and do all the work myself now. Not quite to the extreme of Pete (Haylands on the forum) who has turned his 4.4 petrol into a bit of an off roading monster.

Very few people take them off the tarmac but they are phenomenal off road (certainly the 322 and I can only imagine the 405 is even better). The main downside is their girth and the fact the tyre options are utter carp.

Having said all that despite the fact they are fairly hefty on servicing costs (significantly cheaper if you do it yourself) and parts aren't cheap yet, they are getting better as more "enthusiasts" are buying them when they're running well there really isn't a vehicle to compare them too.

I was seriously considering getting shot of mine after spending a reasonable sum sorting out the transfer box after Strata Florida last year. Then drove it in horrendous conditions down to Wales for Christmas and it was comfortable, quiet, fast and effortless. The 110 wouldn't have been the same... The clincher was my sister borrowed it to go to hockey one morning and I very rarely hear the exhaust note as I'm usually driving it. Despite being a diesel sounds pretty damn good.

To put it in perspective I think the TDV6 has comparable numbers to my 3.6 (which is 270bhp and about 640Nm) but is in a vehicle almost 500kg lighter (mime being 2725kg). Towing is effortless and 3.5t is all but unnoticeable and will out accelerate a significant number of vehicles (in particular one very annoyed Corsa boy racer ?) even with a 110 on a trailer behind it.

I do like my 322, it doesn't have the same character as the 110 but it does make driving the length of the country effortless. I'm sure you'll love the 405 but for me and the stuff I do they're still far too expensive.

[Shackleton]

Nice insight Ed, I've often had a hankering after a L322. In fact when I bought my D2 it was a toss up and the only reason I went the other way was because I need to not get too attached, it's just a hack until my RR is finished.

RE V6 vs V8; it goes without saying of course! but my uncle is 70 and is a refined sort of gent who ambles along on his way shooting or to the south of France for a jolly. Given the feedback from reviews of the V6 the V8 would have been overkill for him.

[Ed Poore]

Glad to be of service. Just don't underestimate the running costs, mine have been exasperated by off roading it. I mean close to £2k in tyres in three years!

Basically following Chris laning is a bad idea as he's been the common theme to email exploding tyres! Managed a week in Brechfa and mid Wales without damaging one.

Had I known I was not going to follow through with my original plan of replacing the 110 with the 322 (I kept both) then I would have probably have gone for a petrol one, most likely the 4.2 supercharged.

But I have the diesel and I know it pretty well so better the devil I know I feel. Now that they're sub £20k in general for the presence 2010 models more people are buying them as hacks and maybe, just maybe, cheaper parts might become available.

Oh and a final thing is they're a bugger for jacking up and putting on axle stands. They've got so much articulation that you need a trolley jack under the wishbones or a double extension bottle jack to get the damn wheels of the ground. Boy did I get a shock when I managed to get it into super extended mode in Brechfa and I fell out the door because it was even higher up than I expected.