jeremy996

New Defenders are as vulnerable as Range Rovers for relay and OBD exploits, it is getting very hard to insure any JLR products in Greater London, Manchester and Leeds.

7000rpm on an A series must be close to destruction! The tuned Imps would run to 10,000rpm; they were not known as "Screamers" for nothing. The rally Imps could be a menace sometimes; I had an intermittent plug issue once and unburnt fuel pooled in the exhaust until it ignited outside the Police station in Cannock, the sheet of flame scared my navigator and he was not looking out of the window. That got me stopped and invited to produce my documents at my local Police station within the next day or so. Thankfully all were in order, the desk officer was a keen club rallyist, (and kept beating me the next year).

There are more than a few threads about steering wobble on here as it is not uncommon. Try this as a Google search, "LR4x4.com: steering wobble" That should be a good start - swivel pre-laod and a bush breaking down are regular causes.

I have had a number of vehicles with "character", (more likely, an amazing ability to embarrass you in public). The Morgan has a "fly-off handbrake" that confuses most casual drivers. Back in the days I used to rally Imps, the stage car was stolen by two chancers who ran out of fuel on the M6 on the raised section by the Dunlop Building. Driving it like you stole it got the mpg down to around 10mpg, which with a 6 gallon tank gave a very limited range! My Father used to drive my cast offs; he once borrowed one of my Imps to go to work and had a terrible time trying to get out of the close, (a hill up to the main road), as it would bog on take-off and stall. He got angry with it and dropped the clutch at about 5,500rpm, so it shot up the close like a greased pig and he barely stopped it at the T junction at the top. On the way back from work, he got stopped for doing 90 in a 70 and was let off with a talking too when he explained it was not his usual car and he could barely see the speedo! (He was taller than I am, so could only just fit in the fixed bucket seat). The LR110's ability to cause trouble was well documented on this forum - France 2019

I have bought laid-up cover from Flux and Lancaster in the past, (most recently for my LR90 and the Morgan). Try the classic car insurers, as they are more likely to be exposed to owners who have immobile vehicles for decades. Do you have any UK presence? Bank account, accommodation address, relative who can hold post? Ideally you need a UK address for UK jurisdiction insurance. Being foreign based is another risk factor for insurance.

Can you explain the symptoms a little more, please?

...ish! It was better with a load on and a little hard when running light.

The press release from Ineos Automotive:- INEOS AUTOMOTIVE AT THE 2023 GOODWOOD FESTIVAL OF SPEED: GLOBAL DEBUTS FOR ALL-NEW GRENADIER QUARTERMASTER AND HYDROGEN FUEL CELL DEMO London, 29 June 2023 – Following the start of series production of the Grenadier 4X4 last year, INEOS Automotive will make its mark across this year’s Goodwood Festival of Speed (13 - 16 July). The All-New Grenadier Quartermaster, a double cab pick-up variant of the award-winning Grenadier, will make its global debut on Thursday 13th July. This will be shortly followed by a very special appearance on the famous hillclimb with some familiar Goodwood faces to celebrate two 75-year automotive anniversaries - motorsports at Goodwood and the Belstaff Trialmaster Jacket that lends its name to one of Grenadier’s trims. Also making its first ever public appearance is the Grenadier Hydrogen Fuel Cell (FCEV) Technology Demonstrator, which will show how well-suited the zero emissions technology is for a future long-range 4X4 off-roader. Both the Grenadier Quartermaster and FCEV Demonstrator will be showcased in the First Glance Paddock and will be driven up the hillclimb route on each of the four days of the Festival. In an exciting exclusive for Goodwood Festival of Speed, adventurous visitors will be able to get behind the wheel of the Grenadier Station Wagon on a challenging off-road course at the Goodwood Halnaker Chalkpit neighbouring the main event site. Hundreds of slots are available throughout the four days of the Festival for those wanting to put the 4X4 through its paces. - Ends - Notes to editors: INEOS Automotive will hold a short press conference at its main stand at 11:00am on Thursday 13 July, and the new Grenadier Quartermaster will feature in the very special run up the hillclimb route at 12:20pm. Contact details: Russell Minahan, Head of PR, INEOS Automotive +44 (0) 7739 077762 russell.minahan@ineos.com Matt Moore, PFPR Communications +44 (0) 7715 075992 matt.moore@pfpr.com About INEOS Grenadier In 2017, INEOS Chairman Jim Ratcliffe, a car enthusiast and experienced adventurer, identified a gap in the market for a stripped back, utilitarian, hard-working 4x4 engineered for modern day compliance and reliability. INEOS Automotive Limited was formed and a senior team of automotive professionals assembled to bring the vision to reality with a fresh perspective of 4x4 development and manufacturing. Combining rugged British spirit and design with German engineering rigour, the Grenadier will be a truly uncompromising 4x4 built from the ground up. Engineered to overcome all conditions, it will provide best-in-class off-road capability, durability, and reliability to those who depend on a vehicle as a working tool, wherever they are in the world. INEOS Automotive is a subsidiary of INEOS (www.ineos.com), a leading manufacturer of petrochemicals, speciality chemicals and oil products. It employs 25,000 people across 39 businesses, with a production network spanning 183 sites in 29 countries. From paints to plastics, textiles to technology, medicines to mobile phones, materials manufactured by INEOS enhance almost every aspect of modern life. In 2021, INEOS had sales of $65bn. To find out more about Grenadier, visit www.ineosgrenadier.com

My LR110CSW was originally rebuilt with the self-leveller, but it failed, so I ended up with the later "heavy-duty" rear springs. That rebuilt price is scary, one for the concours types, I guess.

The doublecab pickup is due to break cover at Goodwood FoS, https://www.pistonheads.com/news/general-pistonheads/ineos-quartermaster-pick-up-to-debut-at-goodwood/47383 In other news, the first half-sensible article about military uses, https://www.joint-forces.com/features/65343-grenadier-quartermaster-a-potential-uk-gsup-contender Finally, Car magazine's skimpy take on the Ineos press release, https://www.carmagazine.co.uk/car-news/first-official-pictures/_ineos/grenadier-quartermaster-pick-up/ If I ever get the original press release, I'll post it up.

It is hard to disagree wth any of that! Mine is diesel and the MPG is slowly improving, I've got to 26mpg at the moment. Considering I'm a heavy footed, fairly rapid driver, fuel consumption is OK. (Old IAM instructor said I was good at "making progress"). Changing the seats to the rearwards position is a spanner job, but you would probably have to remake the brackets for the half height guard. My family consider the exisiting position to be perfectly adequate, but for them the LR110 is still a memory burned into the brain. I never felt the steering was an issue, but I can understand the shock that someone fresh from a modern hatchback would feel from a standing start. The turning circle is not great either, like an old LR110 on wide rubber, so that would also be an inhibition. I adjusted to the speedo position in a couple of days, I can now operate some of the overhead switches without looking at them, (power to the sockets with the ignition off, off-road mode and the driving lights). The rattle from the dog guard is possibly the bottle jack, (not installed in its niche tightly enough - add a rag). My truck would be £66k OTR now and that does seem like a lot, but I had a day's drive of a modern LR90 and did not love it and that was £80k. It is all a matter of priorities; do you want a well mannered road car for some off road work and expect to change it at the end of the PCP or do you want to buy a vehicle for life. If my Grenadier does not last me until I have to give up driving, I shall be well peeved, (and more than a little surprised). Ineos have not managed the technical release too well so far, but the vehicle is fundimentally OK, with poor detail work on the on-board software, so it is unnecessarily alarmist. They have also missed expectations on the workshop and parts manual releases, but I have reasons for optimism in the future.

Congratulations - nice to know the forum paid a small part.

The UK is not perceived as a major target for Ineos; the US, South African and Australian markets are where they are pushing more. As for the "Commercial" issue in the UK, there are a few alternatives for Ineos, target the 2 seat utility station wagon, as that could be made as compliant as the new LR90 and LR110, (i.e. only by concession), and alternatively, re-submit it as a commercial vehicle governed by Maximum Authorised Mass. (Plate it to a higher GVW, the chassis and suspension will not care). ( https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/907390/v149x1-rates-of-vehicle-tax.pdf). Now the second option would exclude anyone without a suitable driving licence, but many people will have it already, C1, C1E etc. The issue in the US and Australasia is the availability of alternatives, (Jeep, Bronco, older model Land Cruisers etc.), and especially in Australia, the lack of external safety assessment. To get a good score at EuroNCAP, you need autonomous braking, lane assist and similar electronic assistance, none of which are installed or even proposed. Many of the Australian potential purchasers of vehicles for commercial use have a stated policy of 5* NCAP scores, which, so far, has not been tested.

I've found them to be OK, but only the smart ones are clever enough to say they don't know. Ineos has a problem with getting enough and the right information to the sales agents. The bit about the 5 seat and 2 seat being "commercial" is true, but only to the extent of the DVLA, which is not the relevant bit so far as an business owner/driver is concerned, where HMRC's attitude to Benefit in Kind and VAT status is more important. My agent have been smart enough to say "we don't know" each time I have pushed for more information than Ineos has released officially, so I have never caught them out. Ineos are not expecting to sell many Grenadiers in the UK, so the local market taxation conditions have not been at the top of the agenda. When sales slow below the anticipated numbers, I can see their game getting much better. The next big test will be the release of the DoubleCab pickup, it will not meet the Dual Use /Commercial tests as it stands and the exisiting taxation group, so will they replate it as a commercial with an Authorised Mass? The underpinnings will cope with a higher payload, but not within 3.5tonnes gross Vehicle Mass.

The doors are alloy, so your point is well made. The bulk of the body in white is galvanised steel, with the removable panels all in alloy, (bonnet and all 6 doors). YouTube, (like Facebook and Twitter), uses the turmoil in the comments as a metric to show the specific video to more punters or not; saying something, anything that gets responses is good for the exposure and revenue.

The USA launch is now in full swing, so the US YouTubers are busy. I was quite taken by this and the comments below the video seem very much like the whinging on the European videos. A few sharp observations about the alphabet soup of posh components - this has been built to a performance standard, not a price. The price sounds cheap to me, but US cars are quoted before dealer extorted markups and local sales taxes, so what do I know?

The recent "influencers" with the Grenadier have decided to sell. Some fairly dumb reasons to me, but hey! each to their own. Expecting the dual cab pickup to be lighter seems nuts to me. Under the existing HMRC rules, it would need to be less than 2.5 tonnes, to give a potential 1000kg payload or under 2040kg to qualify as "dual-use", neither of which seem very likely. That they have broken even on an early sale suggests there is some desire for early delivery.

The rear seats do fold down, but they are not 'flat' and there is a bit of a step from the loadbay to the top of the folded cushion. It's no worse than some of the less well designed estate cars of the '70s and '80s, but compared to the Austin Maxi and the old Defender "take a spanner and remove the seats", it does not create as much space. It is not optimal, but understandable when you remember that there can be two large batteries, the split charge module and the fuse and relay bank under the Grenadier's seats. For the USA spec Grenadiers, if you don't have a second battery, you can have "Premium" audio, with a better amplifier and a bass bin, (in the void where the second battery would be).

I've done well over 2000 miles now and the average consumption is just over 24 mpg, so still not great but better than officially declared. My wife is complaining about the glove box being only big enough for gloves with the owners manual in it. The central cubby usually has my iPhone, the iphone to USB-a cable and a packet of wine gums. My wife's door bin is full of stately home maps and mine contains a bottle of water. My wife's bottle of water is in the cup holder. The loadbay has a ex-local authority recycling box full of recovery gear and some basic tools, together with a hi-viz motorway coat and my tea-making gear, (petrol stove, kettle, teabags, 1.5l of water in aluminium flasks and small sundries), all held in place by bungee cords. The Grenadier is now as cluttered as my LR110 ever was. The fundamental change, LR to Grenadier, is the provision of cup holders that work, no leaks in rain storms and the ability to converse with one's passenger at motorway speed, without yelling.

The diff-locks are a RTFM problem, ("Read the Flippin' Manual"), and I think he is sitting too low - sitting up and slightly forward would reduce the visibility issue and the left foot whinging. At the end of the day, it is not a sports car! To be fair to Harry, he did not like the old Defender, so the Grenadier was unlikely to endear itself. The comment about a test in a "basic" one is fair, he should try mine; £10k less but most of the good points and a smaller bill.

I see Harry's was one of the Scottish launch vehicles. I'm surprised they did not tidy it more - the screws missiing from the rear trim would never happen with JLR, they practically rebuilt vehicles after the press had done thier worst. There was an article in the LR press where the PR man explained the resources they had back stage to deal with the bent and broken subjects after each day! I enjoyed his video, I can see why he came to his conclusions, but I'm delighted to say I disagree with him on his final conclusion; I did not and will not buy a new Defender, I struggle to believe they will still be working in 20 years time. A brand new Defender is a wonderous, albeit expensive object, but I do not see it surviving a mechanically-disinterested first PCP leaser, a fashion-concious second owner, a broke third owner, the JLR dealer network and the patchwork independent garage sector to become as supported as the P38 or the Hippo. I don't mind being wrong, as the waste in resources is massive, but JLR have not co-operated with the independent sector for years now and dump new/old stock as fast as they can to appease the accountants. I took my Grenadier to Newcastle upon Tyne today, so 182 miles each way and 6 hours driving; roughly half the journey took 40.77l or 8.97 gallons and 192 miles, so 21.40mpg, mostly at 70mph, (open road), or 50mph, (road works), so not brilliant, but not terrible either. My head isn't rattling and I could do it again in rapid succession, if I had to. Not something I'd contemplate in the LR1110.

There has been a slow roll out of demonstrators, with customer cars being prioritised over the dealer demos. The vehicles that were on the Scottish to Belgravia expedition have been used for all kinds of other publicity stuff, so Harry's may be one of those.

At this base price in the market and with the high CO2 output, van RFL is much less than the car equivalent; that was one of the reasons I bought the N1 Station Wagon. Insurance has been a little bit more of a pain and I need to remember the commercial speed limits, but otherwise the choice is positive. After 5 years and a saving of a few thousand £, I'll have to pay the higher RFL, but I can live with that. So, you want to buy an M1 (car) Grenadier? RFL over £40k, £2,605 First Registration 2nd Year £570 3rd Year £570 4th Year £570 5th Year £570 6th Year and onwards £180, assuming the government in power don't change the rules again! A N1 Van is £320 per year.

As my first entry states, the vehicle is a commercial so far as DVLA are concerned; HMRC march to a different drum and Ineos have not done a JLR and lobbied to get the "commercials" as acceptable, yet. You are far from the only one, but lobbying HMRC is not a priority with Ineos; when selling them becomes harder, I'm sure they will step up. Ultimately, until HMRC update their list of acceptable commercial vehicles, if you buy, apply the van benefit in kind and recover the VAT, your local tax inspector may accept the use as commercial, it depends on the actual useage and is far from transparent, ("tax inspector's discretion"), so I can understand why people stick with what they know. Even Ineos conceed that the 5 seat Utility Station Wagon will not likely quailfy with HMRC as a commercial, even after lobbying. Ineos do not see the UK as a "make or break" market, expecting to sell more units in Australia, South Africa and North America. They expect to have a BEV launched fairly shortly, (the smaller Grenadier), and the double-cab could be sold as a car or a commercial vehicle. The capacity of the vehicle is not in doubt; it's how they fit it into the local regulations that is the problem.

I'd try the free classifieds in LRM and talk to The Market by Bonhams; they have got some high prices for Land Rovers over the last year. https://themarket.bonhams.com/en Much as I would love a CSK, my wallet is empty and I would be murdered in cold blood and buried under the patio if I bought it.