madmatt Posted June 9, 2017 Share Posted June 9, 2017 Hi folks As some of you have read elsewhere i am undertaking a rebuild of my 130 its a 300tdi, i ordered a refurbished bulkhead from mosside landrovers, today i have started to fit it and swap parts over only to find when i fit my wheel boxes i cant get the steel tube for the drive cable between the two boxes as the centre support is different. I have contacted mosside who have been very good but it would be weeks before they have a 300tdi ready to deliver to me has anyone come across this before? I am up against it i have time booked off work, and my landrover is in bits in some one elses workshop. By the way i will post my rebuild in members vehicles with all the problems i hqve faced once i get this sorted Many thanks Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted June 9, 2017 Share Posted June 9, 2017 a photo of the subject area would be useful Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retroanaconda Posted June 9, 2017 Share Posted June 9, 2017 Can you drill the support and pass the tube through? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted June 9, 2017 Share Posted June 9, 2017 Not like the earlier ones where it has to pass through the support? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmatt Posted June 12, 2017 Author Share Posted June 12, 2017 Sorry guys i thought i had asked for this to be deleted, hopefully the problem will be solved when a complete td5 bulkhead and dash arrive for me to steal bots off that are needed as apparently they supplied a td5 bulkhead instead of the 300 i ordered. Once i have rectified the issues i will post pictures of what the differences were. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 Well stick the findings and info in here then the thread is complete and a useful bit of tech for the future for anyone with the same issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddy_SP Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 The wheelbox spindle on the Td5 has flats on either side to stop it spinning out of position, whereas the earlier ones didn't. I just fitted a Td5 bulkhead to my 200Tdi Defender, and thus had to source two of the late type wheelboxes. Since they're a vast improvement over the earlier ones, I wasn't complaining! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmatt Posted June 19, 2017 Author Share Posted June 19, 2017 Evening guys right this isnt coming together quite how i had hoped and the situation is getting desperate, to reiterate i have a 300tdi i am rebuilding but have been supplied a td5 bulkhead (or what i am told is a td5 bulkhead) I could do with some input on the wiper drives as tge dash support on new bulkhead stops the tube fitting between the wheel boxes, its a galv bulkhead so i really dont want to just set to and butcher it really. If anyone has any picture of a td5 wiper set up behind the dash i would be gratefull i am fairly sure i can make the rest of the dash that i have fit. I have attached to pictures the white bulkhead is my old one the slightly darker pic is the new one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted June 19, 2017 Share Posted June 19, 2017 note 10 & 14 in https://forums.lr4x4.com/topic/38064-galvanised-bulkhead-pointers/ might help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retroanaconda Posted June 19, 2017 Share Posted June 19, 2017 The later (2002-on but we'll call them Td5 for ease) models had the wiper motor and rack arranged differently on the bulkhead. The motor is mounted higher on a separate bracket (hence the loss of part of the dash tray) and the tube comes straight out across the dash with no bends. The wheelboxes are also mounted 'upside down' compared to the earlier type, with the drive tube at the bottom. This is why yours won't fit, as with the wiper boxes mounted the other way round the tube will want to be at the top and occupy the same space as the dash brackets. If you are converting to a later Td5 dash then just fit everything as per the later models. If however you are fitting your Tdi dash then I am afraid you will need to drill the dash mounts to pass the drive cable tubes through. You may also need to modify the dash top rail to make it fit the brackets. Equally the bracket that mounts the wiper motor (visible in the photos in western's linked thread above) will need removing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmatt Posted June 19, 2017 Author Share Posted June 19, 2017 Thanks both for the replys, i am now struggling to work out what the hell i have in the way of a bulkhead as it had the td5 style top dash mounts but also has the 1"3/4 hole already for the wiring and doesn' t have a bracket attached on it for the wiper motor! The plot thickens i would like to keep the tdi dash as dint really like the td5 centre panel but then drilling holes in dash mounts on a nicely painted galv bulkhead makes me feel sick!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retroanaconda Posted June 19, 2017 Share Posted June 19, 2017 To illustrate differences... Pre-2002 version (note tube runs at top of wheelboxes): Post-2002 version (just visible is the wheelbox 'upside down' and big bulge in the dash where the motor hides): 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retroanaconda Posted June 19, 2017 Share Posted June 19, 2017 I suspect your bulkhead has been modified to make it fit older models, but they have forgotten to make the necessary changes to the wiper mechanism. I would drill the dash brackets, properly treated and painted you will not get any rust problems there. If you use the later Td5 wheelboxes they will fit the oval holes in the bulkhead correctly (unless as part of its modifications they have been welded up and redrilled circular), but you will have to change the crank gear in the motor to retain the correct wiper sweep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmatt Posted June 19, 2017 Author Share Posted June 19, 2017 I think you might be right more head scratching in the am, will try and remember to take photos of whatever i do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retroanaconda Posted June 19, 2017 Share Posted June 19, 2017 Photos would be useful, it's not a subject that it seems there's a great deal of tech info easily accessible on. If I recall correctly need4speed had a similar issue and ended up drilling the brackets, he might be able to chime in to confirm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oneandtwo Posted June 19, 2017 Share Posted June 19, 2017 You need to fit both wheelboxes with the cable entry on the top. You then need to drill a hole through the central bracket for the wiper rack tube to pass through otherwise the wiper rack tube does not run straight - even the slightest kink or bend on the wiper tube puts excess drag on the rack. you are also going to need to modify that central bracket as it interferes with the metal plate - the td5 one screws directly to that bracket through a plastic nutlock whereas the 300tdi plate is attached with one or two self tappers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmatt Posted September 3, 2017 Author Share Posted September 3, 2017 Sorry guys to resurect this thread but i am still having issues! I fitted td5 wiper boxes and drilled the dash support bracket to take the drive tube between the boxes. I fitted my 300tdi wiper motor and drive cable i looked at it and it all seemed to mesh and work correctly. I finished building the truck and have been out today on shakedown and have wiper issues, When i activate wipers they go from tye park position to just past 90 degrees vertical they don't go as far as they should, any body have any ideas? My thoughts are 1) is there something i can alter in the motor to push them further? 2) is it a problem with wheel box internals? Could i fit the internals out my old wheel boxes in the td5 oval casings? 3) is it possible to fit a td5 rack and motor in the original 300tdi position? We have ended up refitting the original 300tdi dash back in the truck. Any help very much appreciated Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retroanaconda Posted September 3, 2017 Share Posted September 3, 2017 The drive gears in the motors are different too if I recall correctly. To get the right sweep you'll need to match a Td5 drive gear to the Td5 wheelboxes. You'll also need to be careful with the gear as usually a Td5 motor is set to start on a 'pull' stroke, the rack being on the bottom of the wheelbox gears, whereas a Tdi one starts off on a 'push'. Would be worth double checking before turning it on and something maybe stripping or snapping if it's wrong Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmatt Posted September 3, 2017 Author Share Posted September 3, 2017 27 minutes ago, Retroanaconda said: The drive gears in the motors are different too if I recall correctly. To get the right sweep you'll need to match a Td5 drive gear to the Td5 wheelboxes. You'll also need to be careful with the gear as usually a Td5 motor is set to start on a 'pull' stroke, the rack being on the bottom of the wheelbox gears, whereas a Tdi one starts off on a 'push'. Would be worth double checking before turning it on and something maybe stripping or snapping if it's wrong When you say match the drive gear? Does that mean fit a td5 motor? I cant see how i can do that as they are in a totally different place in a td5 that wouldn' t work with my dash board?. As a td5 motor couldn' t go where the 300 does as surely a td5 motor and wheel boxes need a td5 cable and that wouldnt be long enough? I am wondering if anything can be done to make the 300tdi wheel boxes fit better in later bulkhead Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted September 3, 2017 Share Posted September 3, 2017 You can get the wiper motor gear seperately, then swap it into your existing motor housing. drive cable is the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmatt Posted September 3, 2017 Author Share Posted September 3, 2017 Hi Ralph, I just wondered that as i have just found this page https://britishparts.co.uk/t/land-rover/defender/wiper-system?page=2 Presumably the two different cables are just different lengths? But if i can just fit the later gear it could be a easier/cheaper fix other than the having to dismantle the end of the dash board again! Lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retroanaconda Posted September 3, 2017 Share Posted September 3, 2017 Yes you should be able to swap the drive gear inside the motor housing. Td5 cable is slightly shorter due to position of the motor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmatt Posted September 3, 2017 Author Share Posted September 3, 2017 Thanks James and Ralph gear will be ordered tomorrow and hopefully the saga will soon be over! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supaimpy Posted September 3, 2017 Share Posted September 3, 2017 Just one other thing, when you change the gear over , move the wiper arms off the screen when you first try it , its easy to set it up 180 out and wipers will move down instead of up ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted September 3, 2017 Share Posted September 3, 2017 Ah, I assumed they drive cable was the same length. so good you found otherwise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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