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Tim2809

front brake upgrade?

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ive got a 1988 110csw. currently running solid discs and drum rear. 

ideally would like to goto vented as do alot of towing with long down hills where engine braking is not enough. 

what if any alternative vented brake calipers are a direct fit as dont really want to mess about changing axles. 

many thanks

tim

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They all fit.  There are only vented and non vented in one size.  All the calipers bolt straight on.  Simply change the calipers and discs or install spacers to the existing calipers.

Discs: LR017952 

Calipers: SEB500450 and SEB500460

Pads: SFP000260 

Pin kit: STC8575 

 

 

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Early 90s have smaller calipers as do discoverys/range rovers. From memory all the front discs are the same size and offset (rears varie). All rover axles have the same caliper mounting holes. My ibex has 110 calipers on a discovery axle that had vented discs on it.

Mike

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While the brake system is empty do yourself a favour & slot the brackets vertically on the hub that are at the solid pipe to flexible join (OK, maybe only if you are removing the hoses anyway). Then if you need to do a swivel say, you just need to loosen the nuts and lift the caliper and pipes out, without having to drain. Credit it for that suggestion to a member on here whose name escapes me but it's saved me some effort several times.

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or if your changing the brake flexi hoses, get a new set of hoses that fit direct to caliper with a banjo bolt & end fitting on the hoses, that gets rid of the short rigid pipe from swivel/caliper. 

 

I fitted vented front disc & matching calipers years ago, they were [are] ex 300tdi parts.

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And if the calipers haven't been removed recently a new set of caliper bolts is also a good investment. I have a feeling you'll need imperial bolts unless you have a later axle, I'm sure western would be able to confirm the correct part numbers.

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On 7/28/2018 at 10:50 AM, western said:

or if your changing the brake flxi hoses, get a new set of hoses that fit direct to caliper with a banjo boly & end fitting on the hoses, that gets rid of the short rigid pipe from swivel/caliper. 

 

I fitted vented front disc & matching calipers years ago, they were [are] ex 300tdi parts.

I would be concerned with this.  The reason for the short hard pipe is that it comes really close to the springs when you turn.

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depends where & how the banjo & flexi hoses is routed, plenty of people have done it.

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On 7/28/2018 at 5:10 PM, cackshifter said:

While the brake system is empty do yourself a favour & slot the brackets vertically on the hub that are at the solid pipe to flexible join (OK, maybe only if you are removing the hoses anyway). Then if you need to do a swivel say, you just need to loosen the nuts and lift the caliper and pipes out, without having to drain. Credit it for that suggestion to a member on here whose name escapes me but it's saved me some effort several times.

this! done this on my old offroader. makes it so easy to work on the hubs/shafts/bearings etc. 

i have also upgraded my front brakes from solid to vented. you can buy the kits on ebay with everything you need. i decided to go with IRB as ian done me a cracking deal with oem parts for not much more. 🖕

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Tread carefully with what parts you fit, I did this conversion to a 1990 110 the discs appear to be all the same and its true all the calipers will fit the mounting holes even if they are the smaller piston diameter early 90 size, however I can tell you from experience I brought a kit with spacers to convert the calipers, I then found the now wider calliper fouled the back of the hub and had to machine about 3mm off the rear of the hub on the lathe to allow the hub to rotate cleanly. Not sure if this was down to the kit I used, or if there is a diference in hub thickness on the early vs factory fit  vented disc 110s, or maybe the vented calipers have less material to allow clearence.

Another worth while "whilst its in bits anyhow upgrade" is Zuse Engineering stainless caliper pistons, expensive, easy to fit but I haven't had to change one since I got them, before every time I did pads I would have at least one piston with the chrome coming off trashing the seal.

good luck

Edited by Flash17

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On 8/6/2018 at 10:11 PM, Flash17 said:

Tread carefully with what parts you fit, I did this conversion to a 1990 110 the discs appear to be all the same and its true all the calipers will fit the mounting holes even if they are the smaller piston diameter early 90 size, however I can tell you from experience I brought a kit with spacers to convert the calipers, I then found the now wider calliper fouled the back of the hub and had to machine about 3mm off the rear of the hub on the lathe to allow the hub to rotate cleanly. Not sure if this was down to the kit I used, or if there is a diference in hub thickness on the early vs factory fit  vented disc 110s, or maybe the vented calipers have less material to allow clearence.

Another worth while "whilst its in bits anyhow upgrade" is Zuse Engineering stainless caliper pistons, expensive, easy to fit but I haven't had to change one since I got them, before every time I did pads I would have at least one piston with the chrome coming off trashing the seal.

good luck

This is correct, Ive just tried it on my 1986 110 and the hub fouls the caliper

20180926_095510.jpg

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Wouldn't fitting discs to the rear be more beneficial than changing the front solid discs to vented?

Can't recommend Zeus pistons enough.  They make a world of difference to braking performance and maintenance because they don't swell and seize in the calipers.

 

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i just fitted standard discs and pads on front. All pistons nice and clean and slid back in easy. 

I changed the front flexi hoses as perished and bled fluid. all nice and black to start with ( so donkeys years old). 

every now and then the pedal drops over half way, second pump its fine and will be fine for miles again. 

looks like im in for a master cylinder too 

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On 9/26/2018 at 1:48 PM, gilloverland said:

This is correct, Ive just tried it on my 1986 110 and the hub fouls the caliper

20180926_095510.jpg

Oh dear. I'd better check mine then :unsure: 

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9 hours ago, Snagger said:

Wouldn't fitting discs to the rear be more beneficial than changing the front solid discs to vented?

Worth remembering vented discs don't improve braking - they just slow down the onset brake fade, which I struggle to believe is a big issue for most people.

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2 hours ago, FridgeFreezer said:

Worth remembering vented discs don't improve braking - they just slow down the onset brake fade, which I struggle to believe is a big issue for most people.

You need to travel somewhere that has real hills!!  I was pretty worried about fade on this one.  Loaded up and with a trailer.

Capture.JPG

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13 hours ago, FridgeFreezer said:

Worth remembering vented discs don't improve braking - they just slow down the onset brake fade, which I struggle to believe is a big issue for most people.

Quite.  Going from drums to discs in theory shouldn't affect maximum braking either - a well maintained drum system should be capable of locking the wheels on dry tarmac, the maximum braking limit being a function of tyre grip.  But of course, discs keep cleaner than drums and cool faster, so braking reliability improves, just in the same way as vented discs improve reliability over solid discs by better cooling.  The problem with vented discs is clogging them with mud off road, giving balance problems but more seriously uneven cooling leading to warping or cracking.

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17 hours ago, Red90 said:

You need to travel somewhere that has real hills!!  I was pretty worried about fade on this one.  Loaded up and with a trailer.

Trollstigen not good enough eh?

I'm not calling BS, I'm just saying that 99% of people are fine with standard brakes unless they're driving like idiots or doing something exceptional like towing a heavy trailer down a mountain with (apparently) poor engine braking.

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im regularly  towing 3t but with the now intermittant loss of pedal its not being used. I was looking to upgrade as the landy is 30years old and things have improved so whilst apart was a sensible idea. 

have ruled out the 300 tdi pancake servo and master cylinder upgrade due to pipe work and the 110 has a pressure reducing valve and disc and i cant afford a disc salisbury axle. 

ive got the small servo so whilst i change the master cylinder will also fit the larger servo. 

looking at the landrover parts book the current master fits both servos so should be a straight swap. 

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Brake pedal needing a second bite could be a symptom of a wheel bearing being slightly out of adjustment.

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2 hours ago, FridgeFreezer said:

...with (apparently) poor engine braking.

I could certainly drive in a low enough gear to not use the brakes and that is what I do, but you end up holding up all of the other vehicles that have suitably sized brakes. It is one of those hills you need second for enough engine braking and it is a long trip in that gear.

Having brakes with extra cooling improves safety a lot.  When the brakes boil, you lose all brakes immediately and as the hand brake is not suitable for stopping the truck, you end up dying, which sucks.

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On 9/28/2018 at 5:04 PM, DaveSIIA said:

Brake pedal needing a second bite could be a symptom of a wheel bearing being slightly out of adjustment.

all checked and even over adjusted slightly to rule it out. it has also started when stationary , 1st press at a junction to hold. let up and re apply and pedal holds then suddenly drops slightly. it looks like master is stuffed. checked tonight and the new brake fluid has some small black bits floating around. 

have now fitted a brand new trw master cylinder and has stopped loss of brakes but they are still not great have done nearly 800 miles so hope pads are bedded in. 

do calipers go bad? all pistons went back in and were not corroded. have pressure bled all the way around and used over 2 ltrs to make sure so nonair in system. servo is working too

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As the brakes work but not as well as you hope for, maybe just check how much vacuum the servo is getting - pumps can gradually deteriorate and though you get some help the eagerness is gone. Or maybe there is a small leak.

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9 hours ago, cackshifter said:

As the brakes work but not as well as you hope for, maybe just check how much vacuum the servo is getting - pumps can gradually deteriorate and though you get some help the eagerness is gone. Or maybe there is a small leak.

have checked the vac pump as its a 300tdi engine. pedal sinks as it should with engine running and if i rapidly pump the pedal the vac pump keeps up with me pressing the pedal. 

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