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Thoughts and musings on the new defender

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2020 Land Rover Defender 110 D240 S - Offroad-Test | autofilou

 

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On 6/22/2020 at 1:03 PM, Chicken Drumstick said:

Wrangler still looks like a Wrangler though. As does a G-Wagen, still look like past models. And to be fair to the Defender, while it might not have undergone radical sheet metal changes. Its face and styling did change over the years as a constant evolution.

If you look at the Range Rover or Discovery they've had fairly regular facelifts and I'd say although they have changed a hell of a lot they are as recognisable as the new Defender is to the old one. You might not like how much LR changed those models over time but I'd say the Defender is in line with the rest, it's just that it's got there in one big jump.

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5 minutes ago, FridgeFreezer said:

If you look at the Range Rover or Discovery they've had fairly regular facelifts and I'd say although they have changed a hell of a lot they are as recognisable as the new Defender is to the old one. You might not like how much LR changed those models over time but I'd say the Defender is in line with the rest, it's just that it's got there in one big jump.

Personally I'm not really a fan of the current JLR styling ethos at all. They have completely ruined the Jags. I don't get the obsession with wanting to make all of your models look basically the same, just different sizes.

As for the RR. It looked good up to and including the L322. The current model has carried some lineage over, so it does at least resemble a Range Rover. But the need to make all the models look the same has heavily diluted this. Which is why when you have one coming towards you on a dual carriage way, it could be one of at least five different models until it gets close enough to really ID it. And even from 20 feet away it is still hard sometimes, you have to be a real anorak to tell them apart.

The Defender. I hear you, but I just cannot agree. To get to the current model from the old would have required a major departure somewhere along the line. Even with facelifts....

A 1948 80" is clearly visually related to a 2016 Defender 90. You can see the DNA in both, despite the numbers of decades between.

This new Pretender just is a completely different model and looks it too.

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4 hours ago, FridgeFreezer said:

If you look at the Range Rover or Discovery they've had fairly regular facelifts and I'd say although they have changed a hell of a lot they are as recognisable as the new Defender is to the old one. You might not like how much LR changed those models over time but I'd say the Defender is in line with the rest, it's just that it's got there in one big jump.

The new Defender is not a facelift, nor would it ever have got here via a series of facelifts.  It's a completely different concept to the old Defender and its predecessors.  It's not even just the unfortunate move to an aluminium monocoque.  It's the outcome of a decision to abandon a modular vehicle (which could be a flat deck, pickup, crewcab, van, station wagon, hard top, soft top or whatever the customer needed), to replace all that with something functionally interchangeable with a Discovery or Range Rover.  

What it actually looks like is not that relevant.  In fact, it's a good thing it looks nothing like the previous Defender because that reduces the illusion that it is actually a replacement for it!

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https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&f=140&t=1833444

This link will take you to a picture of the Land rover One-Double-One, a design from 1966, which, had funds been available (the development of the Range Rover took precedence), would have become the Series 3..........

Throughout Land rovers history there have been several projects and proposals that didn't happen due either to lack of money or some other circumstance. Had some of these come to fruition it is quite possible that Defenders might have had independent suspension, air suspension and/or monocoque bodies much sooner. Land Rover were looking to build vehicles with shared platforms in  the late 80's and this led to the Challenger project in 1990. What the new Defender has become has been bubbling away under the surface at Land rover for at least the last 40 years ( so it's not all Gerry's fault...Mo:P), it's just the money has never been there. But this time it was, and here is the result. 

Jon.

 

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Thanks Jon, I blame Gerry because he had a mullet. I'm not being unreasonable, surely 🤣

Anyway, I saw my first new "Defender" this morning, looked like a novelty biscuit tin.

Might be a nice car but that's it. I wouldn't trust LRs reliability record though.

SEAT dealers rang today to convince me to change my SEAT early. 2 new Ibizas over 4 years and not a single problem. I'll get another one of those, thanks.

Mo

 

 

 

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Posted (edited)

Ah yes, forgot about the mullet...hard to take anyone seriously with such a hair-do.

Forgot to mention, for those that might be interested.....when the new Defender was doing the rounds last year, pre-launch preview at the dealerships, I went to see it in Ipswich. The good folk from Britcar where there and the question was asked...."Will there be a pick-up version?" and the man from Land Rover...said yes. He also said something else that was quite interesting about it, but for the life of me I can't remember what it was.

And finally I omitted  to reference the info in my previous post... Land Rover, The first 65 years. By James Taylor. A very enlightening read. 

Jon. 

Edited by JonR
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so some random thoughts having driven the new defender all on road for couple thousand miles and i guess couple hundred in a 19 plate evoque

 

the evoque is god awful, sits too low on motorway and is seriously too complex on the touch screen - who needs so many options on a seat alone i wonder...

have to say liked the heads up display of speed, only cause the dash is too small and obscured by steering wheel.

adaptive cruise control is weird but actually really nice to use.

revs too long in each gear.

boot space sucks too small

no fridge cubby box, and split lid so fiddly

 

new defender is definetly a big car - lil too big and long in front for town junctions

i hate the roof rack

box on side is stupid, obscures drivers side mirror

no cooled seats but ac is great

fridge cubby box is great

boot space is nice

 

so would i have defender or evoque -    defender for sure but i want to test off road and with a good heavy trailer but not allowed sadly.

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Hasn't Naks driven one ? He seems to be a huge fan, so I'm sure he will have driven one, probably several.

Mo

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7 hours ago, Mo Murphy said:

Hasn't Naks driven one ? He seems to be a huge fan, so I'm sure he will have driven one, probably several.

Mo

 

Unfortunately not, they haven't arrived in ZA yet. Dealer is having a launch of sorts next week or the week after, will test drive one then. 

Not that the Mrs will let me have one 😐

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Not that I could ever afford one in any case, but to me, it just looks like all the other SUVs out there, But lets be honest, its not really a utility vehicle at all. It could never be used as such, except maybe by those who have money falling out of their bottoms, in which case it wouldnt matter it it was damaged. If it IS damaged, its basically ruined, and the value of it will be kicked into touch, which would never have been a big problem with an old Defender.

Can you imagine when trading it in, or the lease is up, some geezer looking down the sides of it in the light checking for any ripples or blemishes, and how it would be marked down, and your charges escalating !

No, to me, its just a car now, just like all the others, its probably very nice to drive, but full of ultimately problematical JLR electronics. Faceless, no character, nothing to warrant a second glance.  Despite the fact it may be better off road in certain situations that the proper Defender, but would you actually use it for that if you were footing the bills ? Well would you ?

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2 minutes ago, smallfry said:

.... Despite the fact it may be better off road in certain situations that the proper Defender, but would you actually use it for that if you were footing the bills ? Well would you ?

Yes, yes I would.

The same way I use my RRS off-road. And the same way I used my previous D4 off-road.

In case you don't think it's possible, have a look here: 

 

 

Of course, you can't bang them around a trail as you would a Defender, so you just have to pick your lines carefully and have a spotter handy.

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Already started the mods... 2" lift...

 

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Getting pretty extreme too...

 

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33" and barely in the arches.

...and the age old problem of the axle walking forward doesn't seem fixed, unless it is an effect of the photo?

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I think I just got a bit of sick in my mouth 🤮

Mo

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We should move this topic into the "New 2020 Mk2, Defender" sub forum now... its official 😁

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Also, is that a stock colour? Bleh...

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12 minutes ago, Maverik said:

We should move this topic into the "New 2020 Mk2, Defender" sub forum now... its official 😁

"New 2020 Mk2, Defender" sub forum  --- Doesn't exist, I'm not sure if I can create a new sub forum within the existing Defender forum. 

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Saw two "Defenders" today. One outside a dealership and one on lane 3 of the M4 doing a steady 85. It struck me that those are the two locations those vehicles will be seen most commonly (though in the service department car park, not out the front as this one was).

The one on the motorway was white, had garish alloys but no sign of the box. I cannot stress how massive it looks. It has the dimensions of a full size US truck but the proportions of a Skoda Yeti. I don't if who this thing is meant to appeal to, it doesn't look he least bit off-roady and yet it is huge. That is not helped by the double rear lights as it looks like they decided it wasn't wide enough and tacked on another vehicle's sides and lights...

I saw a Discovery 4 behind it and two Defenders coming the other way within a few minutes and they looked in no way related to this new car. The styling is so inoffensive and bland that it goes full circle and becomes offensive again.

I really wanted to like it.

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the side box & side mounted ladder are options, so they will only be on the vehicle if the new owner has specced them. both IMHO look awlful.

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3 hours ago, western said:

"New 2020 Mk2, Defender" sub forum  --- Doesn't exist, I'm not sure if I can create a new sub forum within the existing Defender forum. 

Duly raised for discussion in A&M.

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