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Jamie_grieve

Thoughts and musings on the new defender

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That's been my experience of my other half's penchant for Seat Ibizas - they are small petrols which with modern engine management feel very nippy around town - but get on the motorway and put your foot down and the facade slips somewhat, and the MPG drops surprisingly low.

A bigger engine, petrol or diesel, is happier and can be more economical pulling you along at 70mph but will drink more idling in traffic.

That said, MPG figures have been the stuff of fantasy for decades now - claimed 80mpg is more like 55mpg in normal driving (coughVOLKSWAGENcough :glare:) yet people pay more for better lies on the spec sheet imagining they'll save it all back over the lifetime of the car... wonder how many really do?

 

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The one I was genuinely surprised at was a 2.0 Ingenium powered Jag XF we hired to travel to Scotland for my grandfather's funeral in Inverness. We didn't hang around on the drive up and by the time we got to Perth it was showing that we could make it to the estate but not much further, the nearest petrol station is a 30 minute drive at national speed limits. We passed a cheap station so opted to fill up and my sister got back in the car shocked. From South Kensington to Perth it had averaged 65mpg and only took £30 worth of diesel into the tank which was well under half full. We took it for a few blasts around the Scottish Highlands (being a hire car it wasn't a slouch) and when I returned it to Avis it had still averaged 65+mpg.

What was funny was the hire company chap asked what I thought of it as we went out to handover and I said in all honesty it was nice but the only thing better than my daily drive at the time was the fuel economy but I didn't really care about that. He looked a bit crestfallen since this we'd picked up the car with 800 miles on the clock so was brand spanking new, meekly he asked what I drove and I replied a 3.6l TDV8 Range Rover, the sound system, sat nav, comfort and road noise was better in the RR but then again it's list price was north of £80k. He seemed a little happier after that, I neglected to mention I'd paid a fraction of that second hand.

Does make me question why people bother with all these eco-motion eco-boxes when realistically a nice comfortable Jaaaag will in the real world do basically the same mpg and in waay more comfort and you can have a bit more fun to boot. But then again - if I went for a Jaaaag I doubt I'd buy the 2l diesel :ph34r:.

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With fuel economy like that in the Jag, could the new Defender actually be a bit frugal?  It's going to be interesting to see what real-world economy turns out like.  The factory claims aren't outrageous though - around 30 m.p.g. like pretty much every LR diesel ever made...

 

Edited by deep
brain faze

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Biggest benefit the Jag has is aerodynamics

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Defender still has iffy aerodynamics though, so fuel economy isn't going to be as great as the jag.

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Lr don't seem to lie to much about mpg so there's a good chance it will see 30mpg. That said your doing well to get 30mpg out of a td5.

Mike

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4 hours ago, miketomcat said:

Lr don't seem to lie to much about mpg so there's a good chance it will see 30mpg.

When I bought my Jaaaaag, the competition (VAG,Volvo, Merc, BMW) were claiming 70+ MPG from their diesels and managing maybe 50-55mpg in the real world, the Jag claimed 45mpg and gets 45mpg pretty much no matter how I drive it - plus it was cheaper to buy because people all want the ones that claim 70mpg :rolleyes:

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Could we try turning the topic of conversation back to the new defender please?  Interesting as people's urban commutes are, they surely have zero relevance to the new defender as nobody in their right mind would buy one for that. Would they?

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11 minutes ago, Jamie_grieve said:

Could we try turning the topic of conversation back to the new defender please?  Interesting as people's urban commutes are, they surely have zero relevance to the new defender as nobody in their right mind would buy one for that. Would they?

There is nothing to talk about, we've seen the pictures, you can't buy one or drive one, we're just filling in the gaps until something happens :lol:

The mpg is down to the aerodynamics of the car and the efficiency of the drive train. They are going for loads of gears and automatic to try keep the engine at it's most economical point. I find it doesn't make a huge difference in the real world if you go for the tiny engine or big engine as it takes the same energy to push a given lump down the road so it's really down to how efficiently each engine can convert petrol to kilowatts output.

That said my wife was mightily disappointed when her new car claimed 55mpg and she's getting 37. Perhaps the driver is the most important thing, going from 125bhp to 230bhp perhaps wasn't the best move for mpg, although she gets home from work faster :lol:

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53 minutes ago, Jamie_grieve said:

Could we try turning the topic of conversation back to the new defender please?  Interesting as people's urban commutes are, they surely have zero relevance to the new defender as nobody in their right mind would buy one for that. Would they?

I think Cynic-al sums it up,. Furthermore, with regard to the last bit of your comment, the ONLY people who have spoken to me about actually buying one are people who want something to show off ON their urban commute!! So well done LR, you have made another nice Chelsea Tractor....

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Finally, we've been allowed an off-topic part of the forum 😛 

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1 hour ago, Bowie69 said:

Finally, we've been allowed an off-topic part of the forum 😛 

I live in hope that our favourite grumpy old git will unleash the wrath of a moderator and soundly chastise the urban wronguns and send them over to the discovery forum :D.

 

 

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2 hours ago, Cynic-al said:

The mpg is down to the aerodynamics of the car and the efficiency of the drive train. They are going for loads of gears and automatic to try keep the engine at it's most economical point. I find it doesn't make a huge difference in the real world if you go for the tiny engine or big engine as it takes the same energy to push a given lump down the road so it's really down to how efficiently each engine can convert petrol to kilowatts output.

I agree that is exactly what has happened. Unfortunately putting efficiency so far ahead of capability combined with a desire to appease pedestrian safety to the point of making something entirely unfit for purpose, market forces, the cash constraints of using existing platforms and designers so far removed from the world that defenders previously occupied before they were lifestyle accessories has resulted in a vehicle that certainly ticks a few boxes but is in no way an icon or spiritual successor to the original.

 

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8 hours ago, Jamie_grieve said:

Could we try turning the topic of conversation back to the new defender please?  Interesting as people's urban commutes are, they surely have zero relevance to the new defender as nobody in their right mind would buy one for that. Would they?

Who has said their commute is urban? Fair enough - but given the target market for the new Defender it's still a pretty relevant discussion!

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6 hours ago, Jamie_grieve said:

I live in hope that our favourite grumpy old git will unleash the wrath of a moderator and soundly chastise the urban wronguns and send them over to the discovery forum :D.

 

 

You mean me? Nah, feast your eyes on some fluffy kittens instead 😁

Kittens.jpg.816530c9550ef3b963f6ccc7563766a2.jpgKittens01.jpg.5dc8d667563bfdfe74d8b46ce9400a13.jpg

 

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:hysterical:

I suspect those kittens are more fit for purpose than the pretender will ever be , and will probably live longer .........

You are so bad Steve :)

Steve b

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11 hours ago, Happyoldgit said:

You mean me? Nah, feast your eyes on some fluffy kittens instead 😁

We've finally broken him...fetch the dried frog pills, quickly!

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On 2/4/2020 at 9:50 PM, steve b said:

:hysterical:

I suspect those kittens will probably live longer .........

 

Steve b

Definitely will if Barker gets some preservative on them....

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Well it looks better than my car at the moment 😖

Silver van hit something slippery in the toad and ended up in the field. White van hit it and came onto my side of the road. I went onto the grass to try avoid it but it hit my front quarter, went all down the side and did the rear quarter. Everyone was alright so 🤷‍♂️

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20200206_173108.thumb.jpg.75c16bf3ade2f23e49f3664f9c2d6329.jpg

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As long as nobody is hurt - it is just metal and aggravation...

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So mine went off for repair, I went to enterprise to collect my like for like hire car. "Here is a brand new ford focus sir, your the first to hire it!" "That's like for like with a double cab pickup is it?" "Well it's all we have. Ok I will take it." Noticed a draft around my neck, rear window was a little open. Pushed the button to close it, went up then half way down. Must be some sort of incorrectly set anti trap feature but I didnt want to drive around in a car with both rear windows open so took it back. The only other vehicle was a 9 seater vito minibus, I accepted figuring i could do a few airport runs or something, they quickly washed it and off i went. 10 miles down the road got the warning message "oil level too high". Tomorrows job to sort that. I need to start charging by the hour, I've done pretty much nothing else for 2 days. Stupid accident :(

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Nice to see the back tyre aired down a little and interesting to see the rear locker is triggered by a spinning front wheel.  Surely it can't be popping in and out as quickly as the brakes come on and off though?  I'd love to see one in real action - I'll pick the track though!

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Take a look at Richard Agnew (@theragers): https://twitter.com/theragers

He just got a Defender and is already taking it on a trip, posting photos of fill-up, packing space, etc.

He does work for LR though, so don't expect him to say anything overtly bad.

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