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demonwolf444

What's it worth? 200tdi 90

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Two years ago I bought my defender 90, i had always wanted one. At the time (the height of the price silliness) I paid 3K for a bit of a rust bucket; to put in perspective a similar vehicle could probably be picked up for a bit less than 2k now. 

I chose this particular rust bucket because it was the most honest I could afford; no body filler hiding holes. The joke is after everything I have done it doesn't look that much different, it's quite a different machine to what it was 

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Technical specs are - 

1991 200tdi with around 190k on the clock. 

Full service history from day dot think I'm the fourth owner ? 

The only faults with it that I can think of is; county back windows are siliconed up. Doors realistically need replacing though for me  I'll get another 5 years out of them, rear axle needs replacing (have a good replacement to fit this summer ) and it could do with a paint job. 

Engine and gearboxes sound good and pull well. Don't think it really needs it but have a set of new injector nozzles to put in it drives really well, will do indicated 80 on the motorway flat out (just!) but will power up to 70 nicely and sit there 

The whole rebuilt on to a galv chassis, with new dampers suspension, second hand radius arms and new trailing arms. New calipers and discs fitted on the front. 

Has a disco rear axle I'll fit this summer, from axle is in really good nick. 

Slick shift fitted to gear stick.

electic windows fitted

alarm locks and unlock some on the button

spare wheel carrier fitted 

mud dash fitted with double din, reverse camera, rear wash wipe, and switch's for heated seats and electic windows 

rock slider type side steps fitted. 

LED's all round (wipac) 

Heated seats fitted 

home made dog guard fitted, 

back fully soundproofed (front to be done) covered with sound deadening material with black anthracite carpet over the top. 

Wheel bearings recently checked and replaced all round, with all the seals 

two fold and tilt forward facing seats and belts inclusive for the rear (not fitted ) 

4 all terrrain tyres that have seen little use. Spare wheel is a different tread but on the same rims. 

Low box working - video here of her running With the diff locked pulling a fallen tree off the lane up a 1 in 5 hill (sorry for the shrieking I've never asked my girlfriend to film anything again )

Minor bodywork repairs made (bulk head and door pillars. You could do further work to make it perfect but it's perfectly serviceable and motable now but would benefit from paint. 

Everything works that should work, from the heaters to the courtesy lights. 

cooling system recently flushed through new water pump fitted, new radiator, and new intercooler. 

I've got well over 15k ( original purchase 3k, first load of parts £1k rebuild on galv chassis 8k plus extra parts easily another 2k ) tied up in this unfortunately I probably have the reciepts to prove it  I'd love someone to give me for it but I don't think they will, I was done over a little bit on the chassis rebuild ) I think if you wanted to make it A1 perfect then you would want to get a galv bulkhead and some nice doors; everything else would probably paint / polish/ repair up 

anyway it's a 26 year old Landy... it's not the finest example but I would rather have mine than an unknown vehicle... . what's it worth? 

Truth be told the damn thing nearly bankrupt me and my business, i spent my life savings bringing it back from the scrap heap and now I just don't have the last bit it would need to make it perfect. Everyone told me it would be a disaster and a bad idea; on the contrary it's been so much fun; I just could save a huge amount by not having it. Second from that my income Is not large and such a fuel thirsty car, with expensive insurance (age 23) and tax just isn't smart thinking. As much as I love it we have other Landy's at home to play with and I suppose my options are to sorn it and buy a cheap run around. or sell it and buy a cheap run around. Being a fool I'm tempted to do the former. It really just depends how much it's worth, you just cant tell some stupid kids and I've full well been a stupid kid. So what's my folly worth? Owt? Or just a lesson well learned? 

your thoughts and abuse appreciated gentlemen 

James 

 

 

 

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Posted (edited)

£2,000.....seriously?

You say it’s on a galvanised chassis? 

I would put the value at £6,000, more on a good day.

You can’t get one with an MOT for under £5,000 round here. Show me the “similar ones at £2,000” and l’ll hire a flatbed and buy them all.

Edited by Lightning

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As above, the only £2K ones round here have almost no MOT and a chassis made of lace.

 

£6K easy with the galv chassis and the fact it is fairly original.

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Oh, and it isn't a rust bucket with a new chassis!

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As above. I think the best way to get a good a realistic idea of what to ask for in terms of money is to do your homework thorougherly. Research what similar vehicles are selling for on popular market places like ebay, autotrader, Land Rover magazines etc. Why are some selling for <£2,000 (wrecked chassis/bulkhead, long list of major work to do for MOT) but others go for much more (rebuilt engine, galv chassis, smart interior, new tyres, long MOT....)? 

As an example, good tyres with plenty of life are often overlooked by buyers and sellers in my experience; replacing all 4 tyres with ones worth having is not cheap. When you are clear in your mind of what your competition is and how much they are asking, you are then in a strong place to deal with buyers who just want to come and haggle with you for a lower price.

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Thanks for your thoughts keep them coming! 

I put it at 6-8 realistically on a good day it's worth more to me because it's "known"

when bought I paid 3k near enough, rotten chassis, door pillar, foot well, tyres near enough bald. Having never seen it accepting that anything in that price range would have been junk. 

Put a new rear x member on and out rigger, foot wells, made some bulkhead repairs, door pillar, new back door (2nd hand but a good one - no rust) repaired every kind of fault electrical fault, reinforced the doors, new loom for the rear end, Led's all round, 

then had a wicked blow out on the old tyres, so replaced them all round 

sudsequently failed it's MOT, had it rebuilt on a new chassis, basically everything underneath that counts is new other than the axles which are fine but the rear needs doing in time which I have, 

creature comforts, heated seats, electric windows, recovered the headliner with black anthracite, sound proofing all over  carpeted back out and fitted the stainless front and rear door step trim bits new seals all round. 

In some ways it's a really good thing because t hasn't been messed about with irretrievably. The downside is I think if you wanted to make it A1 perfect you would want 5k to throw at it (as said doors, bulkhead renewed or repaired and galv dipped) 

its been quite an adventure getting it to the stage it's in and generally the spending behind has been "if it looks 26 years old and knackered (e.g. Radiator ) then it gets replaced. 

the bare bones of it are quite good, the doors annoy me but it's just not worth replacing them 

it now has a summer MOT date which is a bit more friendly than the January one (who wants to be under a car in snow - not me I did it; not fun) and when it was rebuilt it passed MOT with no advisories, I can't see why the next one won't be the same save possibly seat belts wear. Since then it has been serviced regularly and runs as good as anyone could want. When buying it my thought were if it's not been messed with and I can see what's wrong at least I can put it right. At the time I looked at many which were stitched together with body filler and weld and drippings oil while they sat for 5-7k which is why I thought I would rather have something genuine if a bit knackered than a pig in lipstick 

By the 2k remark I mean I could buy one in a similar state to this was when I bought it for that money now; admitting it would still need lots of work to get it to this point! 

After having to pay someone 8k for the rebuild ( agreed 4... verbally but then nearly everything had to be cut off hence new suspension and trailing arms and such) I already had a month off work to tinker with it and couldn't afford to take any more time off ) I saw one on a galv chassis being sold for 6k and realised I was a long way off recovering my costs in any way! 

Thanks for your advice one and all keep it coming; I will do more reasearch im continually undecided on whether or not to sell.

 

 

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Keep it.

You won’t get another like that for the money it will likely sell for.

The thing is, you fixed the major issues and you know the Landy so are aware of what else is needed.

At the moment you won’t get back what you have paid out. But if you keep it, and sort the bodywork, it will only go up in value.

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Yes, keep it if you can, you clearly are very attached to it and will never get another like it or better.

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keep it, soon as it's sold you will wish you kept it.

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Defenders are very cheap cars to run if you can do the servicing & repair work yourself. Any other car will suffer massive depreciation which needs to be factored into the cost. A Defender kept in good order will not really depreciate for the foreseeable future, or so it would seem.

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Posted (edited)

As above, don’t sell unless you absolutely have to.

Think about it, say you sold it for £7,000 and bought a used car. After five years the car would be practically worthless, unless you are lucky and buy something collectible.

Where your Landy after five years will likely be worth.....£7,000, more if you’ve improved it.

A galvanised chassis always adds a fair bit to the value as it addresses the major worry on old Land Rovers, chassis corrosion.

l think the silly prices being paid (or asked) for newer ones will come back down to earth , but you’ll always get over £5,000 for a nice Defender TDi/TD5.

 

Edited by Lightning

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Posted (edited)

Expecting to get back the money you have sunk in almost any used car is delusional, it just does not happen, especially if you pay for labour. I have only made a significant profit on one car I bought, fixed and sold - a Ferrari 308GTB and Enzo Ferrari died just as I took it to market!

My 110 was £3.5k to buy, £10k+ to rebuild and I have just sunk £4.5k into an engine/head/injector pump/injectors rebuild. it is still far from perfect, (but the 180,000 miles I've done since the rebuild don't help!) 8 years after a heavy rebuild with galvanised chassis, I now need 4 doors, a bulkhead and a quality paint job. (My wife has requested sound proofing and heated seats as well). What's it worth? God knows, but I'm not selling.

As for your 90, I'd expect it to be worth around £6-7k, as that is the sort of money you will need to pay for a vehicle in similar condition. The problem with selling it is that replacing it will be a piggin' nightmare! There are a lot of tarted up, over priced dogs and some very, very optimistic owners out there.

Before my ex-Ebay 110, I had a Vauxhall Vectra Estate from new, (1998). It was £17,500 to buy and was essentially worthless in 2006 after 110,000 miles. Compared to that, I see my 110 as a bargain; it's more versatile, better looking, worth more, easier to work on, has a social scene and good parts availability. 

 

Edited by jeremy996
spieling

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I think realistically I'll keep it, finances are irretrievable 

reality is it's known and it's been a bloody good truck, will tow anything I am attached to it; I grew up helping dad on his series landys, the defender was always the dark side 

the problem I have is that I may have to do more of a commute to work in the future (currently work from home) and it would cost me 1/3rd what I earn In a week to run it. Currently I go nowhere and generally put £30 a week in, I can easily see that tripling. Tax and insurance is £1000 a year essentially. 

Looking at running on veg oil...which I'm not a huge fan of but it is cheap? I live in the middle of nowhere, no fuel stations close by, thinking of getting a big tank and at least being able to fuel it with something from home. Major fears  of gummed up injectors fuel pumps and such 

Or just buying a cheap run around, but paying tax and insurance on a cheap little car as well as the defender makes my motoring only more expensive, maybe I'll sorn it turn a shed into a spray booth and repaint panel by panel.

i don't know, the fact is running the Landy costs me around 3k a year before I start buying radiators and water pumps and doors which adds up to quite a lot of cheap bangers. Before the Landy I had what amounts to a fleet of fiat puntos and a Renault Clio, they would go forever on no fuel and all the cars I have had combined don't add up to the cost of running the Landy for 1 year.

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23 hours ago, demonwolf444 said:

sorry for the shrieking I've never asked my girlfriend to film anything again

😂😂😂😂

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A land rover is not expensive to run, honestly.

25-30mpg is easily achievable with a TDI, and parts are peanuts, in general.

The throwaway euro boxes are great, and very cheap, but the moment something goes badly wrong it is get rid and buy another - this is where the other cost comes in, you have to buy to replace. Parts for these things are NOT cheap, especially if french/jap, with the former going wrong a lot more than the latter.

I hear you about the increased mileage, but I guess that is a bigger question about job location. I put almost that in my car a week and also work from home...

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If it's good enough and you know you want a Defender in the future then keep it. They aren't making any more! Particularly from that era.

And they're disppearing all the time (see below for an example). There's not many good, old ones on eBay, but tons of Pumas. Even if they're being SORNed, rather than scrapped, it still means they're unlikely to be on the market.

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https://www.howmanyleft.co.uk/vehicle/land_rover_110_defender_county_sw_tdi

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At the moment new oil, (GM Soya, Costco), is about 80p a litre, with filtered used oil a little more. I've done 180,000+ on it with a two tank setup. The HMRC rules can be a little complex with a 2500l per annum exemption on used oil, but road fuel duty due on new oil used as fuel.

I don't spend £3k a year on mine with professional servicing and three services a year, so I guess you were bringing the vehicle up to a usable state. I would not describe a Defender as cheap to run, but neither is it ruinous, (especially when compared to a tired D3 or RRS).

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Posted (edited)

Running costs decrease over time, as the main jobs get done and your spending becomes routine maintenance and repairs.

lt will never be as cheap to run as a VW Polo (although if you factor in depreciation, it can actually be cheaper over a longer period of time)

When l got my 2005 110 l was initially spending well over £2,000 a year, not including fuel/tax/insurance.

But now after four years it’s gone down to £500-1,000.

But my Landy is worth about £2,000 more than l paid for it, and if l had bought a new van instead (it was a choice between new VW Caddy or a 8-10 year old Defender) l would be around £10,000 worse off!!

Edited by Lightning
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