White smoke - 300TDi

[Peaklander]

Thanks guys. New pressure switch in place and at least it shows no pressure. Let’s hope it changes state with oil pressure.  Also I removed the filter and filled that with oil. It was a bit daft not to. Anyway I don’t want to go for a first drive into the darkness so will wait till the morning.   

[cackshifter]

Suspense is killing. But those switches die for a pastime.

[western]

Will be good to know the 110 is alive again 

[Peaklander]

It is alive 😀

I have just done a nice and varied 30 mile trip up hill and down dale (in beautiful weather - blue skies above the mists). I chose some reasonable hills and there have been plenty of gear changes so hopefully a good bit of variable engine speed.

On initial cranking with the solenoid disconnected, the oil pressure didn't rise enough to switch the warning lamp off. After four decent cranks and the lamp still on, I re-connected and cranked one more time to fill the injector pipes. I had thought that I'd see diesel spirting from the tops of the injectors but the pipes were sitting quite close and there was none, although there was diesel in the tops. So I nipped up the unions and at the next crank it fired in the first revolution. There was a bit of white smoke as I pulled away and then it was gone.

This afternoon I'll put some more miles on. It feels like a hooray moment.

[cackshifter]

Good to hear it lives again. It must feel better after all that TLC.

[western]

Excellent & you have the satisfaction of knowing its done to your liking 

[cackshifter]

It may use a bit of oil initially, but that should reduce with use. I'd just keep an eye on the level.

[monkie]

Great work, it has made me a little frustrated that I'm away with work whilst my 19J is sat at home in bits and I can't put it back together  for a few weeks 

[Peaklander]

Just completed a total of 101 miles today. It takes some time to do this around here as I chose all the little roads to ensure lots of gear changes and varying engine speeds. We’ve driven the length and breadth of the White Peak.

Everything seems good. There’s no  smoke and the engine feels and sounds fine. I haven’t been too harsh going up the hills and hope these few miles have been a good start.

I’m using Millers Running in oil supplied through Turner Engineering and they say change it in no more than 500 miles. I therefore need a couple more day trips!

Thank you to everyone for your help, advice and support in what has been a new experience in my vehicle repair and maintenance education. Also for the messages on here and WhatsApp. It’s been great to be directed to do it all correctly. 
 

Oh and @monkie I feel your pain. I’ve spent weeks away at a time for work and not being able to do anything else is very frustrating. 

Edited February 5, 2020 by Peaklander

[western]

I used Millers running oil as well after my 200tdi rebuild changed it after 250 miles, put in a good quality 15w40 with a new filter for 750 miles, then drained & filed with a semi synthetic 10w40 & Mahle filter, the exact oil brand is in my engine rebuild post. Oil now gets changed every 6000miles.

[Peaklander]

What advantages does the semi synthetic and 10W give Western? I’ve always thought that the 300TDi doesn’t benefit from anything modern. I change my oil and filter every 6,000 miles using the Smith and Allen SHPD 15W-40. 

[western]

Probably not much over a normal mineral oil, but for me the engine feels good, revs easily, & sounds a bit quieter, LR don't recommend a full synth IIRC. but semi synth is OK. 

this what I use now, https://www.opieoils.co.uk/p-990-fuchs-titan-syn-mc-10w-40-high-performance-semi-synthetic-engine-oil.aspx from Opie Oils which is local & they can supply me Mahle filters as well.

[monkie]

Good recommendation Ralph, I just checked online and its available a little cheaper... 

 

[cackshifter]

The engine was designed when 15w/40 was the best commonly available. The 40 gives the viscosity (and it is this  determines the oil film thickness) at 100C, the 15w at 0C.  However if you look at the actual viscosity numbers you can see that even '5W' is still much thicker than '40'. The clearances are designed for when the engine is hot, ie the the '40'. Therefore, if you use 5w/40 or 10w/40 the viscosity at start will be nearer the warm viscosity, so the oil will get to pressure and be  pumped round sooner on a cold start. The eventual pressure may not be quite as much as cold 15w/40 but that doesn't matter as it'll be higher than when its warm anyway, and you don't need huge pressure; that's just a sign of the effort the pump is making to circulate it.  Your turbo in particular will like this, but it will reduce wear on  other things, oil pump etc as the pressure isn't as big when cold, but it gets to pressure sooner. So the 5w/40 or 10w/40 will help with cold starts and warming up. There's no reason you can't take advantage of oil improvements over the last couple of decades. We do a lot of short journeys; I use Millers 5w/40 EE but oil is like choice of underwear; everyone has their own ideas. 

 

[Peaklander]

Great advice there on oils. I have at least an engine-full of the 15W-40 in my 20litre drum. So need to decide if that is good enough or whether a lighter grade would be better now whilst we are still in winter (hardly winter this time around) and change it again later in the summer for the 15W in warmer weather, after our trip to Turkey, which is very much on the cards.

Today the Peaklanders spent more quality time together driving the lanes to the south of Buxton and we enjoyed a nice lunch in Longnor. The lanes are great and very quiet and as I was driving I didn't have to open any of the gates myself.

We have added another 70 miles or so and now are at about 190. Again it was mainly 1-3rd gear in hilly terrain so reasonable loading on the empty vehicle. I'll continue to add some more running-in miles before changing the oil and filter. During that time I have to decorate a room which will be a change from the garage.

 

[Ex Member]

The first number is its cold temperature viscosity rating. 10W is -25C, 15W is -20C and so on.  So all that matters is that you are not cold starting below the rating.

The second number is viscosity at running temperature (100 C).  Use a 40.

Always use a diesel engine specific oil.  They are designed to manage the soot.

Always change before the soot content gets to 0.5%.  The only way to know that is by oil analysis. A well tuned TDI should make 15000 km.  The smokyer you are the quicker it happens.

A synthetic is probably not much help unless you are going for the long change intervals or you need a wide viscosity range.

Edited February 7, 2020 by Red90

[Retroanaconda]

I’ve put hundreds of litres of oil through my Tdi - all of it bog standard 10W40 semi-synthetic stuff from the motor factors or agri suppliers. Usually bought in a 20l drum for about £40. Seems to have kept it running pretty nicely over the years.

Frequency of change is the most important thing as alluded to above. 6,000 miles is what I go by as per the service schedule. 

[smallfry]

Oil is a very complicated subject, and yet very simple at the same time. It does not matter how much it costs, or whether it is mineral, semi, or fully synthetic. What matters is that it meets the correct specification for the particular engine, and is changed at the correct intervals (or more often) for the usage and ambient temperatures.

There is generally nothing to be gained by using expensive race spec oils in an engine that does not require it, unless of course you believe the hype and like wasting money.

Using a modern spec low viscosity oils (C3 E5 E7 etc) can actually be detrimental to an engine of older design. Its all about clearances and tolerances, crankcase ventilation systems, cat converters, DPF, and so on.

I have always found that an engine sounds mechanically better after an oil change. I don't know if that is actual or psychological though

[Badger110]

This thread was as interesting as anything else I’ve read today 😀

 

well done Peaklander 👍

[Peaklander]

Thanks @Badger110. I’ve taken to bed with flu maybe but not got proper flu though, so no updates. 

[Badger110]

1 hour ago, Peaklander said:

Thanks @Badger110. I’ve taken to bed with flu maybe but not got proper flu though, so no updates. 

 

Let's hope it's not the ' you know who ' chinese variety...😲

 

Take it easy

[Peaklander]

I'm continuing this thread as we talked about oil pressure and viscosity earlier. After lots of works of various kinds on my vehicle since the start of lockdown, yesterday I drove it for the first time in weeks. It is only a few hundred miles into life with new piston rings, honed bores etc. I fitted a VDO oil pressure gauge and matching sensor and I did wonder if doing this would open-up a can of worms.

I picked the 0-5Bar VDO vision gauge, a Tee piece with 1/8" NPT threads at each end and M10 at the Tee. So the pressure switch came out, the Tee screwed in with the pressure switch moved to the other end and the VDO sensor went in on the Tee.

I moved my clock to the Mud console so that the gauge would be easier to read.

So to my experiences of the oil pressure and then a question. All looks ok at start-up and for the first 20-25 minutes of a drive. My water temperature gauge reaches the normal operating point after 10 minutes and then stays there - it aways does, whatever the work rate, height above sea level (max 2,400m) or the ambient temperature (low 40s C).

Watching the oil pressure, at cold start its about 3.5Bar so just under 50psi. This drops to around 2 Bar (28psi) once the engine is hot. However at some point after that, so by now I've been driving for 15-20 mins, it drops more to 1.5Bar when working, perhaps a tad more, and at idle it is 1 - 1.5. This idle pressure is a little low as the spec. is 1.8Bar (25psi). I'm more concerned about the fairly low pressure when operating though.

What do you think? Has the oil taken more time to warmup than the coolant? Am I seeing oil that is too hot and hence lower viscosity?

I could measure the oil temperature as I have an infra red camera attachment for my iPhone. Perhaps I could jump out and measure the pipe temperature at the oil cooler (bottom pipe?).

I knew fitting a gauge would throw-up questions. 😀

Edit: forgot to say that the oil I use is 15W-40 SHPD.

Edited July 21, 2020 by Peaklander

[Bowie69]

Yes, oil takes longer to get up to temperature, that is all you are seeing.

Pressure wise, the gauges are really only a guide, and will vary wildly depending on earthing, wire condition, alternator output voltage etc, so nitpicking over 0.2bar is never going to reveal anything useful imho.

If you want to do that, get a calibrated industrial gauge.

[Peaklander]

I'm sure you are correct. I did check the earth path with a meter at the bulkhead earth and the sender case. I know that isn't quite all of it but it eliminates the threads at the ports and the engine earth strap. I don't know why I didn't buy a two terminal sender; maybe it wasn't available in 1/8" NPT thread option.

I guess I'll get used to it and it should give me a little more warning of impending doom than just the low pressure switch.

[Bowie69]

Don't get me wrong, they are useful in that they allow you to see *change* in the oil pressure characteristics, which can only be a good thing.