Paul64 Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 I have read a few threads before on this subject. However, I do not need to replace my complete bulkhead. The off side post pillar, outer edge corner is rusting through. Rego had a look at it when he was over, and said before it gets worse will need cutting out, and a new section welded in. Apparently these can be bought off the shelf. Does anyone know the best place to get this from, and what the part number would be. Cheers, Paul. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiWhite Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 Don't know a part number but all the big mail order places will keep them. I paid about 12 each some time ago. When I fixed my bulkhead tops recently I found that the replacement panels were too big i.e I would have had to cut out a lot of metal to get them sitting flush with the rest of the bulkhead. Some people just slap them on and weld them so they sit proud but I thought they'd look poo If you have access to some basic metalworking gear (a grinder, a drill and a vice) I'd recommend getting a bit of 2 or 3mm plate and custom making the replacement panel as determined by the corossion on your wagon. There can also be a lot of rust on bits of the bulkhead that won't be covered by the panel. This pic of my repair shows that the corossion is very much more that two dimensional! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul64 Posted January 4, 2007 Author Share Posted January 4, 2007 Don't know a part number but all the big mail order places will keep them. I paid about 12 each some time ago.When I fixed my bulkhead tops recently I found that the replacement panels were too big i.e I would have had to cut out a lot of metal to get them sitting flush with the rest of the bulkhead. Some people just slap them on and weld them so they sit proud but I thought they'd look poo If you have access to some basic metalworking gear (a grinder, a drill and a vice) I'd recommend getting a bit of 2 or 3mm plate and custom making the replacement panel as determined by the corossion on your wagon. There can also be a lot of rust on bits of the bulkhead that won't be covered by the panel. This pic of my repair shows that the corossion is very much more that two dimensional! That is certainly a mess. Just out of interest, how old is the wagon in the picture? The obvious rust on mine is on the corner of the panel, being the first part of rust you see on your picture. I hope mine does not turn out to be as bad as that. I am over in the UK on Monday. I might just take it down to TJC Land rovers, Manor Farm, Weasenham, King's Lynn in Norfolk. Has anybody heard of them before? (www.tjclandrovers.co.uk) My parents sent an advert, more in the hope that I will take the LR to them rather than litter up their driveway Cheers, Paul. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewis Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 The bulkhead pillars were rotted out on the 90 when i bought it as a rolling chassis, and i mean completely gone - the hinge holes had disappeared, I was gonna replace the bulkhead but the repair sections are only ~£8 from paddocks so i thought i had may aswel give it a go. I taught myself to weld and got to it My advice - have a go - you've got little to lose. Try to get someone with metal folding facilities to make the repair sections for you as the paddock ones aren't really thick enough material, the holes dont line up (kinda important with doors ) and they dont really fit well without a fair bit of adapting - as Si has said they seem to be designed to cover the rot rather than replace it. If you just have some corrosion along the outer edge of the bulkhead pillars then small repairs in situ are probably the best bet, but if the corrosion has spread to the door seal lip and the footwell edge then you are probably best off removing the wings to do a proper job. Dont underestimate how far the rust has spread - cut out the rot before buying repair sections - or if you cant manage without the vehicle for a couple of days then order ALL the repair sections - they cost little and may save you from bodging it too much, you can always keep them in stock if you dont use them Remember - measure over and over again - its all too easy to have an elastic tape measure moment and end up with doors that dont fit - ask me how i know Lewis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul64 Posted January 15, 2007 Author Share Posted January 15, 2007 Here are some pics I took of the corrosion. Please can someone let me know what part I should be ordering (steel plate description) for the welding job? Cheers, Paul. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Humphreys Posted January 15, 2007 Share Posted January 15, 2007 Well looking at the pictures, you do not need repair pannels just some 2-3mm plate. Take the wing and door off, strip the down the bulk head move the dash a bit. Cut out the rust back to good metal then weld in new metal plate. Then paint. Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul64 Posted January 15, 2007 Author Share Posted January 15, 2007 Well looking at the pictures, you do not need repair pannels just some 2-3mm plate. Take the wing and door off, strip the down the bulk head move the dash a bit. Cut out the rust back to good metal then weld in new metal plate. Then paint.Paul Thats where it all goes wrong, as I can't weld and have no welding equipment. I am going to have to get it done by a garage, but I worry that they will just stick a plate over the top rather than look further and deeper. I'm just going to have to learn these things, and get a bit more equipment. Cheers, Paul. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
will_warne Posted January 15, 2007 Share Posted January 15, 2007 Paul, a word of warning. I found on my bulkhead that the outer corrosion wasn't too bad (not much differant to yours) but there was quite a lot more running along the top of the inside of the vent hole and to get at this its dash out time. External stuff is easy enough to deal with. As Si suggested, get an angle grinder with wire wheel and go arround the corroded area to assess the damage, then cut back a little further into a convenient shape and let in some new steel. As long as there isn't any problems in hard to reach places, Pail, then yours shouldn't take more than a couple of hours to sort the metalwork. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Humphreys Posted January 15, 2007 Share Posted January 15, 2007 To save some money find a mobile welder person. Then strip it down yourself. All the welder will have to do it cut out the rust and weld it up. Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul64 Posted January 15, 2007 Author Share Posted January 15, 2007 Thanks for the advice. I think the air vent is part of the problem as it leaks badly. I'm sure that water infiltration hasn't helped. Just to cheer me up, I took the LR down to the LR garage to get an assessment this afternoon. He said the metal work needs changing from the window to the bottom of the bulkhead. He said it would cost 700 euro! I asked how could he tell that without seeing the extent of the rust. It looks pretty superficial to me. There was a lot of coughing and twitching in response. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Humphreys Posted January 15, 2007 Share Posted January 15, 2007 The place to look for more rot is at the bottom of the door piller as water runns down inside if the piller. If its rotten then it will need the whole piller changing. Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B reg 90 Posted January 15, 2007 Share Posted January 15, 2007 Have you considered fitting a new bulkhead? When I was racking round the containers of salvaged parts at my local independant LR dealer I notice a new bulkhead. On enquiry they said that they were about £250 for a TD5 genuine bulkhead. I was supprised at how cheap this is, but as I don't need one I didn't follow it up any more (I was after a transfer box). However, yes it might be a pain to fit and need painting to fit your motor, but it will be totaly rust free. It would seam a far better solution if you have the time to do the swop your selves. Adrian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freeagent Posted January 15, 2007 Share Posted January 15, 2007 Mmmmm.... If you are planning to keep the vehicle long term, i'd think about a new bulkhead, you won't need one for a couple of years at least, which will give you ample time to source one, plus the other bits you'll need... old sodbury is the place to buy a bulkhead, they can be found for as little as £50, but a good-un will cost you about £200, but it will probably have loads of stuff still fitted to it, like the pedal box, brake servo, wiring, so you can drop it in as it is, then harvest all the fittings off your old one to keep as spares... in the mean time, just wire-brush that old one and touch it up.... a bulkhead swap can be done over a long weekend, if you've got a mate to help you... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Henson Posted January 15, 2007 Share Posted January 15, 2007 All the welder will have to do it cut out the rust and weld it up. Haaaaaaaaaaa ha ha ha ha haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa, haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freeagent Posted January 15, 2007 Share Posted January 15, 2007 yeah, I thought the same when I read that Les.... obviously not encountered the joys of 'hidden rust' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul64 Posted January 15, 2007 Author Share Posted January 15, 2007 Thanks guys, I just need to take the plunge. Too much thinking and not enough doing. I suppose it is the worry of going too far and getting stuck at that point of no return! Cheers, Paul. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Humphreys Posted January 15, 2007 Share Posted January 15, 2007 Haaaaaaaaaaa ha ha ha ha haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa, haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. Les. Yes I have been there and done that. But its the striping down and putting it all back thats going to take the time. I have done a few s3 bulk heads. But I use to be a welder/sheet mettal worker. Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul64 Posted January 15, 2007 Author Share Posted January 15, 2007 Yes I have been there and done that. But its the striping down and putting it all back thats going to take the time. I have done a few s3 bulk heads. But I use to be a welder/sheet mettal worker.Paul That helps! (a lot) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Henson Posted January 16, 2007 Share Posted January 16, 2007 Indeed, a lot more accurate with the hammer. Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul64 Posted January 16, 2007 Author Share Posted January 16, 2007 Changed the nearside vent seal today, so that should hopefully take the pressure off the bulkhead. My babe is garaged too, so hopefully that will help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul64 Posted January 29, 2007 Author Share Posted January 29, 2007 The left hand wing is coming off this weekend so Rejo can show me how to weld the panel in. Is getting the wing off a pig of a job? The LH bulkhead repair panel came a bit bent from the supplier. I take it with a bit of heat, I could bend it back into shape? Cheers, Paul. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill van snorkle Posted January 30, 2007 Share Posted January 30, 2007 I know that European weather conditions are harder on all the steelwork than over here, but looking at the corrosion photos on the previous page it would appear that LandRover don't prepare or paint the inside of hollow or box section assemblies anymore. Even over here I've noticed lateish Pretenders with virtually no paint on the rear crossmembers, so they are skimping on the visible bits as well. Has anyone cut up a damaged but unrusted late model bulkhead or chassis and noticed any paint inside ? Bill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul64 Posted January 30, 2007 Author Share Posted January 30, 2007 I take it the wing is bolt on. Anything that has required nuts and bolts to be removed so far has involved rust sweat and tears! Does anyone know what size nuts and bolts are required for the job, as they will definitely need replacing? Cheers, Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GBMUD Posted January 30, 2007 Share Posted January 30, 2007 There are worse jobs than removing a wing. You have to remove the vent panel in the top of the wing and the rubber wheel-arch. Then you can get access to the bolts that hold the wing on. Your LR is 300Tdi RHD right? You will also have to remove the heater intake duct (or engine intake duct on the RH wing) to get in there. There are no nuts holding a Defender wing on, just bolts and "spire" captive nuts. There are 3 or 4 bolts holding the wing to the bulkhead too. Application of loads of Waxoyl to the bolts on re-fitting should ensure that they come out easily next time - but in my experience they are not too bad due to the nature of the thread on the bolts. Rubber wheel arches have a system of plastic rivets to hold them on. They are like a tube with a head on them and a plastic "pin" which pushes down the centre from the head and splays out the rivet. You will see what I mean when you look - there is a clean one holding the door panel on the inside of the door. You need to use something to push this pin all the way through in order to release the wheel arch. Buy some new ones form the main stealer before you start, they are not too dear and you will knacker some. Apply some silicone spray grease to the pin before re-fitting as this will make life a lot easier. All this has inspired me to go outside and fit my new door hinges... Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul64 Posted January 30, 2007 Author Share Posted January 30, 2007 There are worse jobs than removing a wing. You have to remove the vent panel in the top of the wing and the rubber wheel-arch. Then you can get access to the bolts that hold the wing on. Your LR is 300Tdi RHD right? You will also have to remove the heater intake duct (or engine intake duct on the RH wing) to get in there. There are no nuts holding a Defender wing on, just bolts and "spire" captive nuts. There are 3 or 4 bolts holding the wing to the bulkhead too. Application of loads of Waxoyl to the bolts on re-fitting should ensure that they come out easily next time - but in my experience they are not too bad due to the nature of the thread on the bolts.Rubber wheel arches have a system of plastic rivets to hold them on. They are like a tube with a head on them and a plastic "pin" which pushes down the centre from the head and splays out the rivet. You will see what I mean when you look - there is a clean one holding the door panel on the inside of the door. You need to use something to push this pin all the way through in order to release the wheel arch. Buy some new ones form the main stealer before you start, they are not too dear and you will knacker some. Apply some silicone spray grease to the pin before re-fitting as this will make life a lot easier. All this has inspired me to go outside and fit my new door hinges... Chris Thanks Chris, My wagon is a 200Tdi, but I think that should be pretty much the same as the 300. Luckily I had bought some plastic rivets a month ago for another job, so may come in handy as you say. I must admit I am a bit worried about what we will find. When Rejo was replacing the master cylinder he noted some rust behind the facia of the footwell. I will keep you posted, and thanks again for the information. cheers, Paul. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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