enen Posted April 15, 2020 Share Posted April 15, 2020 I have an early disco with no seal inside the axle tube. Diff oil lubes the wheel bearings. The inner hub seal stops oil from leaking out of the hub So far, so good! What is the point of the outer hub seal(#15 in attached pic)? Oil should flow from the diff, axle tube then the hub Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enen Posted April 15, 2020 Author Share Posted April 15, 2020 sorry, i got the terms wrong outer seal #11 makes sense. Inner seal #15 i dont understand the purpose Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bear Posted April 15, 2020 Share Posted April 15, 2020 Theseals will be to keep the bearing grease in I expect. Griff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted April 15, 2020 Share Posted April 15, 2020 From memory as its a while since I stripped mine down. I think its there to keep the oil from the bearings as the bearings are packed with grease as normal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enen Posted April 16, 2020 Author Share Posted April 16, 2020 I assumed the wheel bearings would be oil filled as there were no oil seals in the axle tubes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peaklander Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 The hub spins and the axle doesn't, so the seals are still needed to hold the oil in and stop it leaking through the back or front. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 8 hours ago, enen said: I assumed the wheel bearings would be oil filled as there were no oil seals in the axle tubes Later ones have the seal in the axle but not the outer seal in the hub. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snagger Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 In practice, it’s not important. It should keep diff oil out of the wheel bearings, preventing their grease being contaminated (oil would run up the inside of the stub axle and inside the drive flange, but would then be blocked from the bearings. The later axles move the seal to the inside of the stub axle to do the same task in a location easier to seal, but with the effect of running the drive flanges dry, leading to their splines wearing out faster. Some greases degrade if contaminated with oil, so I presume that is why they separated them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peaklander Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 My earlier reply was a bit flippant - sorry about that. I am a bit confused now though. I have a 110 with disc brakes and recently did the mod to remove the stub axle oil seal, allowing oil through as far as the flange splines. I changed the rear of hub seal from FTC4785 to RTC3511 (item 11 in the parts diagram above) which I assume prevents oil from leaking from the inside of the hub where it joins the stub axle. There is no seal on the outside of the hub and so the oil must run through into the bearings and be retained by the flange gasket and rubber cap (screw cap in my case on HD flanges). That's the whole point of the modification after all. So what @Snagger is saying is that oil and grease would combine. I understand that it would but thought that oil is what's required now in there. Are the bearings supposed to be greased still even though oil should be splashing about? Does that explain my confusion? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 Just now, Peaklander said: My earlier reply was a bit flippant - sorry about that. I am a bit confused now though. I have a 110 with disc brakes and recently did the mod to remove the stub axle oil seal, allowing oil through as far as the flange splines. I changed the rear of hub seal from FTC4785 to RTC3511 (item 11 in the parts diagram above) which I assume prevents oil from leaking from the inside of the hub where it joins the stub axle. There is no seal on the outside of the hub and so the oil must run through into the bearings and be retained by the flange gasket and rubber cap (screw cap in my case on HD flanges). That's the whole point of the modification after all. So what @Snagger is saying is that oil and grease would combine. I understand that it would but thought that oil is what's required now in there. Are the bearings supposed to be greased still even though oil should be splashing about? Does that explain my confusion? In the case of this type of axle, they would still originally have had greased bearings and not oil lubricated ones. The rear axle I've got is this type and i just ran with the outermost seal removed and only a slight smear of grease on new bearings to get things going. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nonimouse Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 To simplify, its a mod that improves longevity - so folk remove the seal to allow oil to flow through to the splines Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peaklander Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 Yes @Nonimouse, I understand that it is an improvement but it's just the discussion about oil and grease mixing that's got me confused. I guess I'm now where the OP was at the start and where @landroversforever is now! That is, running oil in the bearings but with a little grease that will only be there until it has mixed with the oil and no need for the item 15 seal but item 11 seal needs to be an oil seal and not the original. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 8 minutes ago, Peaklander said: Yes @Nonimouse, I understand that it is an improvement but it's just the discussion about oil and grease mixing that's got me confused. I guess I'm now where the OP was at the start and where @landroversforever is now! That is, running oil in the bearings but with a little grease that will only be there until it has mixed with the oil and no need for the item 15 seal but item 11 seal needs to be an oil seal and not the original. I can't picture the oil level at the moment, but it might be enough that it doesn't need the grease to start with but either way I can't see it doing any harm. In the fairly minimal time the truck was on the road in my ownership I replaced the rear bearings once (running in oil) and the front ones 3 times (in grease, one time was down to contamination). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enen Posted April 17, 2020 Author Share Posted April 17, 2020 i had hoped to run oil on the bearings instead of grease but may not be worth the trouble Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 25 minutes ago, enen said: i had hoped to run oil on the bearings instead of grease but may not be worth the trouble Just leave out the seal on the outside of the bearings . Worked perfectly for Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enen Posted April 17, 2020 Author Share Posted April 17, 2020 I have two issues with that. How high up are you tilting the car to be able the fill the diff with enough oil to get the fluid high enough level? The area on the stub axle that the outer seal rides on has a slight groove. Speedi seals are $65 each! I would buy new stub axles but im in canada and getting killed on freight charges. I need a windscreen and was quoted $1200 for shipping alone! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 I never had to tilt the car in anyway and just filled the rear axle as normal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 To be honest, a speedi sleeve on the seal land would probably last longer than a normal stub axle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enen Posted April 18, 2020 Author Share Posted April 18, 2020 Id like to thank everyone for their help Ive put it back together with the inner seal and am looking for a deal on speedi seal for later install Cheers ian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted April 18, 2020 Share Posted April 18, 2020 15 hours ago, enen said: Id like to thank everyone for their help Ive put it back together with the inner seal and am looking for a deal on speedi seal for later install Cheers ian Assuming we're talking about the same thing here to repair the seal running surface.... its speedi-sleeve you need. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enen Posted April 18, 2020 Author Share Posted April 18, 2020 yes, sorry, typo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missingsid Posted April 19, 2020 Share Posted April 19, 2020 For anyone interested, I came upon this just now after reading this post. skfspeedisleeve_1338271826.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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