Anyone used this disc brake conversion?

[Bigj66]

Came across this whilst researching disc brake conversions.

https://www.best-of-land.com/gb/accessories/optimization/series-ii-and-iii-disc-brake-conversion-kit---front

Does anyone have any experience of it?

I can see that it looks like a copy of the Zeus kit.

[Bowie69]

Have to be honest, I wouldn't be looking at cost cutting when it comes to brakes......

At least the Zeus stuff is fairly well tested, this doesn't have that same reassurance...

[sean f]

For follow up parts it would be good to know what caliper, pads and disc's are used, they don't look like LR items although I could be wrong.

Custom parts are fine but can cause issue later when pads etc are not longer available depending on where they are from.

[Bigj66]

22 minutes ago, Bowie69 said:

Have to be honest, I wouldn't be looking at cost cutting when it comes to brakes......

At least the Zeus stuff is fairly well tested, this doesn't have that same reassurance...

No me neither and I’m inclined towards the Heystee kit as it looks like the Zeus kit only comes with their own disc and calliper compared to Heystee who use standard Defender parts. 

I’m reluctant to be dependent on one supplier for their bespoke service components such as discs and pads.

If the rest of the Zeus kit was standard bits too then you’d just be looking at buying the calliper mounting bracket off them which would be much more cost effective and I suspect those other parts are off the shelf from somewhere but they don’t wish to advertise it.

By the way, I’m told that the Heystee business has been taken over now by Van den Burg Engineering who are still making the disc conversion kits but that Paul has now set up as Parabolicsuspension.com and is still continuing to make his parabolic springs.

[Gazzar]

I've the Zeus kit, it's well built, and uses standard pads. The next build will be the heystee kit, as this will allow me to fit standard series rims.

 

[Arjan]

Me, too, have front & rear the Zeus kit and it does its job very well.

Straight bolt on conversion.
 

And yes, I run spacers...

 

[Bigj66]

25 minutes ago, Gazzar said:

I've the Zeus kit, it's well built, and uses standard pads. The next build will be the heystee kit, as this will allow me to fit standard series rims.

 

Standard pads off any particular vehicle?

The other benefit of the Heystee kit is that you can fit vented discs but I suppose even a solid disc is overall better than drums.

[Gazzar]

Drums are okay for normal driving, it's the repeated braking that they fall down on, mountains etc.

In some circumstances they are better than disks, as they are almost sealed, mud is less of an issue.

The reason that LR restricted the power of the V8 in the stage one was that the drums suffered fade after repeated testing in Australia. 

Ask Zeus what the pads are from?

 

[Bigj66]

13 minutes ago, Gazzar said:

Drums are okay for normal driving, it's the repeated braking that they fall down on, mountains etc.

In some circumstances they are better than disks, as they are almost sealed, mud is less of an issue.

The reason that LR restricted the power of the V8 in the stage one was that the drums suffered fade after repeated testing in Australia. 

Yeah, I think if you’re sticking a V8 lump in a Series vehicle then you definitely shouldn’t rely on the standard 2.25 brakes.

Ask Zeus what the pads are from?

Of course, sorry I misunderstood, I thought you’d already had to replace yours. I’ve sent them an email 👍

 

[Anderzander]

None of them are totally off the shelf: Heystee has a bespoke hub and swivel to then take standard parts.

[Bigj66]

4 minutes ago, Anderzander said:

None of them are totally off the shelf: Heystee has a bespoke hub and swivel to then take standard parts.

Yes definitely but I was thinking more about the wear and tear items like the pads and discs rather than the one offs like these and the Zeus calliper bracket.

[Gazzar]

Is there a catalogue with pictures of pads?

 

[Bigj66]

38 minutes ago, Gazzar said:

Is there a catalogue with pictures of pads?

 

Not on the Zeus website no.

[greenmeanie]

I have a Zeus kit on a 101 which IIRC uses the same calliper. Brake pad cross reference numbers are Mintex brake pads code mgb 522 or Quinton Hazel brake pads code BP 105

[Snagger]

The Zeus discs are (or were) machined down from a standard vehicle, some sort of Chrysler I vaguely recall (don’t quote me on that).  The pads will have part codes on the back so you can easily identify them for local replacement.  
 

Their quality is well proven by London black cabs using them for decades.  I wouldn’t have any concerns over fitting them, and they’ll be every bit as reliable and a fraction the cost and hassle of fitting the Heystee kit, which will no doubt be excellent but awfully expensive.

It’s right that drums are entirely adequate.  They give just a strong maximum braking effort as discs if they’re even moderately well maintained.  The maximum braking force is dictated by tyre grip, not brake type. The big difference is in how easy they are to control - I found a lot more pedal feel and consistency, meaning I could brake hard in tests without locking up as often as with drums.  So the discs may have reduced braking distance in practice, even though on paper they don’t.  It’s a little like the argument for ABS - in theory, that increases braking distance, but in reality, it decreases it by preventing skids.  The big benefit of discs, though, is their ease of maintenance, with the exception of disc replacement on RR and Defender types.

[Bigj66]

When I tot everything up for both kits including the rear hubs that I need to replace, the Heystee kit comes out around £150 more expensive than the Zeus one. The other benefits of the Heystee kit are vented front discs and more wheel options so although the Zeus kit is good, I think I would still lean towards the Heystee one but whichever is used it’s a lot of money.

[Arjan]

Ehm.....

"... including the rear hubs that I need to replace.."

Why do you need to replace the hubs ?

The Zeus kit is a straight bolt on job - we did not replace the hubs..

Or did I miss something ?

The Zeus kit is, as far as I know, not for vented discs but spacers for the caliper could be made if you want.

The Zeus kit does not, as stated, work with the Series rims - something for us not a problem as they all runs on Disco I steel ones anyway.

Will be very interest to see a post on the conversion with the Heystee kit !

[Bigj66]

1 hour ago, Arjan said:

Ehm.....

"... including the rear hubs that I need to replace.."

Why do you need to replace the hubs ?

The Zeus kit is a straight bolt on job - we did not replace the hubs..

Or did I miss something ?

The Zeus kit is, as far as I know, not for vented discs but spacers for the caliper could be made if you want.

The Zeus kit does not, as stated, work with the Series rims - something for us not a problem as they all runs on Disco I steel ones anyway.

Will be very interest to see a post on the conversion with the Heystee kit !

My rear hubs are knackered and need replacing whatever I fit but the Heystee kit comes with new ones. I have the 6.5” 130 Defender rims already so they would be fine for the Zeus kit if I’ve read it correctly.

[Snagger]

Second hand hubs would be cheap.  It’s not common to make them unusable - I can see how a seize bearing could spin a race or an over tightened wheel nut could pull a stud too hard and crack the hub flange,  it that’s about it.

I think the Zeus kit uses, it at least used to use discs that fit over the hub like on P38 and D2, so you don’t need to take the hub off to replace discs.  In fairness, discs don’t wear out that fast in most uses, and it prompts a worthwhile inspection and service of bearings and hub seal too, so it’s only a small benefit of the Zeus over the Heystee kit.  
 

I have been impressed with both companies.  The Zeus stainless pistons were so good for my RRC that I got another set for my 109 when I did the axles and disc conversion on that without the slightest doubt.  My Heystee springs have stood the test of time really well, though one spring did crack a spring eye after over a decade In regular use, which Paul Heystee reckoned was down to fatigue from a slightly oversized batch of bushes they had when my springs were made, and he sent a replacement leaf straight out even though all those years had passed. Since then, I’ve had no trouble with them at all and they have retained their camber and ride height for about 20 yearS with no lean.

[Gazzar]

Double check that defender rim.

It's the well in the centre that fouls.

[Bigj66]

Mine are ANR1534

[Bigj66]

11 minutes ago, Snagger said:

Second hand hubs would be cheap.  It’s not common to make them unusable - I can see how a seize bearing could spin a race or an over tightened wheel nut could pull a stud too hard and crack the hub flange,  it that’s about it.

I think the Zeus kit uses, it at least used to use discs that fit over the hub like on P38 and D2, so you don’t need to take the hub off to replace discs.  In fairness, discs don’t wear out that fast in most uses, and it prompts a worthwhile inspection and service of bearings and hub seal too, so it’s only a small benefit of the Zeus over the Heystee kit.  
 

I have been impressed with both companies.  The Zeus stainless pistons were so good for my RRC that I got another set for my 109 when I did the axles and disc conversion on that without the slightest doubt.  My Heystee springs have stood the test of time really well, though one spring did crack a spring eye after over a decade In regular use, which Paul Heystee reckoned was down to fatigue from a slightly oversized batch of bushes they had when my springs were made, and he sent a replacement leaf straight out even though all those years had passed. Since then, I’ve had no trouble with them at all and they have retained their camber and ride height for about 20 yearS with no lean.

On mine it looks like the race has spun. 

[Bigj66]

I’m also investigating alternatives to a conversion kit...

 

[Snagger]

I installed a 110 Salisbury axle on my 109, but it was an early version from a pre-Defender model.  I installed discs on it using 90/110 front hubs, D110  discs, Discovery/90 rear callipers, the 300Tdi calliper brackets and a mix and match of spacer washers between wheel bearing and hub nut.  It works very well.  You could use 110 rear callipers, keeping it all 110, if you have the brackets milled to thin them down, but I went with the 90 callipers as they fit the brackets with a spacer which seemed easier and safer.  The 90 callipers are a bit close on the rim of the 110 disc, but they clear by about 1-1.5 mm without any alterations, so that’s good enough.

[Bigj66]

Does anyone know if the front half shafts on a coil axle are tapered like the series ones or straight between the splined sections?

Edit: forget that, what I really need to know is the width of a coil axle case between the flanges if anyone has a case knocking about that they could measure please?