Driven: New Defender - On & Off Road. Is it a Pretender?

[ThreePointFive]

Cool video Naks, but thought my doorbell was going off a couple of times....

 

These things really are a lot more capable out of the box than a lot of people would like, it's good to see.

[Chicken Drumstick]

Good video. Sadly no terrain even remotely similar round this way.... would love to have a go.

 

Not knocking the New Defender. But I suspect driver and momentum played far bigger factors than the actual vehicle. Although plenty of power and a fast shifting auto may well have been handy vs some of the older models.

[landroversforever]

1 minute ago, Chicken Drumstick said:

Not knocking the New Defender. But I suspect driver and momentum played far bigger factors than the actual vehicle. Although plenty of power and a fast shifting auto may well have been handy vs some of the older models.

Definitely going to have a hand in it. Being able to downshift seamlessly and not loose momentum has got to be a big help.

[Snagger]

15 hours ago, Chicken Drumstick said:

Good video. Sadly no terrain even remotely similar round this way.... would love to have a go.

 

Not knocking the New Defender. But I suspect driver and momentum played far bigger factors than the actual vehicle. Although plenty of power and a fast shifting auto may well have been handy vs some of the older models.

Automatics are much better on soft conditions like dry sand, and that was part of why I was looking at fitting one.  In theory, you can’t stall the engine on bill climbs, either.  Hill descents are a bit swifter, though, so swings and roundabouts.

[deep]

11 hours ago, Snagger said:

Automatics are much better on soft conditions like dry sand, and that was part of why I was looking at fitting one.  In theory, you can’t stall the engine on bill climbs, either.  Hill descents are a bit swifter, though, so swings and roundabouts.

I've seen people struggle terribly with Tdis, in soft sand.  Build up momentum in a higher gear and drop off the turbo half way up, or go slower in a lower gear and not have enough momentum to start with.  No time for that crucial downshift, where an auto could have made it work.  I'd imagine those new, very high output turbocharged engines would be just as bad with a manual box.  A lot of autos will lock up in low gear so aren't necessarily that bad.

Having said that, I do quite enjoy having a manual in my 110.

[Naks]

PowerfulUK head to LR Experience at Eastnor Castle:

 

 

 

[Naks]

TFL Take 3 Iconic Off-Roaders Up A Mountain In a Snowstorm: What Can Go Wrong?

 

Edited December 21, 2020 by Naks

[Bowie69]

Lots.

[Mo Murphy]

The Pretender is far from iconic !

Mo

[SteveG]

30 minutes ago, Mo Murphy said:

The Pretender is far from iconic !

Mo

It is very much ironic though Mo 😉

and it’s designer is moronic 😉

🙄🙄

[deep]

That TFL stuff is very odd.  Their Defenders have appeared to work perfectly but the messages on the dashboard disagree.  Methinks they need a slightly less neurotic computer programmer.  Then the cars will suddenly be far more reliable and everyone will love them.  Certainly, in that last video, it was a vastly better vehicle than the other two (functionally speaking).

Also, what the heck has happened to the Nissan Patrol?  Over here, the old GQ Patrol is much loved by the lead foot brigade (because, fat and heavy as it is, the combination of 1970 Rang Rover suspension and strong transmission allows them to throw it at everything).  That Armada version looked very vulnerable by comparison.

Edited December 21, 2020 by deep

[elbekko]

13 hours ago, deep said:

That TFL stuff is very odd.  Their Defenders have appeared to work perfectly but the messages on the dashboard disagree.  Methinks they need a slightly less neurotic computer programmer.  Then the cars will suddenly be far more reliable and everyone will love them.  Certainly, in that last video, it was a vastly better vehicle than the other two (functionally speaking).

It is indeed very odd. Stuff like the coolant level sensor is just strange, because they didn't have that issue on the other Defenders they've taken off-road. All in all I think the main problem is UI.

As a programmer myself, it is hard to find a good middle ground for both novice users and expert users. Sometimes you just want a second screen that gives you a lot more options, but would overwhelm a novice. They kind of did that with the configurable TR screen, only show the nitty-gritty variables if the user really wants to see them, otherwise it's just a preset like 'mud & ruts'.

It would be nice if they could do the same for fault codes and such - hide it from the novice day-to-day users, but allow expert users to see more info about the conditions the fault occurred under (like: coolant level low, duration 1 second, incline 30°), and allow them to clear the fault if deemed non-critical.

[deep]

11 hours ago, elbekko said:

It would be nice if they could do the same for fault codes and such - hide it from the novice day-to-day users, but allow expert users to see more info about the conditions the fault occurred under (like: coolant level low, duration 1 second, incline 30°), and allow them to clear the fault if deemed non-critical.

Exactly!  It's all so way out of hand.  Far, far, far too much going on just to be able to drive and use the vehicle.

[Escape]

I didn't realize Nissan shared a designer with LR. That Armada/ Patrol could be another Range Rover variant, just slap on the badge...

[Chicken Drumstick]

Sort of seems appropriate to share some views on the traditional Defender. 
 

last of the line Puma. 

[JeremySteel]

That's a lovely thing.

[ThreePointFive]

Sir Drumstick, would you be willing to take detailed photos of how the hard top is mounted through to the cappings in exchange for internet points?

That has the exact setup I'm trying to copy. 

[Chicken Drumstick]

8 hours ago, ThreePointFive said:

Sir Drumstick, would you be willing to take detailed photos of how the hard top is mounted through to the cappings in exchange for internet points?

That has the exact setup I'm trying to copy. 

I’ll see if I can get some pics for you. Might be next weekend though. 

[Lightning]

lnteresting thread, particularly as l've now done nearly 10,000 miles in my new Defender after replacing my old Defender with it.

l haven't done any extreme off road but the vehicle is highly competent and l've had no issues with it.

lt's definitely an event to drive. Not like the old one of course, but nothing else would be really, except perhaps the Grenadier.

l have the base model 90 with the D250 3.0 diesel and coil springs. l think in this specification it's nearer to the old Defender than a 110 with air suspension and all the bling.
 

The 3.0 six cylinder is an absolute honey of an engine with nearly 600Nm of torque at under 1500rpm. 

ln this setup l've had none of the gearbox issues mentioned by the O/P. Maybe Land Rover updated software or something but the 2.0 was dropped fairly soon and replaced with the 3.0.

Would l go back to my 2005 110 SW? Some days, yes and others, no.

The new one certainly isn't "characterless". Well, not in base Commercial specification anyway. l tow a caravan and in this capacity it absolutely excels. The old one was good, no doubt, but the new one doesn't seem affected by the (admittedly fairly small) 'van at all. The only difference seems to be, about 5mpg less and a bit more RPM on hills.

But l STILL find myself looking at late model 110 TDCi Defenders online and thinking "what if...."

The only other problem with the old model is the LEZ's. l couldn't drive it into Sheffield to see my friends and on a recent trip to London we had to take the Jimny.

This will become more of an issue in the future.

 

Edited September 24, 2023 by Lightning

[Snagger]

If the ULEZs aren’t fought against and killed off, then no car will ultimately be safe apart from the “historic” category.  Euro6 might be compliant right now, but won’t be in a few years from now - they will keep moving the goal posts to keep the revenue coming in.  EVs will get some charges to, once they start making a dent in the ICE numbers and tax revenues.

[deep]

Nice spec and colour on that "90".  I can see it being as practical as a modern Land Rover can get.  Glad it's giving a good run.  We don't have those zones here and I haven't seen talk of them but we do have the problem of increasing numbers of freeloaders not paying their way in their electric cars, which REALLY has to stop soon!  It's basically a case of the poor and the workers subsidising the wealthy as it stands.

 

[Snagger]

15 hours ago, deep said:

Nice spec and colour on that "90".  I can see it being as practical as a modern Land Rover can get.  Glad it's giving a good run.  We don't have those zones here and I haven't seen talk of them but we do have the problem of increasing numbers of freeloaders not paying their way in their electric cars, which REALLY has to stop soon!  It's basically a case of the poor and the workers subsidising the wealthy as it stands.

 

That has been the same everywhere - they give tax breaks or even grants to early adopters, but once tax revenue takes a hit, watch the speed with which EVs, solar panels, heat pumps and all the other eco tech will suddenly become damaging or antisocial and will then attract punitive charges.  Different kit, same tactics.