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AWDC - any members here?


JST
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Am relooking at the insurance aspects for competitive events (hence why next event hasnt been advertised yet!)

one option is possibly to be affiliated to the AWDC, this means that competitors would need to be either associates (£15) or full members (£30) in order to compete - benefits are firstly the events can continue, secondly the entry price can remain what i consider to be low.

it would also mean that vehicles would have to pass their scrutineering inspection prior to start (just waiting o confirm what that is although i expect similar to Interclub challenge)

So out of interest, those competitve winch challenge types out there, whos currently a member or would join to enable them to compete SWC events?

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Me and Steve are members. No worries with scrutineering...

Thats not entirely true, I am a member but the landrover won't pass! I aint telling you what it is tho coz then they will know to check it!!!!!

Na, its only the side exit exhaust they dont like but I will have to do something about that before next year coz we intend doing a few localish rounds. Their regs are a fair bit tighter than anywhere else ive been and they are much keener on checking stuff but its not really anything very difficult to sort out. Things that spring to mind (coz we failed on em before) are no side exit exhausts, 2Kg foam fire extinguisher in cab, second throttle return spring. I did have a copy of the regs somewhere but im pretty sure you can find em on the AWDC site.

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Myself and Pigster are awdc members, scrutineering!!! well they just don't like me ;) now what!! ok! i'll get it sorted!

it's just routine stuff :) now't to worry about :)

I think i should enter some of your event's.....but looking at the pic's :o look's like my l/rover's already involved :o;):D

Ooooo!!!!! You aint getting ya handbag out again are you Adrian! :D :D

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AWDC

membership sounds ok

Scrutineering sounds even better, properly done rather than the o sort it for next time approach.

I don't want to be too near any dangerous vehicles on any event

same as using non rated recovery gear.

Fire extinguishers and battery cutoffs may seem an annoyance to fit but if you need on you'll be glad you did.

good ideas James and the way forward too if spectators are going to be attending events.

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can't be any worse than the T**t at the HBRO challenge near petersfield. :angry:

God i really thought that tonk was going to give him a slap. Not i would have blamed him :) in fact i would have been in the que behind him. Not a good sign when they walk up to your truck and say , so who pile of sh*t is this then

Shame really that a nice club like HBRO have a idiot like that talking to propective new members.

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I'm a member of the AWDC. I don't really have a problem with either the tech regs or the scutineering at events (with the last vehicle that is..... the new vehicle may give me a different perspective once I've done all of the stuff to make it compliant)

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They also have a member,can't remember his name but I always remember the face

Nick and I were teamed up and Nicks V8 had died in the river we were struggling to get it out

P1010065-copy-copy-copy.jpg

he happened along and When I asked for a extra winch to aid recovery he just said no we are

here to win not help other people. the idiot.

Paul Wightman drove across the site and recovered The RR

and unsurprisingly still won the event.

mr competitive came 3rd or 4th! how I laughed at prize giving time

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They also have a member,can't remember his name but I always remember the face

Nick and I were teamed up and Nicks V8 had died in the river we were struggling to get it out

P1010065-copy-copy-copy.jpg

he happened along and When I asked for a extra winch to aid recovery he just said no we are

here to win not help other people. the idiot.

Paul Wightman drove across the site and recovered The RR

and unsurprisingly still won the event.

mr competitive came 3rd or 4th! how I laughed at prize giving time

I hate it when people are like that! If I can help then I do, It aint the end of the world coz im sure one day I'll be glad of some help myself!

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getting a bit OT but i agree with the friendly approach and i think my next challenge there may be incentive for recovery/aid of other competitors, just to promote it.

Jules we met that chap at the entrance as well, i know what you mean, wont stop me doing the nexct HBRO though, fantastic event. and no offence meant Nige.

Back On Topic then AWDC options look favourable, will do some more digging.

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from an outsiders point of view it seems from threads here that a lot of events already require AWDC membership. i'd go with the flow as picking another way of doing things would seem to me to make your event like a different formula & restrict entrys. cause with different rules your bound to get to the point one day where a car is illegal in one comp in order to be legal in another.

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I'd just like to add that going AWDC seems like a good idea to me too.

My truck flew through the AWDC scruteneering and it's nice to know that the recovery gear has to come up to some standards. :)

We have all seen enough horror stories on this forum.

Richard

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James, I'd have no problem joining although I'm not a member. I've only heard good things about your events.

FYI, scruteneering opens up a legal can of worms as far as you're concerned as it shifts all responsibility onto the heads of the scruteneer and the event organiser. If someone is injured due to something faulty that has been checked by a scruteneer you are now liable rather than the owner of the faulty kit. this can be got arround by making drivers sign a form stating that they're vehicle conforms to the rules (cut offs fitted, fire extinguishers, rated recovery gear etc.) and then if something goes wrong it is the competitior that's liable rather than you. Just something I'd let you know about in case you didn't know....

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James, I'd have no problem joining although I'm not a member. I've only heard good things about your events.

FYI, scruteneering opens up a legal can of worms as far as you're concerned as it shifts all responsibility onto the heads of the scruteneer and the event organiser. If someone is injured due to something faulty that has been checked by a scruteneer you are now liable rather than the owner of the faulty kit. this can be got arround by making drivers sign a form stating that they're vehicle conforms to the rules (cut offs fitted, fire extinguishers, rated recovery gear etc.) and then if something goes wrong it is the competitior that's liable rather than you. Just something I'd let you know about in case you didn't know....

At all AWDC (and other MSA sanctioned) events the competitors sign-on an official MSA sheet that absolves the organisers and officials of liability

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I'm a member of the AWDC. Only joined to compete in last year's Mike Wolfe.

Was expensive for one event, but if membership costs are shared between half a dozen events a year it becomes more affordable.

Anything that makes yor events safer for competitors and less financially risky for you and the firn has to be a good thing.

Go for it IMHO.

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getting a bit OT but i agree with the friendly approach and i think my next challenge there may be incentive for recovery/aid of other competitors, just to promote it.

Jules we met that chap at the entrance as well, i know what you mean, wont stop me doing the nexct HBRO though, fantastic event. and no offence meant Nige.

Back On Topic then AWDC options look favourable, will do some more digging.

...and none taken. :angry:

:lol::lol::lol:

Seriously tho all clubs have there share of T**ts, be it HBRO or dare I say AWDC or any other club be it 4x4 or not.....every club knows its doing ok when it gets to a certain size - and collects some villages idiot amongst them :)

The HBRO is about as friendlier club as you can get

Scrunineers this year will be myself (normal "Fee" applies :ph34r::lol: )

and Obberliotenent Grupenfurher Nigel Thorne mit cattleprod and Noose

So no pressure :lol:

Seriously for HBRO "NON ARC" scrutineering we will be looking for

SAFE 4x4s,

decent recovery points (and no a Nato hitch with 10mm studding I did class last year as a F NO WAY :lol: ,

no welded towballs to anything,

No rotten chassis, Taxed and roadworthy etc etc etc

and then

Safe EQUIPEMENT

ie NO untested shackles less than 4.75T

NO Chains, tyre or recovery

no chainsaws,

Frayed wire ropes

Unsuitable equipement

and anything else either banned or plain stupisd :

ie NO alcohol (belive me I found some at an event years ago....- "open and pour it away of leave now", the giveaway was he was drinking one "Special Brew" when I turned up to scrutineer !... :angry: FFS..................... :angry:

I may have been a tad of a grumpy scrut that day :rolleyes:

Nige

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it would also mean that vehicles would have to pass their scrutineering inspection prior to start (just waiting o confirm what that is although i expect similar to Interclub challenge)

It would be very difficult to get a Wrangler Jeep to comply as the factory fitted roll cage does not meet the requirements and cannot be modified to comply.

Anyone with a soft top needs crash helmets.

From what I can see from the photos, the majority of the vehicles at Bampton did not have mudguards which covered 100% of the tyre width for a 120 degree arc. All trayback vehicles I have seen only cover 90 degrees and anyone who has trimmed the front of their 90 mudguards doesn't comply.

Of course all of these are open to interpretation. How many side exiting exhausts have deflectors fitted within ten minutes of finishing scrutineering on the scrap iron challenge?

Does a simple bit of sheet metal held on by a couple of self tappers make a Wrangler a hard top and hence forget the roll cage and helmet rules?

Do gel batteries need to be in a sealed container if they are within the driver compartment as I believe they can not spill acid.

My concern is that I don't want to travel all the way to an event to find out that my vehicle doesn't comply although the scrutineer thought it did at the previous event. Likewise winning an event because none of you guys meet the mudguard rule seems a bit of a hollow victory.

Kevin

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They also have a member,can't remember his name but I always remember the face

Nick and I were teamed up and Nicks V8 had died in the river we were struggling to get it out

P1010065-copy-copy-copy.jpg

he happened along and When I asked for a extra winch to aid recovery he just said no we are

here to win not help other people. the idiot.

Paul Wightman drove across the site and recovered The RR

and unsurprisingly still won the event.

mr competitive came 3rd or 4th! how I laughed at prize giving time

Yeah i was Paul team mate on that event. We saw the problems you were having and decided that , that punch was not for us :)

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i don't have a problem with scrutineering as long as the "sensible" rule applies.

Failing because of a sticker is a bit daft.

mine has failed because the black(negative) lead to the battery wasnot yellow, apparently it must be yellow so that the marshall knows which one to cut when the vehicle is upside down. I did point out to him that yellow is +ve on a winch and that there was an engine/power kill switch in the dash but he did not want to test that. Also it was a bit,Infact, impossible to get the bonnet open with the vehicle upside down as the hilift fits on the bottom of the windscreen roll cage bar and the bonnet wont open unless it is removed first.I put some yellow tape round the terminal and he was happy. He also pointed out that there was not a 2nd spring on the throttle, there was, but not where he wanted it, so i got one out to fit and he told me it was not important it could be done for the next event. Either it is required or not.

Also how/where do they record that the vehicle has failed and been rectified? I could go to an AWDC event fail scrutineering on a recommendation then turn up with out it done for the next one who would know.?

I would also question the position of the scrutineer. If he passes a avehicle as safe and it subsequently rolls over and the cage fails presumably he would have some liability.

One thing i noticed on the AWDC events was the lack of log booking. My series is fully logged booked for both comp safaria and CCV trials by the ARC. The cage has been inspected, the wall thickness of the tube checked, the mountings for the cage to the chassis have been checked that the conform to a standard acceptable to the MSA/ARC.

At the AWDC no one checked the cage/mounts/chassis they just looked under the bonnet laughed and stuck a scrap iron sticker on.

Also if a ARC vehicle rolls on a CCV stage it must be rescrutineered, It can then be deemed safe/unsafe etc and the log book marked accordingly.

I think that for a winch challenge event it should take in excess of 15 mins to check each vehicle, Spool out the cable and check it, check and make sure that recovery points are to a safe standard (ADD another 15 mins if it is a mile marker to put the cable back in). Check all the kit to be used is plated and safe.

Then check the cage if present, against all the varying rules and regs based on when the cage was built.

I would also suggest that the punches are then graded to ensure that a punch is "safe" for that vehicle Cage/lack of cage. This is not based on ability of the vehicle but scrutineering and insurance has now said that it is ok for that vehicle to compete/take part without any restrictions.

I know the argument would be "Dont attempt anything that you are not comfortable with" however the slipperyness at bampton on sunday made anything but the main track "un safe" and potentially dangerous.

I have not written this to be a party pooper but more to get the disussion going.

Paul

:ph34r:

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