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Noisy spigot bush after 100 miles


dave88sw

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Hi,

I've very recently fitted a V8 to my Defender, a 3.9 with a manual R380 box from a late discovery 1.  I replaced the clutch, spigot bush (sourced from Turner engineering so should be a decent part) and release bearing as well as the plastic pieces in the clutch fork. The clutch pedal is adjusted correctly with at least 10mm free play. 

It's been driving very well (done approx 120 miles total) except that for the last 20 miles, the spigot bush has been squawking and it's slowly getting worse.  The first 100 miles there was no sign of anything wrong, then this noise started and it's now present on every gearchange (although strangely not often when selecting 1st to pull away from a stop). 

If you've ever heard a TD5 with a noisy spigot bush, you'll know the noise i mean, it's very distinctive, i'm 99.9% certain it's not the release bearing.  It's common on TD5's but i've never had a v8 do it and never after so few miles.

 

I've resigned myself to the fact that i'll have to remove the box again but i don't want to make a habit of it and i really can't think what i might have done wrong first time round.  I've fitted countless clutches and spigot bushes over the years and this being my own car you can imagine i was very careful to get it right, the bush was soaked in oil for about a week prior (i don't know how necessary this is but it can't hurt).  The only thing i can think is that the clutch wasn't perfectly aligned and the bush got snagged on the way in but this seems unlikely as i had no problem pulling the engine and box up.

Any ideas? 

Thanks

Dave

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How frustrating . Did you try the spigot bush on the input shaft before fitting ? Was it a "normal" fit into the crank ? Is the gearbox a complete unit off the back of a V8 Disco ? (Apart from gearstick housing I assume )

Steve 

 

Edited by steve b
to add Disco after V8
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It is very frustrating 😅

I did try the bush on the gearbox, it was a nice close fit but certainly not tight.  It fit into the crank as well as any other i've ever fitted, needing to be tapped in gently but not requiring excessive force.  There was nothing that concerned me about it.  The gearbox was a complete unit from a Discovery yes, i used an ashcroft conversion adapter to fit the Defender gear selector assembly but everything at the bellhousing end is exactly as removed from the Discovery.

Thanks

Dave

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How very annoying. As you say, it doesn't happen when selecting 1st from rest (you'd expect the spigot shaft to be turning with the crank with the gearbox in neutral I suppose, ie no relative motion) , that sort of confirms the diagnosis. Not sure if you took it apart what you could do different to what you just did. Maybe a smear of grease? Is it worth going a bit further to see if it settles down? 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Really surprised if it is the spigot but I am often wrong.

My experience is with a Series 1 but.

Spigot bushes are suposed to be reamed out after fitting. I didn't and mine is fine other than it is so tight that to get the gearbox installed I need to hang the box off a single bolt at the top of the bellowing and use its own weight to pull it in. The box has been off twice, no issues. Terrible bodge but that was nearly 40 yrs ago

Only lube used was grease to hydrolic the old bush out. No issues since

Yes putting the car in gear from a standstill will have the input shaft spinning with the engine, until you press the clutch where you will still have a small amount of drag but not enough to make the car lurch when it goes into 1st, so that does not support the 1st gear view to me.

Given the above I obviously have no experience of the TD5 spigot but is it different?

 

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I’ve had it on both td5’s I’ve had. I was convinced the plastic bearing carrier had something to do with it - so I put a better HD quality one on last time and it improved it a lot - it still gives a squeak when it first ‘wakes’ up - but it is better.

LOF clutches do those now - and I notice they do a better bush. One that lubricates better - if their blurb is right it delivers up to 20 times more lubrication.

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Sorry, i meant to come back and finish this thread off. 

I spent last Sunday pulling the gearbox out and it absolutely was the spigot bush.  I could pull the gearbox back about 20mm, at which point it got stuck, i had to pry it back.  It released with a pop and then, once out, i removed the clutch and the spigot bush fell out, it was obviously stuck on the input shaft and was spinning in the crank.

I had an awful job finding a good spigot bush, but eventually found P A Blanchards had some genuine ones.  Comparing the genuine one to the aftermarket one was interesting, they are night and day different.  The genuine one has a "grainy" texture (oilite material) where the aftermarket one is smooth and the genuine one is a much tighter fit in the crank and looser on the gearbox. 

 

missingsid, i appreciate what you're saying and in 15 years of messing with Land Rovers and literally countless clutch and spigot bush changes, this is the first i've had issue with (except the very common TD5 squawk).  The TD5 is theoretically no different (same phospher bronze/oilite type bush) but they have a very well known problem in as much as the spigot bush makes an awful squawk when cold if it's worn or dry. 

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On 11/14/2021 at 11:02 AM, Anderzander said:

I’ve had it on both td5’s I’ve had. I was convinced the plastic bearing carrier had something to do with it - so I put a better HD quality one on last time and it improved it a lot - it still gives a squeak when it first ‘wakes’ up - but it is better.

Is this the reason that they are different? Or this a different part? It seems like LR have made some interesting changes since the early 90/110s?

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On 11/19/2021 at 11:51 AM, Happyoldgit said:

As an aside I always used to soak sintered bushes in oil for a day or more before fitting.

Old school!  It used to be normal practice but seems to have declined.  I don’t recall the Haynes manuals commenting on it.  I did it as I’d read about it elsewhere, and even if it isn’t strictly necessary (and I suspect it is), it can’t do any harm.

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51 minutes ago, Snagger said:

Old school!  It used to be normal practice but seems to have declined.  I don’t recall the Haynes manuals commenting on it.  I did it as I’d read about it elsewhere, and even if it isn’t strictly necessary (and I suspect it is), it can’t do any harm.

Yep, having rebuilt plenty of old combustion engines in the past including those that had main cap and con rod bearings that requiring white metal bearings cast directly on them and then bored to size, cork clutches etc  I'm pretty old school at times 🙂

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1 hour ago, Snagger said:

Old school!  It used to be normal practice but seems to have declined.  I don’t recall the Haynes manuals commenting on it.  I did it as I’d read about it elsewhere, and even if it isn’t strictly necessary (and I suspect it is), it can’t do any harm.

Don't know if I knew this and forgot or never knew it!

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