Harry's Garage: Latest review of the new Defender after 4 months of use on the farm etc

[Happyoldgit]

 

[L19MUD]

3 hours ago, Happyoldgit said:

 

Excellent balanced review from Harry again. Still seems way too much money for a farm hack though

[Happyoldgit]

13 hours ago, L19MUD said:

Excellent balanced review from Harry again. Still seems way too much money for a farm hack though

 

Aye, I like Harry's presentation style. I don't always agree with what he says but like the way he says it, refreshing change from the over the top, loudmouthed presenters now.

Fifty something grand for a base model, modified by Land Rover Special Vehicles but retaining standard passenger interior trim in the restricted loadspace makes it an expensive and awkward workhorse.

[SteveG]

I suppose, when the previous ‘farm hack’ was/is the old daily TDV8 Range Rover then the Defender probably doesn’t look too expensive to Harry 😉

[Anderzander]

And here’s his final review …

 

[Bowie69]

Just finished watching it... interesting conclusion, but honestly not unexpected.

[Mossberg]

I went on a land rover experience day. I was amazed by the electronic off road gadgetry.  I think It was the Disco we went around in and whilst it was a basic course it went over some steep and awkward bumps. I am no seasoned off roader and at that time had a 3.9 v8 RRC. I did think I may struggle on that course in the RRC - mainly due to lack of locking difs and the cross axle lifting of wheels in some areas.

That highlighted a few things to me - I am not experienced off road, if doing actual off road a locking diff may be useful, and the new vehicles rely on electronics for their ability.

This vehicles (new Defender) off road ability really does seem outstanding. When you see the vehicle performing that well on all season tyres you really do understand what computers matched with sensors can achieve. 

Unfortunately that abilities reliance on the computer/sensor combination is also the biggest drawback.  How will that farm vehicle be performing in 5, 8, 10 years time and what will the annual servicing costs be. I can see the interior suffering in that environment too.

The new Defender certainly looks like a pleasure to travel in and does look like is would be great for an off road novice like me. Would I like one - yes, could I ever afford one - no. As the vehicle gets to an age where perhaps I could afford one I really can't believe I could afford the upkeep.

So in summary it looks comfortable,  capable and a pleasure to drive - but out of my reach.

[Bowie69]

For a farm vehicle, it seems to me a pickup with easily removable but secure canopy on the back would be far better.

The load bay on the 90 is just too small, IMHO.

[Mossberg]

5 hours ago, Bowie69 said:

For a farm vehicle, it seems to me a pickup with easily removable but secure canopy on the back would be far better.

The load bay on the 90 is just too small, IMHO.

I agree with that.  I have an old 90, so little to damage, but I wouldn't class that as big enough for a farm. I certainly wouldn't have thought you would want anything with such susceptible trim and door furniture. 

I don't know what farmers pay for trucks, but I wouldn't have thought 60k - but then I ain't a farmer!!

[Bowie69]

Well Harry is a pretty well off farmer, and he couldn't stomach the price either, even with the VAT removed.

[Anderzander]

Essentially it’s not a farm vehicle is it ? 
 

I can see it as an Estate Vehicle - but I don’t think we ever though it was ever meant to be a working vehicle. 

[Bowie69]

Perhaps it's a land owner vehicle, or estate manager's? 

Suspect it may work OK for people visiting work sites, but then so would any number of cheaper SUV/vans or even a Transit connect....

[landroversforever]

I think the 110 Hard top would have been a better option for Harry. Mate ran a D3 commercial and then followed that with a D4. He puts a lot in the back or on the roof, but he must have a trailer on the back ~50% of the time at least. 

[Happyoldgit]

No, not a farm vehicle. New, well appointed 4x4 pickups can be had for less than half the price. None of the farmers, gamekeepers that I know would consider one. Land / estate owners would likely have a RR.

[Bowie69]

31 minutes ago, Happyoldgit said:

Land / estate owners would likely have a RR.

True, after all there is no drop down tailgate on the 90.

[landroversforever]

I do wonder if they’d have been better off with a RR style tailgate at the back rather than the side hinged door. But not sure where the spare would end up then. 

[David Sparkes]

34 minutes ago, landroversforever said:

I do wonder if they’d have been better off with a RR style tailgate at the back rather than the side hinged door. ...

Absolutely NOT.

The bloody things are an abomination, just when you want to stretch into the further reaches of the load bay, the RR drop down tailgate gets in the way, pushing you further away from whatever it is you are trying to reach.
If the 'whatever' is heavy the increased stretch multiplies the risk of back strain.

I can see why the drop down tailgate was considered a useful increase in platform area in the half pint sized 88", but for later vehicles, used practically, it demonstrates that continuing a feature because some fart arse designer thinks it's iconic was, and is, a mistake.
Applied to the vehicle as a whole the same thinking prolonged the old style Defender life span at least 20 years too long, letting the competing manufacturers into a wide open goal.

Designers shouldn't take all the blame, they were employed by incompetent managers.

Regards.

[Retroanaconda]

I’ve seen a few at the auction marts amongst the sea of pickups and older land rovers, so some people think they’re farm cars.

At the end of the day a work vehicle will be different for everyone depending on what they do and how their business works. I use mine for work hence technically it’s a working vehicle. It’s certainly nicer to drive and more practical for me than any pickup on the market.

[Ed Poore]

On 9/13/2022 at 2:26 PM, landroversforever said:

I do wonder if they’d have been better off with a RR style tailgate at the back rather than the side hinged door. But not sure where the spare would end up then. 

Split tailgates like the Range Rover are a pain in the arse to use with telehandlers / forklifts - the upper tailgate usually gets in the way of the headstock.

Perhaps they were thinking about it 

[landroversforever]

4 hours ago, Ed Poore said:

Split tailgates like the Range Rover are a pain in the arse to use with telehandlers / forklifts - the upper tailgate usually gets in the way of the headstock.

Perhaps they were thinking about it 

Must admit, it's not an issue I've had putting stuff in the back of a D3&4, and been more of a pain with a D2 rear door with a forklift without sideshift. 

Would be interesting to compare the width of the opening in the back of a new Defender vs D2/D3/L322.

[western]

On 9/13/2022 at 3:16 PM, David Sparkes said:

Absolutely NOT.

The bloody things are an abomination, just when you want to stretch into the further reaches of the load bay, the RR drop down tailgate gets in the way, pushing you further away from whatever it is you are trying to reach.
If the 'whatever' is heavy the increased stretch multiplies the risk of back strain.

I can see why the drop down tailgate was considered a useful increase in platform area in the half pint sized 88", but for later vehicles, used practically, it demonstrates that continuing a feature because some fart arse designer thinks it's iconic was, and is, a mistake.
Applied to the vehicle as a whole the same thinking prolonged the old style Defender life span at least 20 years too long, letting the competing manufacturers into a wide open goal.

Designers shouldn't take all the blame, they were employed by incompetent managers.

Regards.

Plus Rover never had the investment in money that it needed, to many models in the BL car range that were competing for the same market areas & making hardly any profit. 

[deep]

I enjoyed the video.  Quite nice having the benefit of a year, 10,000 miles and no wash, as opposed to the hype that comes from over-excited reviewers when a vehicle is new.  Quite a lot of his observations would apply to any Land Rover product dating from the Freelander 2 (I drive a six cylinder version) - surprisingly effective off-road on less aggressive tyres, comfortable, quick and well-mannered on the road (except the steering is way too light) and a load area that could be a lot more practical without intrusions and a "soft" focus.  Maybe we could exclude the cavern in the back of a Disco 3/4 from that but none of them are designed primarily for freight.

Of course, the Defender is the better model in the current stable for roughish farm and forestry work (witness the decent dent in that sump guard!).  In that respect, I actually see the appeal in using the 90.  A bit smaller, a bit more nimble and less tempting to try to cram big loads into than the 110.  If it has to work, use a trailer, otherwise it is less encumbered.  That makes it much nicer than a crew cab pickup, which always takes it's built-in trailer with it.  I do think that, for people living in flat country seen in that video, that a Disco Sport would perform the same function quite well, except the limited towing capacity is restrictive.  Most of the time, you wouldn't know the difference!

His point about cost is very relevant.  If he lived here, though, he might find the laws around depreciation make that cost very helpful in keeping him down in a lower tax bracket - until that awkward moment when he goes to sell it and suddenly it's worth far more than the books say...

[Bowie69]

I'd love to see  a LR product with what some US station wagons have, where you can either fold the tailgate down, or open it to the left.

The glass rolled down entirely into the tailgate, like a freelander.