Jump to content

Hydraulic Steering


najw

Recommended Posts

judging by Mr Plods current level of training/observation (or them just wanting to get on an bust real criminals) the likelyhood of being reported to anyone or questioned beyond "can you show me your MOT certificate etc please" is biblically unlikely

Ive been pulled in 5 countries with a full hydro car (including the UK) and once they have seen an MOT certificate the worse Ive been asked for is if its ok for the feds to have a picture of the car because they think it looks cool :)

as for the insurance - well mine calls for a current MOT, drivers licence and road tax, even looking through the small print theres no mention of C&U compliance - if they welch then its in theory breach of a published contract and time for briefs to have a punch up (legal cover included in policy) - but equally likely to be foul of the law as lads running non-sva or post-sva-modded trucks.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

"under current legislation fully hydraulic steering does not pass construction and use regulations for the speeds and vehicle classification you are subscribing to"

he went on to confirm that hybrid hydro is lovely and cursory mechanical links are also dandy providing;

So does that mean that petal's hydro setup is in a legally happy place since you have steering if the assistance (pump) fails, or is it back in the grey area as there is no direct mechanical backup if the valve-to-ram pipe fails?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So does that mean that petal's hydro setup is in a legally happy place since you have steering if the assistance (pump) fails, or is it back in the grey area as there is no direct mechanical backup if the valve-to-ram pipe fails?

Petals steering wouldnt pass an SVA as she stands ;)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I got in touch with the policy man at the Dept for Transport responsible for Construction and Use and he researched the issue before answering.

Under C&U it states that you have to have a link of metallic material or similar properties in the steering system. Must connect all the way from steering wheel to steered wheels. So you can use carbon fibre etc. But specifically not hoses and hydraulic fluid as this is not possessing the "metallic" type properties.

All vehicles on the road have to comply with C&U for that particular class of vehicle (eg PLG, agri etc). Being non C&U compliant is an offence and negates your insurance.

MOT checks that the vehicle is basically sound at the time of the check. It does not check C&U compliance. SVA does check C&U compliance.

FB

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I got in touch with the policy man at the Dept for Transport responsible for Construction and Use and he researched the issue before answering.

Under C&U it states that you have to have a link of metallic material or similar properties in the steering system. Must connect all the way from steering wheel to steered wheels. So you can use carbon fibre etc. But specifically not hoses and hydraulic fluid as this is not possessing the "metallic" type properties.

All vehicles on the road have to comply with C&U for that particular class of vehicle (eg PLG, agri etc). Being non C&U compliant is an offence and negates your insurance.

MOT checks that the vehicle is basically sound at the time of the check. It does not check C&U compliance. SVA does check C&U compliance.

FB

Very comprehensive, thank you

Link to comment
Share on other sites

How about running the hydraulics with Mercury? ;)

This has all been very useful. I have decided to go down the route of a ram, drilled steering box (as per hydro-assist) and a not-particularly-manly link between the box and the ram. In practice the ram will be doing most of the work, but in the event of loosing pressure, you should be able to affect some steering via the pencil thick link!

Si

Link to comment
Share on other sites

How about running the hydraulics with Mercury? ;)

This has all been very useful. I have decided to go down the route of a ram, drilled steering box (as per hydro-assist) and a not-particularly-manly link between the box and the ram. In practice the ram will be doing most of the work, but in the event of loosing pressure, you should be able to affect some steering via the pencil thick link!

Si

Si

Don't forget the catch all "fit for purpose"!

Why do you need the link to be so weak? Even with a Forth Railway Bridge girder type shaft the ram can still do the work. It will be like an "Extreme Audi". They have so much assist they lose feeling but still have solid connections. Just "over servoed". Techy term.

FB

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well im not to bothered I think that there are better things to worry about, how many of you exceeded the speed limit today? :unsure:

It is good to know where you stand but most challenge motors are a legal minefield as we now know.

Don’t let your self become swallowed up by this country’s Red tape!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, but I have a tester who doesn't mind. I understand they are legal everywhere else but the WRC boys have to fit a cable for GB :unsure:

I don't have a problem with it as I use the park on the autobox rather than the handbrake and it's far better than most Landy handbrakes.

Definately not recommended as a substitute for a proper working handbrake.

I have recently on 2 separate occasions had to strip and repair the Park pall and gears on ZF Disco boxes because of people using the park position instead of the handbrake when winching bogged vehicles or tree stumps out of the ground.

bill.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Definately not recommended as a substitute for a proper working handbrake.

I have recently on 2 separate occasions had to strip and repair the Park pall and gears on ZF Disco boxes because of people using the park position instead of the handbrake when winching bogged vehicles or tree stumps out of the ground.

bill.

It's a TH350 and I don't winch, I one of a small band of racers here. But agreed, I wouldn't rely on it in extreme circumstances. I'm nearly always parked in a level pits or in the workshop.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

920bar three wire - gooooooood stuff, doubles as a recovery point :)
Just to add my pennys worth about it. All i can say but i supose it wouldnt be a defence in court for full hydro is that i have had 2 track rods fail on the road :o & 3 offroad :huh: & all with the result of instant loss of steering.

If the Hydro springs a leak at say 50mph {not the hose coming off a leak of a decent size} how quick would you loose steering ,plus would it still at least steer in a straight line . NOT just cut across all 3 lanes of the M3 !!!!!!!!!!!!!! <_<

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just to add my pennys worth about it. All i can say but i supose it wouldnt be a defence in court for full hydro is that i have had 2 track rods fail on the road :o & 3 offroad :huh: & all with the result of instant loss of steering.

If the Hydro springs a leak at say 50mph {not the hose coming off a leak of a decent size} how quick would you loose steering ,plus would it still at least steer in a straight line . NOT just cut across all 3 lanes of the M3 !!!!!!!!!!!!!! <_<

I have not had steering fail on the road or had rose joints fail

but on site I do suffer from Hydroic hoses blowing all the sodding time on construction equipment and the mess that it and greenies regs I have to jump through hopes.

Some will use good quality components others will not

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's not totally OT, but, at work we have big problems if components become contamination with hydraulic oil from forklifts etc. All the lifts have had all the hoses replaced with stainless, breaded hoses and we have not had a single leak since.

A lot of the problem with 'rubber' hoses is the swaged end cutting in to the rubber. The outer of the braided hose is muc tougher and a lot more flexible too.

Might be worth sourcing breaded hoses for this too?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

NoHummer - do you mean armoured hose?

Kind of - it's a PTFE hose covered in stainless bread. The hose is fairly thin walled and the whole thing is very flexible. I think it's similar to the used for flexible brake pipes.

Where electrical shorts are possible, the bread is covered with a plastic sheath.

Ed

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Im digging the idea of stainless bread :) dollop of aluminium margarine and some lead marmalade :)

could you ping up a link to the hose Ed? sounds interesting - I use parker no-skive and its seriously strong but theres always room for improvement :) thanks!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ah ha - i see I have written a funny. Sorry my spelling is often as it sounds.

I have asked one of the guys in stores where we get it from and he says it is the same as goodrich hose. He says go to Exact Engineering 01803 866464. They are in Devon because they do not have a web site. I don't know if that's actually where we buy it, but it was who he suggested.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We use cookies to ensure you get the best experience. By using our website you agree to our Cookie Policy