Too much fuel................

[Rustyrangie]

Some tips if you're going to remove and strip the dizzy.

Set the engine to TDC on Cyl 1 firing stroke.

Photograph the dizzy from above.

Remove Dizzy cap and photograph again. The you'll know how things , rotor arm position etc, should look when you come to replace it.

I learned this from bitter experience when I removed mine and totally messed up the timing.

Also when you're stripping the dizzy take photographs at each stage

I found it helped to make a good clear space on the bench, table or whatever and cover it with an old white sheet/tablecloth/pillowcase etc.

This has 2 benefits. 1, it's clean and you can see anything you drop and 2 it won't bounce too far when you drop it.

Again bitter experience spending ages looking for one of the small screws which bounced under the bench.

Good luck,

Bob

[DC_]

Thanks for that Bob. If i didn't have a guy helping me last weekend i would have no idea what the Heck TDC is. I take it i will need to remove the spark plugs to turn the pullys due to compression?

See...................another thing i learned.

Dont have a bench or a garage. out on the street is the best for now.

Does the dizzy just bolt off? or do i need to strip it bit by bit?

[Coastcard]

I take it i will need to remove the spark plugs to turn the pullys due to compression?

Does the dizzy just bolt off? or do i need to strip it bit by bit?

You don't need to remove the plugs, just get a socket with extension bar on the main crank pulley nut. You can find TDC when the rotor arm is pointing to No. 1 lead position on the dizzy, ususally about 4 o'clock (assuming this is correct in the first place ). If you are not confident (especially if you have had the dizzy out before) then it is worth double checking TDC because this will certainly throw things out.

Dizzy is held on with one bolt on a clamp. The bolt is underneath on the right if you are looking from the front. Also worth making sure there is no crud / washers/ bits of cable tie in the recesses or around the dizzy base before removing - you don't want that lot dropping in your engine.

When replacing dizzy, it is good to put a mark on the case where the No.1 plug lead is so you can check the rotor arm is pointing at it. As you will discover, the cogs are angled, so the rotor arm will move around a bit as you insert the dizzy. Finally make sure the oil pump drive key is pointing the same way as the recess in the bottom of the dizzy shaft (you will see what I mean when you remove it). This can all be a bit fiddly, but just go at it slowly and methodically and it will slot into place.

[paintman]

When I had this prob I did it with the dizzy in place. Surround it with cloth so if you drop anything it will not dive into the realms of darkest engine.

[DC_]

Here is some pics taken today. I didn't get into stripping it down as i couldn't find a step by step guide. Didn't want to start guessing what had to be done.

This is the position of the arm when it "sort of" springs back

This is the position it sits in when i turn it clockwise.

After moving it about and trying to see if it would relax into position, i think the spring or weights came off all together as it now has no resistance.

The 8 star thingy ma jig now goes up and down

[paintman]

From the manual with slight mods.

Surround item with cloth to prevent loss of parts.

Use circlip pliers to remove the circlip retaining the reluctor on the shaft

Remove the flat washer & then the 'O' ring.

Insert the blade of a small screwdriver beneath the reluctor & prise up until you can remove with your fingers (press down on the rotor shaft whilst doing this)

There is a plastic coupler under the reluctor & the reluctor, the shaft and this coupling ring 'key' together. Check this is not broken.

Unscrew the 3 pillars that hold the baseplate down (the ones that the flash shield screws go into - DO NOT disturb the two on top of the pick up or you will have to reset the airgap on reassembly. Not difficult but an unnecessary operation)

Remove the base plate & pickup assembly.

Springs & weights are under this & it should be obvious what goes where (unfortunately I don't have photos)

Make sure everything is clean & unseized

Lubricate the pivot points.

When putting the baseplate assembly back on be sure to engage the vacuum unit peg in the hole in the base plate.

Be sure to align the keys on the reluctor/shaft/coupler.

Manual recommends grease on:

Auto advance mech

Pickup centre plate bearing

Vacuum unit connecting peg

Connecting peg hole in vacuum unit connecting rod

And 3 drops of clean engine oil to:

Felt pad on top of rotor shaft

Some diags etc at http://4x4uk.org/faq/attached/Def_90_110_WSM_book5.pdf and go to Section 86 Electronic Ignition Lucas 35DMS distributor. Yes I know its 90 & 110 but it is common to all V8.

[DC_]

Can't seem to see the PDF file Paintman

My luck i guess.

Some of the above i can make sense of but some of it i have no idea what is being described.

"Use circlip pliers to remove the circlip retaining the reluctor on the shaft"

Can this clip be seen in my pictures?

"There is a plastic coupler under the reluctor & the reluctor, the shaft and this coupling ring 'key' together. Check this is not broken"

Is the reluctor the 8 pointed star thingy? If so, does it break up into 2 or 3 sections?

"Remove the base plate & pickup assembly."

Will i need to remover the amplifier also or will all of this lift out?

Thanks again. Sorry for not understanding the full meaning.

Treat me like i'm 6 and i'll get a better idea of what i need to do. Most of it is sinking in.....................HONEST

[DC_]

Would any of these tools be ok to remove the reluctor?

[paintman]

The file does take a while to load as there is a lot of it so you may have to wait. I've just re-checked it & it comes up fine, albeit a little slow.

If the link doesn't work type it in as www.4x4uk.org/faq/attached/Def_90_110_WSM_book5.pdf

Look at your picture 3rd from top. The one without the rotor in place.

As your eye travels down from the top of the shaft you come to what looks like a washer with two little lumps. Each lump has a hole. This is a circlip. You use one of the tools (Circlip pliers) in your second lot of pics. You need one of them that when you squeeze the handles together the points on the end move apart. Put the points into the little holes & squeeze the handles together until you can lift the circlip up the shaft.

Now remove the washer that is under the circlip.

Next the rubber 'O' ring.

Now use the thin bladed screwdriver to lever the reluctor (star thing which is in one piece. If it comes of in more than one bit you have broken it. They are pretty tough so that would be an achievement!!!!) Don't forget to press down on the top of the shaft while doing this.

The little plastic thing under this is the coupler.

If yours is a 35DLM8 with the amp on the side of the dizzy then remove it. If it is 35DM8 & under the coil then you don't need to.

Undo the fasteners that hold the baseplate down. There are three of them. They have a screwdriver slot in the top and are threaded. The screws that hold the clear plastic flash cover go into the top of them.

Lift & remove the baseplate assembly.

Weights & springs are now in view.

Unfortunately, as I said earlier, I cannot find any pics of them so you will have to experiment a little but it should be fairly obvious.

I do think that you need to invest in a manual of some sort. Even the Haynes manual.

[DC_]

Thanks again. I have the range rover haynes but.............it's not the restoration one so i think i need to get one of those and i can stop bugging you's............probably would still bug you's.

Ok, so any of the tools above would do. Smashing, i'll go get a pair.

That talk through really helps. Understand more what i need to do.

Just need to get a biggish cloth now from the Mrs, that's probably gona be harder LOL

"If yours is a 35DLM8 with the amp on the side of the dizzy then remove it."

I have the amplifier attatched to the dizzy, so remove this i will, if i can get into the 2 screws that hold it in place.

[paintman]

My haynes has a pic of the 35DM8 in Chapter 13 Supplement page 244 & its a straight lift from the Factory manual. With the exception of the amplifier they are effectively the same

The only pics I can find of dizzy weights are in the same haynes on page 85 Fig 4.3 Item 21. Just gives you an idea what you are looking for.

Have the links worked?

[DC_]

The link worked today ok, must have been my comp.

i'll print it off when i have time.

The manual i have only gives chapter numbers not actual page numbers so it must be a different version.

I'll order the pliers and hopefully get the job started at least at the weekend.

[paintman]

Sounds like a later version, the early Haynes went into much more detail even down to gearbox rebuilds. The ISBN number in mine is 1 85010 405 0.

[DC_]

Yeh to be honest it doesn't give you that much info, even when it refers to photo's, it doesn't give the photo number you are supposed to look at ( PI**) IMHO

[geoffbeaumont]

Would any of these tools be ok to remove the reluctor?

Don't get one of these sets - I have one (or at least one that I think differs only in the plastic grips) and it's utterly useless Spend the extra for a proper pair, even if it's just for one job.

No idea which variety you need though - there are two basic types, for internal and external circlips. Internal ones compress the clip when you squeeze the grip, external spread it. Then within those you've got straight nose, right angle and at least 45^o which I'm sure you can work out from looking at where you've got to get them into.

[Coastcard]

Don't get one of these sets - I have one (or at least one that I think differs only in the plastic grips) and it's utterly useless

Guess what I just bought

[DC_]

Just got those messages .........................went for this set, little bit more expensive but looked better quality.

[Rustyrangie]

Is the reluctor the 8 pointed star thingy? If so, does it break up into 2 or 3 sections?

"Will i need to remover the amplifier also or will all of this lift out?

Yes, the reluctor is the "8 pointed star thingy" as you so eloquently describe it. It works by altering the magnetic flux in the pick-up which is a magnet with a coil of wire round it. A bit like an electric guitar pick up, if that helps.

When a "pointy bit" passes in front of the pick-up the change in magnetic flux causes a corresponding voltage in the pick-up coil. This voltage change is amplified by, yes you guessed it, the amplifier and this amplified voltage causes the coil to produce a spark. It's actually a bit more complicated than that as there is a bit of Pulse shaping involved to give a more accurate spark but basically the description is about right.

The reluctor itself doesn't break into any sections I hope! It's a single casting a bit like a cotton reel.

Looking closely at you pics you appear to have the dizzy - mounted amplifier so it'll be a DLMB 8 dizzy I think.

The amplifier is held by 2 screws to the side of the dizzy and has a 2 pin plug which connects to the pick-up plus the external plug that goes to the coil.

Obvious when/if you take it off.

Learned all this when mine failed. With a Rangie you'll always be learning something new as there'll always be something going wrong. But they're still a brilliant drive.

Bob

[DC_]

Great stuff Bob, really appreciate the input.

Does make more sense when it's explained to me as someone who hasn't really been doing mechanics for 16 years or so....................

Well i "hopefully" have a guy from our scottish offroading site coming over on sunday if for once it stops raining up here.Not having a garage is another pain.

Many thanks, fingers crossed it goes well if i get into it on sunday.

DC

[Hybrid_From_Hell]

Pretty much spot on Bob - the dizzy I think is a 35DLM8 but they are all simailr or the Non points ones

Useful link is http://www.v8engines.com/electrics-1.htm

Just go easy, force nothing go slow and carefully, try to lift the base plate up when you have the gubbins on top off (leave the pick up on where the 8 pointy thing goes past) and you'll see if the springs have popped off, and then be patient as getting them back on and dropping the shaft down can be either easy 1st time success or most likely not, just keep at it and they will all pop back in use long thin scredriver to help it all line up - when you get in there it will actually make sense where they go (springs and bob weights shaft and its engagement) so be patient

Nige

[DC_]

Will do, patients at the ready.....................

Pliers are with my mate the postie and volt meter to check the ALT "if" we get it running.

DC

[DC_]

SUCCESS!!

She's running............The springs where off, didn't need to take off the amplifier as the base plate just folded over and then we could get to the springs.

Only thing is we put the shaft on 180 degrees the wrong way so had to strip it all down twice.

Got the altenator checked too. 14 volts is coming off the alt itself, but it's not finding it's way to the battery.

I'll trace the alt wire and see if there's a problem down the line. Does anyone know if it's connected to the Solenoid ?? before it goes to the battery?

If so i think that might be where the problem lies.

A very happy DC

Thanks to all for input and having patients with me not understanding every step of the way.

[paintman]

Well done!

[Hybrid_From_Hell]

Great feeling innit

Nige

[DC_]

Canny wait until i get that ALT wire problem fixed then i think it'll be a case of seeing if it still runs rich. If it does, at least i already have a few ideas as to what may be at fault.

DC