FridgeFreezer Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 After a little bit of deep wading at Slab at the weekend, I seem to have silt in my bellhousing judging by the noise the clutch makes when the pedal's pressed setup is V8 with R380 long bellhousing Ideally I'd like to clean it out (probably just with a good blast from the hose) and get some fresh grease to the release bearing but without splitting the engine & box - I guess the options are remove starter or remove clutch slave, can anyone venture any advice on which is likely to provide better access or be less of a PITA to do? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GBMUD Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 I imagine that the release bearing is now full of sand and silt. I cannot see that you will be able to flush it successfully in-situ. Sealing the bellhousing (like you can with a diesel! ) would be the ideal solution for the future. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ciderman Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 How about cutting a hole say about 1"Diameter directly below the clutch bearing , Remove the starter ,flush the bell housing out then spray grease on the bearing , tap a thread into the hole and fit an 1" bung . TBH once the bearing is noisey through a grinding paste of silt it aint gonna be cured with a shot of grease . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Night Train Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 I imagine that the release bearing is now full of sand and silt. I cannot see that you will be able to flush it successfully in-situ. Sealing the bellhousing (like you can with a diesel! ) would be the ideal solution for the future.Chris I'd agree with this, you couldn't be sure it was clean of all grit as it gets everywhere. I lost a wheel due to sand in the wheel bearings after a weekend on Sailsbury Plain. No amount of cleaning would have made up for a proper stripdown and rebuild after wet sand got in the brake drum destroying the hub seal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomG Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 I imagine that the release bearing is now full of sand and silt. I cannot see that you will be able to flush it successfully in-situ. Sealing the bellhousing (like you can with a diesel! ) would be the ideal solution for the future.Chris Why can't the bellhousing be sealed on the V8? Drill and tap a breather in the top then clart the surfaces in sealant and reassemble Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
honitonhobbit Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 Scrap it John and get a proper vehicle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bull Bar Cowboy Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 The V8 bellhousing is supposed to be sealed ................... sealant around the main housing and then the lower plate has a rubber sealing strip............ The original Starter motor certainly seals a lot better then the prestocrap lookalikes .................... With the old 3.5, once the wading plug was in then no water at all would get into the housing ................. the current 3.9 needs a new rubber strip on the lower plate (on order) and then that will also be OK.............. Also don't forget to fit the outer 2 blanking bolts with their copper washers behind the sump....... Ian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 On mine when mucking about changing the sump gasket I had the half moon plate off. Cleaned it all up, and basically ran a BIG bead of RTV sealant over the top, and a small bead all around the bellhousing face, then bolted it up. With all the water and mucking about on both the 27th and the 30th pulled the wading bung out and about 1 eggcup full dribbled out. That may not even be a leak - could be condensation as well ? Re the issue of cleaning thats a tricky one, just about anything you shove in there to loosen and clean (Forte / Jizer) etc will prob strip the clutch release (unless you have a sealed bearing - unlilley) so you'll still have an issue of the dry clutch release vs gritty one, and solvents can dmage clutch plates.....thats one reason I have a ceramic one However, I have done this before, Rig up a hose system to allow you via a hose to shove water via the mains hose gently into the area, with the engine running this can dislodge and flush out the unit without wrecking it, do NOT put too much in as the starter will not like it, the ring gear will whizz it about - then drain and repeat. If you are really lucky you may get away with it water shouldn't wreck the oil / grease on the Cluch release, but you might find things either creak or your clutch plate stuck when it dries, but you can sort that - worth a try ? Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted January 2, 2008 Author Share Posted January 2, 2008 The bellhousing and cover plate are indeed sealed with lovely black goo, my best guess is it's either the clutch slave or starter letting it in as the V8 R380 bellhousing has no drain plug hole however I'm now intent on drilling & tapping one Based on the theory that shoving clean water into it isn't going to do any more harm than the dirty water that's already in there I may drill a 1/2" or maybe 3/4" hole in the top so I can get a fibre optic light and an extended squirty oil/grease thing in there and at least prolong the life of things a little. The clutch release bearing is a Rakeway billet one rather than the standard plastic bodied jobbie. Ciderman is of course correct, really there's no substitute for a good stripdown & cleanup (which many bits will be getting after all the sand at Slab) it's just that I'd rather not have to do a clutch job in the freezing cold if I can avoid it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daan Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 The main problem here imho is that the bellhouse doesnt have a breather: it is pretty piping hot in there while driving offroad, and if you than go bonnet deep in water, the whole thing cools down and a massive suction will occur, trying to get water in as well as oil from gearbox and engine. I made a breather pipe similar to the axles, gearboxes and timing cover. The last time I looked in there it was dry-ish as it originally was, so it seems to work pretty well. daan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
white90 Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 Any pics Daan? for the Tech Archive Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
istruggle2gate11 Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 The main problem here imho is that the bellhouse doesnt have a breather: it is pretty piping hot in there while driving offroad, and if you than go bonnet deep in water, the whole thing cools down and a massive suction will occur, trying to get water in as well as oil from gearbox and engine. I made a breather pipe similar to the axles, gearboxes and timing cover. The last time I looked in there it was dry-ish as it originally was, so it seems to work pretty well. daan Both DD and myself did this mod a few years back, and Daan mentions, it stays dry ish, Im 99% sure that it is always condensation build up as when the drain plug is removed the water is clean. I dont think you can entirely waterproof the bellhousing, I keep toying with trying positive pressure (when I get hold of a spare air regulator) but my immediate worries have gone since going auto, although it may help a bit in saving the starters life as I seem to kill them regularly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daan Posted January 3, 2008 Share Posted January 3, 2008 Mine: I just drilled the plug and soldered a tube in it. You could probably use the standard banjo set up, if you get the right adapter for it. This has worked for over 10 years though. daan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted January 6, 2008 Author Share Posted January 6, 2008 Well it's all sorted now. Turns out in my haste to get the truck finished I hadn't siliconed the cover plate on so that's how crud got in there, however that's now been seen to. I drilled a hole in the bottom and a hole in the top, flushed it out with the hose with the engine running and it went wonderfully quiet. I tapped the holes and screwed in push-fit fittings, just need some hose and I'll be sorted. The top hole is about 5-6" back from the bellhousing face and you can see the clutch through it looking forwards, or the release bearing looking straight down. I aimed some white grease at the bearing so hopefully that'll help. The fitting underneath will get a blanking plug shoved in, much easier than mucking about with spanners. I reckon it's shielded from damage by the webs of the bellhousing and the fact it's a couple of feet off the ground Underneath Top: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Night Train Posted January 6, 2008 Share Posted January 6, 2008 Looks like a nice neat job there. I'd still be a little worried about the one at the bottom getting scraped when off road but if you know it is safe then that is fine. My bellhousings always looked battered for some reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill van snorkle Posted January 6, 2008 Share Posted January 6, 2008 Well it's all sorted now. Turns out in my haste to get the truck finished I hadn't siliconed the cover plate on so that's how crud got in there, however that's now been seen to. I drilled a hole in the bottom and a hole in the top, flushed it out with the hose with the engine running and it went wonderfully quiet.I tapped the holes and screwed in push-fit fittings, just need some hose and I'll be sorted. The top hole is about 5-6" back from the bellhousing face and you can see the clutch through it looking forwards, or the release bearing looking straight down. I aimed some white grease at the bearing so hopefully that'll help. The fitting underneath will get a blanking plug shoved in, much easier than mucking about with spanners. I reckon it's shielded from damage by the webs of the bellhousing and the fact it's a couple of feet off the ground Underneath Top: I hope it worked for you but I suspect you have squirted grease between the thrust face of the release bearing and the pressure plate rather than into the ball bearings. Clutch release bearings are pretty much sealed and about the only way of getting any lubricant into them once they dry out is to immerse the bearing in a pot of boiling grease or oil, but it must be removed to do that. Bill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted January 6, 2008 Author Share Posted January 6, 2008 Looks like a nice neat job there. I'd still be a little worried about the one at the bottom getting scraped when off road but if you know it is safe then that is fine. My bellhousings always looked battered for some reason. Mine is tucked up quite nicely and is quite high off the ground : Bill - You're right of course, but I'm figuring if there was major crud in the bearing it'd still be noisy. If it's that hard to get oil into it it is presumably equally difficult for it to become washed out in the first place Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Night Train Posted January 6, 2008 Share Posted January 6, 2008 Size isn't everything! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted January 6, 2008 Author Share Posted January 6, 2008 Size isn't everything! Bigger boys made me do it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Night Train Posted January 6, 2008 Share Posted January 6, 2008 Just thinking that I can't talk given that I like having an extra axle on everything along with the corresponding extra few feet of length. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill van snorkle Posted January 6, 2008 Share Posted January 6, 2008 Bill - You're right of course, but I'm figuring if there was major crud in the bearing it'd still be noisy. If it's that hard to get oil into it it is presumably equally difficult for it to become washed out in the first place Yeah but I think the release bearing isn't working as such, and by squirting grease between the face of the thrust bearing and pressure plate this interface now has less friction than the ball bearings, hence the noise going away.Once the grease gets wiped off and dries out it'll probably get noisy again. Hope I'm wrong. Bill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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