NegevLandRover Posted March 22, 2008 Share Posted March 22, 2008 I have an opportunity to pick up a secondhand new detroit rear axel locker. The questions are: 1. are they any good 2. is 400 quid a fair price 3. how difficult is it to install TIA Adam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
white90 Posted March 22, 2008 Share Posted March 22, 2008 For £400 I'd get an ARB for a little more Chris Watts has actually had a detroit and he got rid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smo Posted March 22, 2008 Share Posted March 22, 2008 They take some getting used to with the clunk as they engage/disengage on their own but are generally very good - ideal fit and forget type auto-locker. Whilst Tony suggest an ARB for "a little more" the locker its self will be another £250, then add a compressor to run it and thats another £150 so unless you want to double your budget then forget ARB's! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jules Posted March 22, 2008 Share Posted March 22, 2008 Small hijack.. My racer's previous owner is offering me a Detroit locker very cheap. how ever I have a good ARB front locker in the RRC that could be relocated. does anyone have experience of racing with Detroit's over ARB's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Young bobtail Rhys Posted March 22, 2008 Share Posted March 22, 2008 Would a detroit be better for someone who only uses their truck off road and is on a smaller budget? i.e, me! Or are they not so good as they tend to bring on understeer when trying to turn off road? btw, I have seen the detroits for about £365 new and the arb for £525 plus the compressor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mortus Posted March 22, 2008 Share Posted March 22, 2008 ..........Or are they not so good as they tend to bring on understeer when trying to turn off road?.......... thats what all difflockers do... thats the point in a diff so you dont get that understeer. your not surposed to turn whilst your axle is locked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GBMUD Posted March 22, 2008 Share Posted March 22, 2008 The fact that you cannot turn a Detroit off means that you tend to get understeer in some situations where traction is reduced (especially where traction on the front wheels is limited) - particularly with the shorter wheelbase of a 90. I understand that Range Rovers and 110s are less prone to problems. As White90 suggests, I had one in my 90, was dissapointed and I removed it in favour of an ARB which I never had cause to regret. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Young bobtail Rhys Posted March 22, 2008 Share Posted March 22, 2008 thats what all difflockers do...thats the point in a diff so you dont get that understeer. your not surposed to turn whilst your axle is locked. Yes, I knew that bit, but when off road and the ground is slippery, a detroit won't come out so this will bring on indersteer, therefore a three-point turn. Or spend a bit more and get an arb saving you the three-point turn So, what one is it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GBMUD Posted March 22, 2008 Share Posted March 22, 2008 your not surposed to turn whilst your axle is locked. Sometimes you have limited options. Remember that if there is any residual torque across an ARB that it will not unlock until that residual torque is released. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jericho Posted March 22, 2008 Share Posted March 22, 2008 thats what all difflockers do...thats the point in a diff so you dont get that understeer. your not surposed to turn whilst your axle is locked. Young bobtail Rhys' question is on the mark. Detroit lockers are made to automatically unlock the outer wheel when turning,however,on very low traction surfaces they sometimes fail to unlock when they should,and so they can have the tendancy to push the vehicle straight on in a turn. I think detroits great for general offroading,and I've never had any issues with clunky engagement or on road handling - they work,and you never have to think about whether to engage them - but after running one for the last two years I am changing to a selectable locker (ARB) for the improvement in steering which is so important for trialing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reads90 Posted March 22, 2008 Share Posted March 22, 2008 The fact that you cannot turn a Detroit off means that you tend to get understeer in some situations where traction is reduced (especially where traction on the front wheels is limited) - particularly with the shorter wheelbase of a 90. I understand that Range Rovers and 110s are less prone to problems. As White90 suggests, I had one in my 90, was dissapointed and I removed it in favour of an ARB which I never had cause to regret.Chris I was talking to jules about this last night and told him that (i had heard) a 90 is too light for a detroit locker and therefore does work to its best ina 90. I have personally seen several 90's at differant times with a detroit lockers very stuck in an easy off road postition due to the locker with not disengae and not letting the car turn I have always prefered the ARB as you have 100% control of the locker and the car And BTW for me the detroit is more expensive than an ARB locker so it would definatley have to be the ARB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Young bobtail Rhys Posted March 22, 2008 Share Posted March 22, 2008 Young bobtail Rhys' question is on the mark.Detroit lockers are made to automatically unlock the outer wheel when turning,however,on very low traction surfaces they sometimes fail to unlock when they should,and so they can have the tendancy to push the vehicle straight on in a turn. I think detroits great for general offroading,and I've never had any issues with clunky engagement or on road handling - they work,and you never have to think about whether to engage them - but after running one for the last two years I am changing to a selectable locker (ARB) for the improvement in steering which is so important for trialing. Thank you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m&mv80 Posted March 22, 2008 Share Posted March 22, 2008 i have a detriot fitted on my 90 and i think its great, yes you do get some understeer mainly noticed when driving offroad but also on road you can feel it at times, but if you take your foot off the throttle then its fine and goes round corners just the same as a normal open diff, the other down side is side slopes, the back end tends to slide down when on a side slope, but maybe this is just down to my tyres, to be honest you dont know that its there after a while as you tend to adapt your driving style to suit, (i believe you would have to do this with an arb as well), there is no clunk or bang when it engages as its permenantly locked, you do here it clicking when going round corners though as it has a sort of freewheel device, the difference after i installed it was very noticable and one of the best single modifications i have done to my 90, im not saying its as good as an arb but it is half the price, as for instalation i thought it was quite simple and if you are mechanically minded then you should be able to do this yourself no problem, make sure you have the instructions and correct tools available though (dti guage etc) and make sure the diff your fitting it into is a good one to start with so you dont have to shim the input gear. oh and i think £400 is a bit steep, you can get them new for less than that. martin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jules Posted March 23, 2008 Share Posted March 23, 2008 oh and i think £400 is a bit steep, you can get them new for less than that.martin I would agree with that unless it comes with shafts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickm Posted March 23, 2008 Share Posted March 23, 2008 i have 1 in my 88" cant fault it at all as they said above £400 is way too much new ones are only £350ish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Young bobtail Rhys Posted March 23, 2008 Share Posted March 23, 2008 £345 from ashcroft Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
will_warne Posted March 23, 2008 Share Posted March 23, 2008 Small hijack..My racer's previous owner is offering me a Detroit locker very cheap. how ever I have a good ARB front locker in the RRC that could be relocated. does anyone have experience of racing with Detroit's over ARB's Jules, is it a full locker or a tru-trac? I'd have thought an LSD would be better in the back for racing....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jules Posted March 23, 2008 Share Posted March 23, 2008 Jules, is it a full locker or a tru-trac? I'd have thought an LSD would be better in the back for racing....... Detroit full lock I assume as a tru-trac people normally don't refure to them as locker's very valid point My last racer had a Quaff LSD but there a little pricey how ever I suppose I could flog the 4pin its already got. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark90 Posted March 23, 2008 Share Posted March 23, 2008 Jules I'd agree that for racing an LSD (or torque biasing diff) is the way to go. I had a Detroit locker in my old 90 and it was ok as a poor mans alternative to an ARB, ok for general off roading or challenges but not what I'd want throwing the truck round at speed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimAttrill Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 The manual for the Detroit locker (NOT the Trutrac made by the same people) does not recommend fitting the locker to short wheelbase vehicles. This is defined as less than 127" In practice, the Detroit is unnoticeable in a 130, and works well in a 110. In the 100" Disco it tends to unlock and lock a lot, and this can be pretty noisy. In the 90, if you sneeze it will unlock and so I wouldn't go for one. I do know someone on the forums with a 90 got Ashcrofts to remove his Detroit FOC as they should not have recommended it in the first place.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfredenewman Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 ive got one in a salisbury axle on the rear of my rrc bob i drive it to and from events no probs get a little clunk when it disengages it goes everywhere an arb goes but idont get to play with switches or decide when im going to use it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ashtrans Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 The manual for the Detroit locker (NOT the Trutrac made by the same people) does not recommend fitting the locker to short wheelbase vehicles. This is defined as less than 127" In practice, the Detroit is unnoticeable in a 130, and works well in a 110. In the 100" Disco it tends to unlock and lock a lot, and this can be pretty noisy. In the 90, if you sneeze it will unlock and so I wouldn't go for one. I do know someone on the forums with a 90 got Ashcrofts to remove his Detroit FOC as they should not have recommended it in the first place.. Hi Jim, you're quite right, the longer the wheelbase the better they are but I don't agree with your comment 'they should not have recommended it in the first place', many many people buy them for 90's and I always spell out the downside of the detroit lockers which is they will clunk and bang a bit, this is the dog clutch engaging and disengaging and can sound awful, if you can't live with this then spend a bit more and get an ARB, you get what you pay for, we sell both and are unbiased. a couple of customers have had the detroits fail prematurly and rather than supply a replacement we have just charged them the difference and supplied an ARB, we see quite a lot of the dog clutches failing in the 24 spline detroits , usually, but not always due to a halfshaft failing first. We are in the process of trying to get them to address this as this problem has been there since we got them to develop them the detroit lockers and truetracs for landrovers many years ago, even if they fix this it will stop them failing but will still clunk and bang, we stock and sell them because our customers want them but do we 'recommend' them ? rarly, I wouldn't have one in my car, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Young bobtail Rhys Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 What is the exact price difference between a detroit and an arb with compressor, fitted? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jules Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 I wouldn't have one in my car, Why Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ashtrans Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 Why they have their place in the market as they are simple, easy to fit and cost effective, ideal for farmers, construction vehicles or 'play day' vehicles and other vehicles that are 'off road' biased. it's the 'on road' mannors that let them down, the locker introduces backlash into the diff due to the way the dog clutches work, I wouldn't fit one in my 90 as it's an 07 and I don't want additional backlash and the associated clunking on a new vehicle which is mainly used on the road. It's just used as an auto demonstrator. Some people like them for racing as you can use their sharp locking action to your advantage and use the power to kick the back of the car out. This technique is not suited to the faster rally raid stuff where the quaife or Truetrac is better as it's action is much softer, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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