Petrol Versus Diesel?

[Goldie]

I am about to get myself a Discovery just for playing off road. Will go for maybe a 1995 to keep it cheap and wont be too disheartened if I hurt it..!!

I quite fancy a V8 petrol because of the lovely noise it makes.

But.. Bearing in mind I want to play off road, is the V8 the right thing? Can the V8 be snorkeled to stop water ingress?

Is there any better arguments for me choosing a diesel instead.? Is the 2.5 diesel TD300 say, strong enough? Seems a small engine for a big car..!!

Cheers

Carl..

[suggs]

bit of a 50/50 really.

i have both, Disco V8 and a 90 tdi. V8's dont really like water, its not so much getting water in the engine but its the electrics that suffer. that said there are some V8's out there that seem to do fine in water but the ones ive had never liked it.

power wise the TDi's are fine and can be tweeked up a fair bit, but they do lack the full on grunt of a V8 and they dont have that great roar..

does depend on what off roading you are interested in doing, but most people i know at my club with challege spec trucks run TDi's but theres a few V8 Disco's too..

fitting a snorkel to a V8 or TDi is pretty easy

[smo]

Diesel every time, and preferably a TD5, i hate the older engines with a vengeance! (despite having a 200tdi). Many people will recommend a petrol with a LPG conversion which might be affordable, but a diesel with LPG would be a much better option!

[Guest noggy]

A TD5, actually works out at having almost the same amount of power as a 3.5 EFI V8

and it runs on diesel, but TD5's also have a lot of wiring!

To be honest, V8's are easy to water proof, just a case of extending wires to a high up dry spot.

[smo]

A TD5, actually works out at having almost the same amount of power as a 3.5 EFI V8

and it runs on diesel, but TD5's also have a lot of wiring!

To be honest, V8's are easy to water proof, just a case of extending wires to a high up dry spot.

And wires are something to be scared of why????

[FridgeFreezer]

If it's for on the road you'll probably want the economy of a TDi. The flip side is a V8 will be much cheaper to buy since no-one wants to buy the fuel, for similar money you can get a much nicer vehicle.

Tdi's are flavour of the month off-road because of the waterproofing (it's the ignition that suffers), however that can be overcome (it's been discussed here many times, have a search) and the V8 is ultimately more flexible. A V8 auto is a very easy way to get about off-road.

[Goldie]

Thanks guys.

My daily vehicle is a much newer 4x4 that I cant (wont) risk damaging..!!! So the disco that I go for will be pretty much for off-raoding, and the trip there and back home...

I really am favouring V8 because I am not bothered about the economy. I dont want to go down the Autogas route because that adds a complication I could do without.

I am wondering whether the Range Rover around the 1996 age are ever used for this? Seen plenty of the older range rovers, but not those. Is this for a reason? Are they running the same chassis as the old Rangie?

Cheers

Carl..

[suggs]

the P38 Range rovers are money pits and many suffer with engine falures, and with all the gizmos they have there not best as an off roader.

if you want a cheap way into off roading then a V8 Disco or even an old Rangie (classic shape), cheap and easy to get spares for and plenty of off road toys available

[Mo Murphy]

To be honest, V8's are easy to water proof, just a case of extending wires to a high up dry spot.

:hysterical: :hysterical: :hysterical:

Mo

[Les Henson]

To be honest, V8's are easy to water proof, just a case of extending wires to a high up dry spot.

Les.

[landroversforever]

from what i've read on here megasquirt etc make V8's waterproof?? or have i got the wrong end of the stick?

[Guest noggy]

:hysterical: :hysterical: :hysterical:

Mo

why so funny?

with some sillicon and extending the wires, you can pretty much water proof a V8 on a budget and without too much hassle

now, i know about MS etc but for the simple man rubber glovers and sillion is waay easier!

[Bowie69]

V8s can definitely run under water:

http://forums.lr4x4.com/index.php?showtopic=29083

Wubly

[FridgeFreezer]

from what i've read on here megasquirt etc make V8's waterproof?? or have i got the wrong end of the stick?

No, that's true - ignore the TDi boys, they are just luddites who point at airplanes and think anything involving electricity is dark magic.

The standard V8 setup (with a distributor) can be made reasonably resilient to water up to bonnet depth for brief periods for almost no money - my dad runs a V8 RR and has a total of £20 invested in it - some drainpipe from B&Q for the snorkel, and two ice-cream tubs - one covers the dizzy, one covers the coil. He doesn't go for silly deep water so it works well for what he wants. Moving the ECU from under the seat to somewhere a bit higher is a good move, there's enough slack in the loom to get it up to the dash level, presumably for a plaything you're not going to be aiming to have your knees underwater so you don't need to go mad in that respect. Genuine ignition components will make a big difference too.

MegaSquirt'n'EDIS is a good option to take it a step further, the money you save buying a tidy V8 instead of a TDi would probably cover an install, especially if you install it yourself. You're liable to see better MPG from it too, depending how you drive 20mpg is not unheard of. It's been discussed a lot on here so I won't go over the familiar ground, there's some good tech threads around that explain everything.

The later (P38) range rovers can be potential money pits, which means people are terrified of them. If you're willing to tread new ground, and tackle potential electrical issues, you could get a lot of car for your money - the big V8's are already distributorless, which is a start, and the traction control is well worth having, especially in conjunction with some mud tyres. You can get HD airbags for the suspension too, although a lot of luddites rip them off and put normal coils on.

[Mo Murphy]

why so funny?

with some sillicon and extending the wires, you can pretty much water proof a V8 on a budget and without too much hassle

now, i know about MS etc but for the simple man rubber glovers and sillion is waay easier!

Because Chris, I've been, seen and done and have never been convinced. It's cheap but not particularly effective.

Just because I have a Tdi now doesn't mean I've never had V8s.

There's a reason I have a Tdi now ...

If someone wants a V8 for off road fun, then go for it . I love their point and squirt ability ! But they're carp in water unless you spend some money and do plenty of work.

Mo

[q-rover]

Nothing wrong with a P38, I know it's not 'extreme' but mine goes very well offroad.

[Guest noggy]

Because Chris, I've been, seen and done and have never been convinced. It's cheap but not particularly effective.

Just because I have a Tdi now doesn't mean I've never had V8s.

There's a reason I have a Tdi now ...

If someone wants a V8 for off road fun, then go for it . I love their point and squirt ability ! But they're carp in water unless you spend some money and do plenty of work.

Mo

I surpose i have to agree, after all... i also drive a TDi

[jimmy_neutron]

Nothing wrong with a P38, I know it's not 'extreme' but mine goes very well offroad.

Thats not off roading.

It looks like a farm track.

[FridgeFreezer]

This was later to be seen at Seven Sisters recovering someone's stuck Camel 110, after driving past it to hook the rope on. Standard P38 with a set of muds and a very discrete winch on the front. Seems to do OK!

[landroversforever]

i dont think this is off topic...what are the costs per mile for only fuel (rather than MPG) for, say a RRC on petrol, diesel or LPG??

[nicks90]

This was later to be seen at Seven Sisters recovering someone's stuck Camel 110, after driving past it to hook the rope on. Standard P38 with a set of muds and a very discrete winch on the front. Seems to do OK!

i dont think anyone is doubting that the p38 is ok offroad,

but they are extremely heavy compared to a rangie classic or disco with the interior ripped out. If its just an offroad toy, then lightening the vehicle is a sensible thing to do - binning the seats and carpet etc can shed a fair few KGs........

Plus i would imagine fitting a lift and squeezing 33" tyres under would take a bit more fettling than a simple camel cut - a la disco 1.

With a p38 i would be completely paranoid about the electrics. How long do you think the traction control and other electrical gubbins would last being hammered about seven sisters or frickley?

And one last thing, a defender or tricked up disco looks ok with a few battle scars - gives it character. I think a P38 with a few 'tree nurrrfs' would look proper ropey.

[Escape]

i dont think anyone is doubting that the p38 is ok offroad,

but they are extremely heavy compared to a rangie classic or disco with the interior ripped out. If its just an offroad toy, then lightening the vehicle is a sensible thing to do - binning the seats and carpet etc can shed a fair few KGs........

Plus i would imagine fitting a lift and squeezing 33" tyres under would take a bit more fettling than a simple camel cut - a la disco 1.

With a p38 i would be completely paranoid about the electrics. How long do you think the traction control and other electrical gubbins would last being hammered about seven sisters or frickley?

And one last thing, a defender or tricked up disco looks ok with a few battle scars - gives it character. I think a P38 with a few 'tree nurrrfs' would look proper ropey.

The P38a will actually accomodate bigger tyres then either a DiscoI or RRC, I run 265/75R16 on mine without any modification (I do have longer airsprings, but the EAS settigns are still standard). Weight is not much of an issue either, size however is. The P38a is noticeably wider which complicates things offroad.

You're absolutely right about the battle scars. They just don't carry them as well as older LRs (or even a new Defender). I like to take mine offroading, but only if I'm sure it's damage-free.

One other thing to consider is that a P38a with al the bells and whistles is far too nice a car to use just for offroading. It is nice though to have a daily driver with superbe comfort on road an nevertheless impressive performance offroad, which is the main reason I love mine. For the really rough stuff, she looks good towing a trailer with a tricked out Defender as well.

When it comes to engines, I have experience with both a V8 and diesel on and off the road, and prefer the TD5. I must admit I found the V8 to be let down by it's autobox, I'm sure a manual would have been a lot more to my liking. The (old) Tdi was less impressive, and the BMW 2.5 DT in the P38a is quite disapointing offroad.