russ1 Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 Afternoon Am sitting in the sun and thort i would spec up my new build for my challange truck I want to run 42 or 44 inch tyres but the problem is i am unsure about axles really dont know what to go for. Volvo c303 = hard to come by, would they stand up to hard use with 44s? Spidiertrax axles = When looking at then at billing there had a price up for a landy set up starting at 10K. Rockwells = Hard to get in uk, no lockers etc. Would need lockers, and spare parts etc, Disc brakes would be nice but could get around that. Can any one think of any others, or could throw any info on the above. Not to fussed if i used portals or normal axles. Thanks again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pugwash Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 Mog 404 axles will certainly stand up to that abuse of 44" tyres. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dollythelw Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 toys and longfields, or mog 404s - cheapest solution and yep, Volvos will stand that if they're set up. dana 60s could be worth a wheeze - a mate picked a set up from holland for €300 a couple of months ago or ship in a pair of axles from the US? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6cyltdi Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 Rockwells from a renault trm 2000 are easy enough to pick up here.... rear has a locker.... I'm fitting simca's at present to my series and they should have no problem with that tyre size.. There are good spares availability for either axle and they won't break the bank..... Or toy 80 series axles??? Loads of possibilities depends on what you want/ will be using it for and what you can afford Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pugwash Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 Or toy 80 series axles??? turning into a bit of an ardent 80 series fan here- BUT i have to be honest and say that i wouldn't run 44s through 80 axles- i reckon that's the upper limit of what they would take before being able to guarantee against failure. My longfield CVs have a recommendation not to use above 44" and a locked axle- it doesn't void the warranty though but bobby longfield reckons your starting to take a risk with that size of CV. Having said that guys in the states run rock crawlers with Toy axles and 44s so they can't be hideously unreliable. personally for that sort of size i would look at something a lot beefier than anything originally conceived for a light truck (and yes a landcruiser is still a light truck before i get abuse!)- 303, Mog, rockwell or similar would have to be my choice. Good thing about these is that the portals take care of gearing so you don't have to worry about ring and pinion changes which has to be a benefit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
russ1 Posted July 27, 2008 Author Share Posted July 27, 2008 Thanks for the replys people, never had much to do with toy axles or danas so wouldnt really know where to start with them, Jez; When you say 303s will be ok if set up could you go into that abit more? Thanks Mog 404s = am i right in saying that they are very heavy? Saying that 44s arent goint to be light!! Thanks again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hendrik Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 we had the same question a year ago... all axles have their own benefits and downsides, but at the end we went for Spidertrax axles because of weight, they've been abused and prooved well in US competitions, they're specially built for offroad use, etc etc. Good luck with your choice! H. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dollythelw Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 depending on what you want to spin width wise and how many ponies and ft/lbs.. fresh bearings, correctly built diff, properly set diff lock actuator. if you go for volvos ping me and I'll nose you through it all - we must be doing something right, our stuff keeps holding together If portals arent for you then look seriously for dana 60's how wide a tyre do you wanna fling and how many ponies? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carl hurst Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 Dans 60's are a good base, 35 spline internals will stand upto 44's ford 9" high pinions are strong, Spidertrax use these bits in a custom case but big coin, Dana fronts are rare in uk so you may need to import and you need to look at what truck it came from as the choice of dana's is large as they are on fords,chevys,dodge etc and all slightly differant, I'me building a set for my truck that will run 44"s and have just about got it sused out,even building my own casings and and machining the bits it still is'nt cheep but they will be bomb prof, Carl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
callum Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 turning into a bit of an ardent 80 series fan here- BUT i have to be honest and say that i wouldn't run 44s through 80 axles- i reckon that's the upper limit of what they would take before being able to guarantee against failure. My longfield CVs have a recommendation not to use above 44" and a locked axle- it doesn't void the warranty though but bobby longfield reckons your starting to take a risk with that size of CV. Having said that guys in the states run rock crawlers with Toy axles and 44s so they can't be hideously unreliable. personally for that sort of size i would look at something a lot beefier than anything originally conceived for a light truck (and yes a landcruiser is still a light truck before i get abuse!)- 303, Mog, rockwell or similar would have to be my choice. Good thing about these is that the portals take care of gearing so you don't have to worry about ring and pinion changes which has to be a benefit. longfield don't seem to recommend over 39" for their stuff. the 80 series front would object to such large tyres, its only an 8" mini truck diff and reverse cut. reversing out of a hole, it would probably ping like a rover diff. the back is 9.5" (i think, or thereabouts) so is a bit stronger. best bet from the toyota stable is the 60 series i think, full sized diffs front and rear and cable lockers if you get the right ones. smaller cv's than an 80, but the 80 cv's are much stronger than the diff into which they connect so they are of little advantage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carl hurst Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 Another point to consider is the gearing,you will need to look at your ratios in trans box and ring and pinions and if you go portal with 44's then your truck will be very tall to the point that it will want to flip end over when you go down hill, Carl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
russ1 Posted July 27, 2008 Author Share Posted July 27, 2008 depending on what you want to spin width wise and how many ponies and ft/lbs.. fresh bearings, correctly built diff, properly set diff lock actuator. if you go for volvos ping me and I'll nose you through it all - we must be doing something right, our stuff keeps holding together If portals arent for you then look seriously for dana 60's how wide a tyre do you wanna fling and how many ponies? Portals have there plus points! Tyre wise would be heading the bogger route, 44s work out to 19.5 couldnt find any 42s in a 16.5 rim but 39.5 ( could be another choice ) work out to 18. Power wise iwould be going for a tuned rover v8. You havnt got any 303s flooting about that you dont want do you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dollythelw Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 ping me your email addy and I'll send you some links - theres a few places about saying they have stock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pugwash Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 longfield don't seem to recommend over 39" for their stuff. the 80 series front would object to such large tyres, its only an 8" mini truck diff and reverse cut. reversing out of a hole, it would probably ping like a rover diff. the back is 9.5" (i think, or thereabouts) so is a bit stronger. best bet from the toyota stable is the 60 series i think, full sized diffs front and rear and cable lockers if you get the right ones. smaller cv's than an 80, but the 80 cv's are much stronger than the diff into which they connect so they are of little advantage. Well the blurb with the longfield CVs for the FJ80 superset (including strengthened halfshafts) said "we dont' recommend welded spool with over 42" tyres". When i phoned and spoke to bobby longfield i was told that he was happy for the CVs to run up to 44" and warrantied that against breakages. Dont forget that they are hypoid diffs so that little bit stronger- guys in the states are crawling with them with 42" tyres and dont pop diffs so they've got to be quite strong. I'm certainly not aware of any diff issues on 80 series axles on either ih8mud or pirate. Of course one benefit is that you can re-gear the axles very cheaply and easily on the 80 stuff so reducing some of the strain on the diff. Unfortunately my 80 doesn't have huge tyres- they are only 33" MTs, but i wouldn't hesitate to run up to 38" even with my lardy arsed truck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtydiesel Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 Volvo's are a little girly for 44's but they are light. Rockwells, bloody heavy and would cost a fortune in disc brakes and lockers, and most of the ones you'll find in the uk have the smaler weak shafts in them. Dana 60's, you'll need the 44's to get some ground clearance back, can be built really tough but spendy. Toys, don't stand a chance. Nissans, much the same as toy's but they might live a little longer. Mog 404's, 44's are just about within there limits, spendy on disc and pinion conversions. heavy but not that bad. Full fat mogs, will laugh at 44's, most come factory disked, spendy pinion conversions on these and weigh nearly as much as the rockwells. Cost, weight, strength. pick any two. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtydiesel Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 Another point to consider is the gearing,you will need to look at your ratios in trans box and ring and pinions and if you go portal with 44's then your truck will be very tall to the point that it will want to flip end over when you go down hill,Carl. And you know this how? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheeppimp Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 And you know this how? everyone knows portals make trucks fall over and small kittens explode Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carl hurst Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 And you know this how? Ask alan kemp about being unstable,Dan, your truck is not to tall so may compensate, A Dana 60 diff is the same size as a sailsbury so chop it out and use the ford 9" high pinions to get the clearance back, still uses D60 internals without the bulk, Carl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pugwash Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 Ask alan kemp about being unstable,Dan, your truck is not to tall so may compensate,A Dana 60 diff is the same size as a sailsbury so chop it out and use the ford 9" high pinions to get the clearance back, still uses D60 internals without the bulk, Carl. My vapour build, based on a range rover, has a roofline 2" higher than other challenge prepped rangies- and most of that is due to tyre size. Of course the good thing about mog axles is that they reduce your centre of gravity so making the truck more stable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dollythelw Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 Im only on 40's but never found stability to be an issue - bear in mind Carl a 44x19 Bogger is a heavy old bit of rubber to fling (65kgs plus wheel) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carl hurst Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 My vapour build, based on a range rover, has a roofline 2" higher than other challenge prepped rangies- and most of that is due to tyre size. Of course the good thing about mog axles is that they reduce your centre of gravity so making the truck more stable. Yes if you get everyting else spot on as in engine position,lengh of wheel base suspension etc, it will be stable but my point was that going down hill the centre of gravity shifts and the front axle becomes a fulcrum an gets scary,not saying portals are no good just that the set up is very important,more than a normal beam axle set up, Carl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hendrik Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 Im only on 40's but never found stability to be an issue - bear in mind Carl a 44x19 Bogger is a heavy old bit of rubber to fling (65kgs plus wheel) indeed F*ckin heavy... we have done the test and it was 87kgs for a 44" bogger with steel beadlock wheel (MRW). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dollythelw Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 the nice thing though Hendrik as you know they stick to the ground like a magnet - not so good when you try to fit them to the car on your own without a shovel to help though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 if you go portal with 44's then your truck will be very tall to the point that it will want to flip end over when you go down hill,Carl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carl hurst Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 ? Carl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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