aerocorey Posted December 6, 2008 Share Posted December 6, 2008 How do I pre-heat my Defender? It would seem that my glow plugs aren't coming on. Is there some trick with the key to get it to pre-heat? I'm beginning to suspect I have a bad heat/start switch. This is very concerning because It's cold here. I'm going to have to wire a seperate switch if the stock switch is inop. Also, I am digging into the wiring. I found that when I applied 12V to the spade connector for the glow plugs none of the lights on the cluster illuminated. The glow plug light wire goes to a black rectangluar 5 pin connector behind the cluster that was plugged into a matching black connector. I swapped it so it's now plugged into a white connector of the same style. Now when I apply 12V to the glow plugs an amber light with a picture of a choke on the cluster lights up. This leads me to believe that I've moved a plug from the wrong location to the right location, but now I wonder what goes to the unused black connector. Any insight? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted December 6, 2008 Share Posted December 6, 2008 the unused connector could be for a petrol engined vehicle, so as you've got the glowplug [choke] warning light working leave it as it is now. when you switch on these warning lights should come on. oil pressure [red oil can] charge light [red battery] glowplug [choke -- amber] park brake [red -- if switch is fitted] the glowplugs are on a timer relay & after approx 8 seconds the glowplug light should go out, then start the engine as normal, during this stage you'll see a brief bulb check of the brake system [red] come on then go off, that is normal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aerocorey Posted December 6, 2008 Author Share Posted December 6, 2008 the unused connector could be for a petrol engined vehicle, so as you've got the glowplug [choke] warning light working leave it as it is now.when you switch on these warning lights should come on. oil pressure [red oil can] charge light [red battery] glowplug [choke -- amber] park brake [red -- if switch is fitted] the glowplugs are on a timer relay & after approx 8 seconds the glowplug light should go out, then start the engine as normal, during this stage you'll see a brief bulb check of the brake system [red] come on then go off, that is normal. So what do I replace if everything is plugged in and I don't get glow plugs when I turn the key on? Can I disassemble the heat/start switch and fix it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted December 6, 2008 Share Posted December 6, 2008 I see from your signature it's a 2.5TD vehicle, but I guessing it now has a 200Tdi engine fitted, if that's correct, reconnect the ignition switch wiring as per this thread here the thick brown/red terminal needs to be disconnected & insulated as it's not required. hth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aerocorey Posted December 6, 2008 Author Share Posted December 6, 2008 I see from your signature it's a 2.5TD vehicle, but I guessing it now has a 200Tdi engine fitted, if that's correct, reconnect the ignition switch wiring as per this thread here the thick brown/red terminal needs to be disconnected & insulated as it's not required.hth On my truck the brown/red wire runs from terminal #1 straight out the firewall to the glow plugs. No detours whatsoever, straight shot. How are the glow plugs going to heat if I unplug it? I suspect the engine hasn't been swapped to a 200Tdi. How can I tell for sure? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted December 6, 2008 Share Posted December 6, 2008 You have a 2.5 TD engine fitted & that's the TD engine wiring, if you disconnect the brown/red wire from the battery or number 4 glowplug [nearest the bulkhead [firewall] then the glowplugs won't work, both ends must be connected & connected to the terminal on the ignition switch. glowplug operation on these older TD engines means you get in, key in ignition, turn the key until the oil pressure/battery & choke lights come on/hold it for 10 to 15 seconds then twist to start the engine. apologies for giving you the wrong info, I wasn't 100% sure which engine was fitted. a 200tdi has a alloy cylinder head & rocker cover with either a green or yellow oil fill cap & the injection pump is a different type to the TD engine too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aerocorey Posted December 6, 2008 Author Share Posted December 6, 2008 This brings me back to my original question. Everything is plugged in, glow plugs don't come on. I've also confirmed with a multimeter that there is no power at terminal #1 on the start switch. Do I need to replace the switch or can I take it apart and fix it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted December 6, 2008 Share Posted December 6, 2008 got to be a dead start switch then, I'm not sure if it's possible to strip the start switch for repair, probably easier & quicker to obtain a new or known good switch & replace the existing one, make sure you draw a diagram of where the wires on the start switch go, it will help a great deal when you do change it. in the thread link above is a Lucas part number for the start switch. have you removed the glowplugs & tested them ? to test you need a good battery, a set of jump leads & a pair of pliers. hold the glowplug body with the pliers. connect one jump lead to the glow plug body & other end of jump lead to the battery's Negative [ground] terminal. connect the 2nd jump lead to the threaded end of the glowplug [where the wire would connect] then the other end of jump lead to the battery Positive terminal. with 10 to 15 seconds the glowplug tip should glow red hot [DO NOT touch it] disconnect the pos lead from the battery & place the glowplug on the ground, disconnect the leads & test the other 3 in the same way, if all 4 glowplugs are good & glow in a similar time scale, then you can refit them to the engine, if any of them don't work, replace with new items. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aerocorey Posted December 6, 2008 Author Share Posted December 6, 2008 Why would I test the glow plugs to see why the switch isn't sending 12V to the glow plugs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted December 6, 2008 Share Posted December 6, 2008 Why would I test the glow plugs to see why the switch isn't sending 12V to the glow plugs? not what I meant as the system would still work even with a duff glowplug, just wondered if you knew the glowplugs were all OK. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monster Posted December 7, 2008 Share Posted December 7, 2008 Can you just confirm what ignition switch you have. Is it the petrol version(or tdi as same) or td one? The one that is OFF, IGN, turn against spring slightly for heater plugs, turn fully for start? (td) Or OFF, ACC, IGN, turn to Start? (tdi) I suspect that you have the first one. If so, I recommend you fit a high amperage relay(not timer like you currently have) instead of using the ignition switch to supply feed for the heater plugs. That is what i did. The ignition switch really isnt ideal for this role. This guy had a similar problem.military hope this of help. If not let me know i will try and clarify. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aerocorey Posted December 7, 2008 Author Share Posted December 7, 2008 Can you just confirm what ignition switch you have.Is it the petrol version(or tdi as same) or td one? The one that is OFF, IGN, turn against spring slightly for heater plugs, turn fully for start? (td) Or OFF, ACC, IGN, turn to Start? (tdi) I suspect that you have the first one. If so, I recommend you fit a high amperage relay(not timer like you currently have) instead of using the ignition switch to supply feed for the heater plugs. That is what i did. The ignition switch really isnt ideal for this role. This guy had a similar problem.military hope this of help. If not let me know i will try and clarify. I have the first style. If my switch is bad I'm planning to do exactly as described in the link you provided. I did learn something from you though. I haven't been holding the key slightly into the springy part of the turn when I want the glow plugs on. That was the meat and taters of my question..."Is there some trick with the key to get it to pre-heat?". I'll go try that and see if I get glow plugs. To be clear...there are no relays in my glow plug system. It's just the heat/start switch, 1 wire going out the firewall to the glow plugs, and 1 wire going to the light on the cluster attached to the same spade on the heat/start switch as the glow plug wire. It's suposed to be controlled by an 8 second timer which is integral to the heat/start switch and requires no action from me to power the glow plugs other than to hold the key slightly into the springy part of the turn. Is this all correct? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted December 7, 2008 Share Posted December 7, 2008 you can retrofit the tdi glowplug timer relay if you use it's associated wiring, but the glowplugs in your engine take longer to heat than tdi glowplugs. Wiring [from http://www.nicksjungle.co.uk/200%20Tdi%20Conversion.html] The wiring is practically the same as the wiring for the other diesels. The original battery lead can be reused. Because Land Rover Actually did the 200 Tdi as a proper Retrofit you can buy alot of parts off the shelf. I joined the vehicle engine connector to the engine connector as it's the same, the colour coding of the looms was identical. When buying your engine, make sure you get the glow plug timer relay located on the bulkhead if you lucky you could take the wiring right back to the dash. You can buy the loom for this off Land Rover or make your own, I bought it because wiring isn't my strong point and so that you lovely people can copy it! the Cable is 7ft long the brown and yellow/black wires are 5mm and the others are 2mm. The cable PRC 6083 has a plug which connects to the glowplug timer and a yellow/black cable which goes to the screw on glow plug number 4. the thick brown cable goes to the battery +. Cable STC 934 plugs into PRC 6083 and the black/white wire screws to the bulkhead. At the other end of it the white/red cable goes to the white/red on the back of the igniton and the connector with both the whites goes to the white on the the ignition, they both have piggyback connectors. The yellow/black wire goes to the spade on the bottom of the orange looking square light on the warning panel and the other white goes to the top spade. Timer_relay_connections.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aerocorey Posted December 7, 2008 Author Share Posted December 7, 2008 Western, you are clearly the go-to guy for info about electronic upgrades. I appreciate all the info. I just spent 2 days tearing apart, sorting, and organizing all of the wiring in my new (to me) truck. Now that I have the diesel connector hooked up and I know where to hold the key (thanks to Monster) my glow plugs and glow plug indication work like a charm. I'm gonna stay with the stock setup for now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted December 7, 2008 Share Posted December 7, 2008 good to read you got it working, a succesful day Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lars L Posted December 7, 2008 Share Posted December 7, 2008 Pardon me, but I think you are confusing the guy... If the engine indeed is a TD (?), why fuzz with a glowplug timer for a Tdi? Using this, it will only make the plugs lukewarm at best, not glowing and ready to start cranking. The TD, and the n/a, has a different system as you have found out by now. My 110 has no relay, just a thick cable from the ignition switch to the rearmost glowplug as standard. There are however more effective glowplugs around that need only 5-10 seconds to glow. Here (Sweden) I bought a set at an accessories shop and recommended for Peugeot J9 van. Made a big difference when coldstarting my n/a, Sorry if I kick in open doors... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted December 7, 2008 Share Posted December 7, 2008 as corey has got it sorted, the tdi glowplug info is just that, so if he decides to fit a timer that would be the quickest way using LR parts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aerocorey Posted December 7, 2008 Author Share Posted December 7, 2008 Pardon me, but I think you are confusing the guy... If the engine indeed is a TD (?), why fuzz with a glowplug timer for a Tdi? Using this, it will only make the plugs lukewarm at best, not glowing and ready to start cranking.The TD, and the n/a, has a different system as you have found out by now. My 110 has no relay, just a thick cable from the ignition switch to the rearmost glowplug as standard. There are however more effective glowplugs around that need only 5-10 seconds to glow. Here (Sweden) I bought a set at an accessories shop and recommended for Peugeot J9 van. Made a big difference when coldstarting my n/a, Sorry if I kick in open doors... I find it a little confusing as well, but it's all good stuff to know. I'm not interested in fitting a timer or any relays. All I really needed was to know how to properly work my heat/start switch. All is well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lars L Posted December 7, 2008 Share Posted December 7, 2008 Indeed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted December 7, 2008 Share Posted December 7, 2008 OK, I apologies for any confusion, but it wasn't made clear which engine is fitted & Yes, I did spot it in your sig later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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