geoffbeaumont Posted February 15, 2006 Share Posted February 15, 2006 Got a 105Amp Bosch alternator out of a Mondeo today to replace the ailing original item. Only one catch, it's got an extra wire...where does green and black go to? Anyone making chocolate references will be shot at dawn... It's got red and black, white and black and the big hefty orange one same as the lucas. What do I do with the extra wire? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landrover598 Posted February 15, 2006 Share Posted February 15, 2006 Rev counter ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted February 15, 2006 Share Posted February 15, 2006 Got any markings on it or a piccy to help us? What Tony said gets my vote - rev counter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geoffbeaumont Posted February 15, 2006 Author Share Posted February 15, 2006 Got any markings on it or a piccy to help us?What Tony said gets my vote - rev counter. Or to put it another way - ignore it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minivin Posted February 15, 2006 Share Posted February 15, 2006 As posted in Rangie forum, IIRC Green with Black trace is the "charge signal" which goes upto the charge light in your dash Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geoffbeaumont Posted February 15, 2006 Author Share Posted February 15, 2006 Or to put it another way - ignore it According to RangeRovers.net the white and slate wire goes to the alternator. That's for another alternator with the same wires as my old one, though. The wires on this one are just labeled 1,2,3 on the multiplug - no other identifiers on the plug or alternator. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minivin Posted February 15, 2006 Share Posted February 15, 2006 No no, my bad, Brown with Yellow trace is charge light, only other references I can find out of the rangie schematics is a ignition switched feed, got my lucas list somewhere around here..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geoffbeaumont Posted February 15, 2006 Author Share Posted February 15, 2006 Erse - this isn't even close to a drop in replacement. The bracket's far too wide for the alternator. Wonder how secure it'd be if I removed the bottom lug? Looks like the only way forward - modifying the bracket would mean removing it from the engine, and that means removing all the ancillary brackets on this side of the block Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landrover598 Posted February 15, 2006 Share Posted February 15, 2006 Duck tape and bailing twine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geoffbeaumont Posted February 15, 2006 Author Share Posted February 15, 2006 Duck tape and bailing twine Nearly...hacksaw attack followed by cable ties...scrapheap challenge here I come Looking at this and this, I reckon the red wire actually needs to go to the battery terminal (seems to go to the starter motor on some cars (fig 2.3.1c)? It's thicker than the white and green wires (under the light in here I think they're white/green and green/black). The red is just plain red. Help I'm a bit out of my depth here... So my current thinking is: Red to battery post white/green to tacho (existing white/black) green/black to charge light (existing brown/yellow) Sound any good? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmgemini Posted February 15, 2006 Share Posted February 15, 2006 Geoff. Get hold of a Ford workshop manual. The wiring codes will be in there. Ford,Vauxhaul and Peugeot use a completly different wiring code to what Lucas do. I eat rat poison mike I can cause trouble in an empty house. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geoffbeaumont Posted February 15, 2006 Author Share Posted February 15, 2006 Okay - Jonathan and his DVM to the rescue: red to battery post (must be connected or charge light doesn't work) green/black to charge light (existing brown/yellow) white/green leave disconnected. It's not a tacho input, whatever it is... I've got no tacho for now, but I can live with that. Cable ties got an upgrade to binder twine and it's all reasonably secure Running beautifully again Thanks all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minivin Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 suppose green/black to brown/yellow makes sense as the green/black is normally an ignition switched feed, which it is after it's gone through the bulb job done anyway Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geoffbeaumont Posted February 16, 2006 Author Share Posted February 16, 2006 suppose green/black to brown/yellow makes sense as the green/black is normally an ignition switched feed, which it is after it's gone through the bulb job done anyway Apart from one small detail - I forgot that while I operate just fine without a tacho signal, the EAS controller is a little more picky It will happily lower the suspension (on a whim, per standard operation...) but won't pump it up unless engine revs are above a certain limit. Spot the flaw... Think I'll be looking that EAS ECU pinout out tonight, Tony Might just motivate me to get a move on with the EDIS stuff too, since that'll give me a tach signal. Wonder if I can sort it out before the weekend...I was planning on putting in an appearance at Llanerchindda on saturday Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minivin Posted February 16, 2006 Share Posted February 16, 2006 Elektricks, luv'em Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geoffbeaumont Posted February 16, 2006 Author Share Posted February 16, 2006 Elektricks, luv'em Think I'm going to get one of them clattery old diseasels with those stone age coil spring thingummies... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geoffbeaumont Posted February 16, 2006 Author Share Posted February 16, 2006 Wonder if I can sort it out before the weekend...I was planning on putting in an appearance at Llanerchindda on saturday Well, the Escort's gone, but it's new owners turned up to collect it during what little was left of my truck fixing window after some idiot spilled petrol all over the M42 so I won't be seeing you all in Wales this weekend Have fun! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simonr Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 Well, the Escort's gone, but it's new owners turned up to collect it during what little was left of my truck fixing window after some idiot spilled petrol all over the M42 so I won't be seeing you all in Wales this weekend Have fun! It is a tacho feed! But it is not pulsed as you might expect. Have you ever wondered why the tacho reads right regardless of the size of the pulley? It still reads right if you change the pulley or alternator? This is dead clever! The wire is a feed from the unregulated power output of the alternator. When the engine is running, when each cylinder fires, the engine accelerates a tiny bit and then slows down before the next one fires. This gives a tiny ripple in the unregulated alternator output. The rev counter just counts the ripples. The output usually sits at about 6v - but you will need a sillyscope to see the ripples. Si Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmgemini Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 It is a tacho feed! But it is not pulsed as you might expect.Have you ever wondered why the tacho reads right regardless of the size of the pulley? It still reads right if you change the pulley or alternator? This is dead clever! The wire is a feed from the unregulated power output of the alternator. When the engine is running, when each cylinder fires, the engine accelerates a tiny bit and then slows down before the next one fires. This gives a tiny ripple in the unregulated alternator output. The rev counter just counts the ripples. The output usually sits at about 6v - but you will need a sillyscope to see the ripples. Si Thank you Simon for those words. I spent a lot of time last year trying to find out why this was the case. You are only the second person to tell mye this. I eat rat poison mike I can cause trouble in an empty houise !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonk Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 which mondeo did the alternator come out of? how old? i thought they were less amperage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minivin Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 which mondeo did the alternator come out of? how old? i thought they were less amperage Thought you had no room left on your modifications list Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geoffbeaumont Posted February 17, 2006 Author Share Posted February 17, 2006 which mondeo did the alternator come out of? how old? i thought they were less amperage A mark 2 - hard to say more than that, there wasn't much left of it! I'm guessing it was either high spec with lots of toys or a diseasel? The 90Amp alternators I found at Stirchley breakers where, I think, a different fitting and maybe would drop straight on to a Land Rover bracket? I wonder if they were from mark 1 Mondeos? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonk Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 i already run the early 90 amp type, and yes they basically bolt straight on. different mounts on later ones could be a pain though, i'll have a looksie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geoffbeaumont Posted February 17, 2006 Author Share Posted February 17, 2006 It is a tacho feed! But it is not pulsed as you might expect.Have you ever wondered why the tacho reads right regardless of the size of the pulley? It still reads right if you change the pulley or alternator? This is dead clever! The wire is a feed from the unregulated power output of the alternator. When the engine is running, when each cylinder fires, the engine accelerates a tiny bit and then slows down before the next one fires. This gives a tiny ripple in the unregulated alternator output. The rev counter just counts the ripples. The output usually sits at about 6v - but you will need a sillyscope to see the ripples. Si So do the Ford and Land Rover alternator feeds work differently then? Any idea how they compare to the one from an EDIS unit (I'm hazarding a wild guess that will be pulsed - might have to ask on the Megasquirt forums)? Wondered how on earth the tach could work effectively off the alternator! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geoffbeaumont Posted February 18, 2006 Author Share Posted February 18, 2006 So do the Ford and Land Rover alternator feeds work differently then? Any idea how they compare to the one from an EDIS unit (I'm hazarding a wild guess that will be pulsed - might have to ask on the Megasquirt forums)?Wondered how on earth the tach could work effectively off the alternator! Jonathan said he put his DVM on the tach feed from the new alternator when we were figuring out the wiring, and it was giving a pulsed output - so was I right and Ford are using a pulsed tacho signal where Land Rover were using the slightly wavy 6V DC that Simon described? If so, the easiest fix is probably going to be to by the right alternator for the vechicle...tacho I can live without, suspension I can't! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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