fender1234 Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 ive now got 3 broken tdi stater motors, can anyone tell me how to rebuild them and where to get parts? next question, does anyone know why my 90 eats starter motors for breakfast? thanks in advance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 which bit is busted, that will give you a clue to find the suspect part. either to much power going to the solenoid or a mechanical fault. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orgasmic Farmer Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 If they are genuine ones and they just start clicking and for a while eventually starting but then give up altogether it is probably the small engaging cog (technical term!) that has seized on its spiral shaft. Very easy to dismantle, soak in easing oil. Knock it up and down on the bench a few times, slap some grease on and it will be as good as new. If its a cheap Britpart one then i'm afraid its knackered!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fender1234 Posted February 9, 2009 Author Share Posted February 9, 2009 All three of them are genuine ones and have done exactly as Orgasmicfarmer said they click for a while then work but progressively get worse and then just click, sounds like it may be possible to fix them Also when they were almost gone they would turn over really slowly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 use some brake cleaner or similar to clean the bendix run & lightly oil it afterwards, the bit that spins out to engage the ring gear should move easily by hand & not be stiff along is run & should spring back to the diusengaged position when you release your grip. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fender1234 Posted February 9, 2009 Author Share Posted February 9, 2009 thanks alot western few quick questions: 1. bendix run not sure what that is? 2. is the fact that when they do work it turns over slowly another problem or is that just because the gear is seizing? thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orgasmic Farmer Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 Its the spiral that kicks out the little gear that enganges the flywheel!. If they are all genuine then chances are they will all be good as knew if you clean them up as described. Perhaps you have been in deep water? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fender1234 Posted February 9, 2009 Author Share Posted February 9, 2009 to be honest i havnt been through much water but all the motors have worked less well when the engine has been run for a while so i wondered if it could be heat related? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 bendix run as O.F has noted above, seems strange, my 200Tdi is still running with it's original starter from new [nearly 15 years now] & I've never had any start problem with it. if the lazy starting still persist after cleaning, it maybe a soleniod fault or just dirty connections, clean the engine to chassis earth lead terminals before you do the first start after refitting the starter motor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fender1234 Posted February 9, 2009 Author Share Posted February 9, 2009 cheers lads i will crack on tomorow, so do i take the starter apart to clean and free up the gear and bendix run? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Henson Posted February 10, 2009 Share Posted February 10, 2009 Solenoids are available for about £30 and they are usually held on with just a couple of screws/bolts/frame fixings. The solenoids can't be dismantled other than removing the plunger and spring, which should be clean and only lightly oiled. The plunger connects to a lever that pivots on the alloy casing and then connects to a one-way clutch/bendix gear that sits over the end of the main motor shaft. The solenoid does two things - it connects power to the main starter motor and also flings the bendix gear forwards to engage in the flywheel. There are two heavy contacts in the back of the solenoid to provide power to the main starter, and the plunger moving forward due to a magnetic field, engages the gear with the flywheel. You can test the electrical side of the solenoid by checking current flow in the exciter wire (the thin one) when the ignition is turned to the start position. With the ignition key held in the same position - there should be current in the thick wire that goes from the back of the solenoid to the starter main body. When you remove the solenoid - pay attention to how the plunger is connected to the arm, where the pivot point is, and how it's attached to the bendix gear. Remove the solenoid, unbolt the alloy nose casing, and remove it - along with the pivot arm, directional clutch/bendix gear. On the opposite end of the starter is the brush pack (4 carbon brushes). Unscrew it and lift it away (it'll still be attached by a high-temp soldered joint). The brushes may be stuck in their slides or worn (they should pop out to the limit of the spring/wire that retains then in their respective guides. Stuck brushes can be freed off with brake cleaner and careful manipulation, but be careful - they are quite brittle and can break quite easily. If the brushes are worn, you will have a job getting them and you will need a high temperature soldering iron to attach them. Clean the area that the brushes contact, and when you come to refit the brush pack - there is a small hole in the plate. You push each brush back into it's housing, then put a paper clip or similar through each hole and release the brush. The clip will retain each brush back in the housing. Clean and regrease the bush in the centre of the brush pack and refit the pack. Once in place, remove the clips and the brushes will spring forward into position. Clean the bendix and shaft end and then slide the bendix gear back onto the shaft and check it runs up and down smoothly, clean and regrease the bush in the nose of the alloy housing. The gear and shaft are designed to run dry, so if you put grease/heavy oil on the shaft and gear - clutch dust etc, will stick and may gum up the bendix again in the future. The directional clutch will only turn one way - this is so that when the engine starts, the flywheel runs away and the clutch allows this to happen without the engine running the starter. Most common problems with starters are poor electrical connections (earth as well), dirt on the bendix/jammed solenoid plunger preventing engagement (motor whines but doesn't turn the engine). Solenoid failure (nothing happens at all). Worn/disengaged brushes (click, but nothing else). Very noisy starter motor - it's come loose or it's knackered. Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fender1234 Posted February 10, 2009 Author Share Posted February 10, 2009 thanks for all that info les i will start taking it apart and see what i can find. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fender1234 Posted February 10, 2009 Author Share Posted February 10, 2009 right over lunch i decided to test 2 of the motors the results were: 1. the gear/bendix thingy was seized so it just clicked but i assumed the motor would probably be fine. 2. the gear/bendix thingy looked brand and but the motor didnt work. so i pulled both apart and i used the solanoid, bendix gear part and bolted that to the motor that i assumed worked and tested it and it worked a treat so i now have one working starter motor. Im going to try and work out whats wrong with the other one but will put this one on the vehicle first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Henson Posted February 10, 2009 Share Posted February 10, 2009 A weak starter motor may well appear to work fine when you test it with a set of jump leads, but not or very slowly turn the engine when you fit it. If the stater kicks violently when you jump it on the floor, then it's fairly safe to assume it's fine. Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fender1234 Posted February 10, 2009 Author Share Posted February 10, 2009 it does kick when i tested it, but i dont know what you would consider violent? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Henson Posted February 10, 2009 Share Posted February 10, 2009 You need to put your foot on it or it tries to spin across the floor. Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fender1234 Posted February 10, 2009 Author Share Posted February 10, 2009 i felt it trying to twist with my foot on it, shall i try without my foot and see what happens ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Henson Posted February 10, 2009 Share Posted February 10, 2009 Go-on then Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fender1234 Posted February 10, 2009 Author Share Posted February 10, 2009 i will take a picture of my shed with a starter motor shaped hole in it later Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Briarston Posted February 10, 2009 Share Posted February 10, 2009 i will take a picture of my shed with a starter motor shaped hole in it later Hello You might also like to have a close look at the braided lead which runs from the solenoid into the motor casing. They have been known to corrode away inside the rubber gromit. Less cable thickness results in less power to the motor, and any broken ends arcing burn more strands until there are none left = motor doesn't turn. While a new "pig tail" can be obtained, modern motors seem to have alloy windings, which makes it difficult to attach a new lead. The original (copper) lead is somehow fused to the alloy. What price progress?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted February 10, 2009 Share Posted February 10, 2009 i will take a picture of my shed with a starter motor shaped hole in it later so where's the picture of the new door in the shed then Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fender1234 Posted February 11, 2009 Author Share Posted February 11, 2009 so where's the picture of the new door in the shed then It wasn't as exciting as i was hoping it just jumped about 3 inchs to the side Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fender1234 Posted February 11, 2009 Author Share Posted February 11, 2009 all sorted now changed the starters over in my lunch break and it worked a treat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 well done Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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