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Parabolics and Extended military shackles on a lwt


Icedmunkie

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Just got myself a set of parabolics, and wondering what problems I would get by putting military extended shackles all round it on a lightweight?

I have heard of steering issues and prop problems.. anybody know for sure??

I did it on mine, the steering becomes alot harder and you will experience alot of vibration. Particularly off the front prop!

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I draw a lot of flack for saying it, but I will stand my ground. You can't mix long shackles with a standard chassis unless you alter the angle of the axle spring seats too (wedges, etc), or the prop UJ deflection angles will be uneven, causing vibration and damage to the prop, diff, half shafts and transfer box.

Parabolics and 7.50 tyres will be more than sufficient on an 88, especially an air-portable. The low points will not be moved up, regardless of the suspension lift you give it, because the low spots are the diffs. the only way of improving their clearance is fitting portal axles, nd in that case I'd argue that fitting flatter springs to short shackles would be the best option.

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I draw a lot of flack for saying it, but I will stand my ground. You can't mix long shackles with a standard chassis unless you alter the angle of the axle spring seats too (wedges, etc), or the prop UJ deflection angles will be uneven, causing vibration and damage to the prop, diff, half shafts and transfer box.

I'd compeletly agree.

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Thanks for the reply, I wasn't aiming to get more ground clearance but just wanted to make it taller that all. I don't think I will bother to be honest, I have a friend who is making wedges and stuff up for his 88 so will see how his goes.

Also may fit 900x16's on 8 spokes, anybody had issues or anything I need to know about?

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The wedges dont work as you simply cant keep the U bolts tight. You need to make a more permanent change.

I simply ground the existing spring seats on my front axle to correct the castor.

9.00's will run on the rear wheel boxes unless you cut them out, and unless you run sill offset rims you'll end up with next to no steering lock.

Jon

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Thanks for the reply, I wasn't aiming to get more ground clearance but just wanted to make it taller that all.

Is this some kind of grand scheme to make it so that one no longer needs a ramp to walk underneath? :ph34r:

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Yes Rich, its not hard being this short lol!!

Cheers for the advice, I will look into it further..

What do you mean by Sill offset rims? Such as?

*Silly*

Probably atleast 2-3 inch over standard offset i would have thought.

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Hey munks dont worry bout vibrations off the front prop, if you have freewheeling hubs your prop wont be turning on the road. I've this set up on mine and once i changed the UJ's in the rear prop i had no trouble with steering or vibrations

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Sill = Silly - feckin keyboard.

I run 285/75/16's on reversed 8 spokes with about 6" of backspacing. Standard 8 spokes have about 3 - 3.5" backspace. Standard series rims have even less.

FWH have no place on a landrover in my opinion and I would never advise anyopne to fit them!

Be aware that fitting parabolics with even standard shackles can casue problems with front props. Fit extended shackles and you'll definately have front prop problems. Not only are the sliders too short, they interfere with the bellhousing crossmemeber, and the yokes dont have enough travel. I've had to grind the yokes on mine to stop it binding on full travel.

Jon

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Hey munks dont worry bout vibrations off the front prop, if you have freewheeling hubs your prop wont be turning on the road. I've this set up on mine and once i changed the UJ's in the rear prop i had no trouble with steering or vibrations

Nice on Alex, talk to you about it on Friday. I don't think I will put extened shackles on tbh, Rich and Jon have had to do alot for there ones... Rich is making up some bits at ricardo's so if his works and he makes spares then I might think about it..

I won't be using 900's all the time and still yet to pick them up..

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I tend to agree with Jon. I would fit paras with standard shackles first and see how it goes. If the ltwt is fitted with a canvas top you may find that you have some propshaft angle issues. Make sure to fit the springs, tighten to low torque tight, bounce the rig around a field, then tigghten u-bolts to spec. You will still have the problem of the paras allowing articulation beyond the ability of the standard prop sliding joint. I strongly suggest a full length slip joint, wide yolk and narrow diameter front shaft. The Propshaft Clinic are great and will make custom shafts with the provision of flange to flange lengths on the phone Propshaft Clinic. I also agree that degree wedges just don't work over time. They do jiggle and come loose. At best, you have to remove them and re-tighten u-bolts. At worst, they damage/break the center pin on your paras and you end up with unintentional rear steer!

900's will make steering rather unpleasant and will present a serious challenge to half-shaft integrity substantially increasing the likelihood of spontaneous disassembly. Having said that, if you can get some well back-spaced steel wheels (please do not use spacers), an X-eng broken bit removal tool, and aren't afraid to change out a half shaft now and again, you may well really enjoy them....... except that 4th gear will grow cobwebs.

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I tend to agree with Jon. I would fit paras with standard shackles first and see how it goes. If the ltwt is fitted with a canvas top you may find that you have some propshaft angle issues. Make sure to fit the springs, tighten to low torque tight, bounce the rig around a field, then tigghten u-bolts to spec. You will still have the problem of the paras allowing articulation beyond the ability of the standard prop sliding joint. I strongly suggest a full length slip joint, wide yolk and narrow diameter front shaft. The Propshaft Clinic are great and will make custom shafts with the provision of flange to flange lengths on the phone Propshaft Clinic. I also agree that degree wedges just don't work over time. They do jiggle and come loose. At best, you have to remove them and re-tighten u-bolts. At worst, they damage/break the center pin on your paras and you end up with unintentional rear steer!

900's will make steering rather unpleasant and will present a serious challenge to half-shaft integrity substantially increasing the likelihood of spontaneous disassembly. Having said that, if you can get some well back-spaced steel wheels (please do not use spacers), an X-eng broken bit removal tool, and aren't afraid to change out a half shaft now and again, you may well really enjoy them....... except that 4th gear will grow cobwebs.

Cheers for the advice, I will look into this prop for the para's. I will mention to my friends what has been said on here regarding the wedges, whether they will listen or not i don't know.

Would you advise doing the re-tourque even if there second hand springs. I got a field I can use, nearby, I am sure if the contractors are doing some farming they won't mind me bouncing around for but!

I will look into backspaced wheels, what goes into the process of doing this?

I am not afraid of taking halfshafts out, done enough already and the odd diff in the rear. Will I still be able to use 4th with a 2.5td? thinking when it goes bang going the 200tdi route anyway.

Will also look into broken bit removal tool

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I tend to agree with Jon. I would fit paras with standard shackles first and see how it goes. If the ltwt is fitted with a canvas top you may find that you have some propshaft angle issues. Make sure to fit the springs, tighten to low torque tight, bounce the rig around a field, then tigghten u-bolts to spec. You will still have the problem of the paras allowing articulation beyond the ability of the standard prop sliding joint. I strongly suggest a full length slip joint, wide yolk and narrow diameter front shaft. The Propshaft Clinic are great and will make custom shafts with the provision of flange to flange lengths on the phone Propshaft Clinic. I also agree that degree wedges just don't work over time. They do jiggle and come loose. At best, you have to remove them and re-tighten u-bolts. At worst, they damage/break the center pin on your paras and you end up with unintentional rear steer!

900's will make steering rather unpleasant and will present a serious challenge to half-shaft integrity substantially increasing the likelihood of spontaneous disassembly. Having said that, if you can get some well back-spaced steel wheels (please do not use spacers), an X-eng broken bit removal tool, and aren't afraid to change out a half shaft now and again, you may well really enjoy them....... except that 4th gear will grow cobwebs.

Seconded! ;)

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Parabolics and 7.50 tyres will be more than sufficient on an 88, especially an air-portable.

Could you clarify this a bit? If you are referring to weight then the air-portables actually weighed in heavier than a stock series in similar trim due to the removable gearbox crossmember and oil cooler, not to mention the detachable bulkhead.

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Could you clarify this a bit? If you are referring to weight then the air-portables actually weighed in heavier than a stock series in similar trim due to the removable gearbox crossmember and oil cooler, not to mention the detachable bulkhead.

Not quite. Most people go for big tyres or suspension lifts (the former sometimes requiring the latter) for ground clearance. On an 88", the approach, departure and breakover angles are already pretty good, but fit 7.50s and parabolics and they're sufficient for all but he most extreme off roading. Fitting extra lifts and bigger tyres is often counter productive because the turning circle is reduced (the front tyres foul the suspension, chassis or body) and the CoG is too high to negotiate side slopes or leaning obstacles that were inside the previous capability of the vehicle.

I suspect that if the aim is to gain clearance under the diffs and the vehicle is a serious off roader, the best possible mod would be portal axles with springs under the axles and spring mounts higher in the chassis to avoid lifting the vehicle. This would only raise the diffs and axle tubes, so the CoG rise would be small, and by having the springs mounted higher on the chassis, the body roll would be much reduced both on side slopes and in cornering (if the mounts could be raised high enough with spring over conversion so that the mounts were actually above the CoG, the vehicle would lean into turns and would be incredible stable on side slopes).

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  • 2 weeks later...

"I also agree that degree wedges just don't work over time. They do jiggle and come loose. At best, you have to remove them and re-tighten u-bolts."

I don't have parabollics so this may be different, however I have had custom made wedges (2deg) on my Series 1 V8 for 20 years and have never had to tighten the U bolts nor have they come loose.

Marc.

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  • 2 months later...
"I also agree that degree wedges just don't work over time. They do jiggle and come loose. At best, you have to remove them and re-tighten u-bolts."

I don't have parabollics so this may be different, however I have had custom made wedges (2deg) on my Series 1 V8 for 20 years and have never had to tighten the U bolts nor have they come loose.

Marc.

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Think of the situation first.. Add longer shackles to the rear of the front springs, with a standard chassis, you will increase the castor angle with the front axel king pins having a greater possitive castor and better self centering.. this will result in a better steering feel.

If you do want to alter the castor angle with wedges, once you have the correct angled wedge, theres nothing to stop you from tacking the wedges to the axel case.. adding wedges to reduce the castor angle may help Prop shaft angles but the angle you'll have will not be beyond what the standard yokes can deal with .

If you fit 9.00 tyres, you wil reduce your steering lock, but fitting off set rims or even worse, wheel spacers to deal with this will cause you further problems. King pins, wheel bearing will suffer, body work will fowl and your steering will become much heavier and kick back at every bump on the road... Dont do it..

If you want 9.00's Go for narrow 9.00 x 16s and you'll have light steering, good lock and the ground clearance you want.. Plus no bodywork fouling

Oh FWH are very useful and I have benefitted many times from having them.. Used correctly they are a god send.

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