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Police tyre checks


nicks90

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Well at least it looks as if I'll be ok with the 35" Extreme Trekkers I was considering for my Series One.

They are rated to a full 15mph over its 60 mph top speed :P

I'll have to be careful with the Range Rover though. I've just checked the handbook and it says...

"Fuel injection vehicles MUST be fitted with 'S' or 'T' rated tyres" :(

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Fair enough but if you fit tyres that are not speed rated for the car and the tyres goes and you end up killing somone in that car. and the tyres are to blame . Even if you skidded too much and kill someone . You will go to jail for not having the right tyres on your car . Even more so if they are some stupidly agressive off road tyres . Which we all know are carp on the road , and even more so when it is wet

Well thats the whole point of what i'm saying... What your claiming as fact i am doubtful on, which is why i want to see the C&U regs to see what they actually say, as oppsed to what some copper has said at the sid eof the road...

If you fit some fully road legal extreme mud tyres, which meet all the required regulations, and kill someone due to no fault of your own, for example they jump out infront of you and you cant stop in time, theres no possible way they can send you to jail. The point in question is the legality of said tyres. Plus if they were technically illegal, the court would have to PROVE that the speed rating being wrong caused the accident, instead of the speed rating being incidental to the cause of the accident, espeically if you were otherwise doing nothing wrong.

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Well thats the whole point of what i'm saying... What your claiming as fact i am doubtful on, which is why i want to see the C&U regs to see what they actually say, as oppsed to what some copper has said at the sid eof the road...

If you fit some fully road legal extreme mud tyres, which meet all the required regulations, and kill someone due to no fault of your own, for example they jump out infront of you and you cant stop in time, theres no possible way they can send you to jail. The point in question is the legality of said tyres. Plus if they were technically illegal, the court would have to PROVE that the speed rating being wrong caused the accident, instead of the speed rating being incidental to the cause of the accident, espeically if you were otherwise doing nothing wrong.

Yeah but if you it off road tyres that are not legal or speed rated for the cars that they are on . Then you are really in the carp. As for the speed rating if you own a Porsce you still have to have speed rated tyres up to about 170mph or whatever even though it is against the law to do over 70mph. But if you don't have these tyres then you are running a car illgaly on UK roads and hence all ready the fault heads towards you . Does not matter if you were doing 10mph. Other wise what would be the whole point of rating tyres. You would just buy a cheap set and say well i never do over 60 honest gov

My dad was killing in a RTA and the police went over the lorry that killed him with a fine tooth combe. You really would not belive what they go into in the investgation but it is unbeliveable how deep they go

. In fact they rebuilt the truck to find out what went wrong. remeber we are in the world where there is no long an accident . There is always somthing and someone to blame . And belve me the police will find somone.

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Little offtopic on underinflated tires.

I work for a local tyre shop and it is insane to see how many people run with wrong tire pressure(most of the time so less). Result is like mentioned above overheating which makes the tire melt inside.

Pumping air in it when it has gone under low pressure is dangerous and you can easily loose your life on it when sitting right in front of it.

We had several cases were people pumped them up to 2.5 bar and they exploded immediatley(luckily to the inside not outside).

Definitley not a waste of tax money........should check trucks to, half of them are ticking bombs on public roads...

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So if you had a hybrid vehicle - how would they know what the maximum speed of it would be?

Les.

IVA section 46 says the tyre must have an adequate speed rating for the maximum speed of the vehicle.

It goes on to say....Evidence of, or a written declaration of, the maximum design speed of the vehicle should be produced by the vehicle manufacturer/owner.

For my SVA I had to declare the top speed of the vehicle which uncannily was just below the speed rating of the tyres.

Steve

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It's my understanding that it's not illegal to fit tyres of a lower speed rating than the vehicle manufacturer recommends, providing the vehicle isn't being used in excess of the fitted tyres rating.

It is however illegal to use tyres below the recommended load rating in any circumstances.

I can't quote the specific regs at the moment, I do have the C&U regs on a computer somewhere, but I've been to the pub :P tonight and cant find them.

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It's my understanding that it's not illegal to fit tyres of a lower speed rating than the vehicle manufacturer recommends, providing the vehicle isn't being used in excess of the fitted tyres rating.

I disagree that is whole point of the police checking.

The vechile can still do the speed the manufature says it can and the police work on the worse case and that you will use that . So you have to have the tyres for that

I remeber that range rovers back a few years ago would fail an mot if they had Firestone sats on as they were not speed rated to the car

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i was always planning on running proper road spec tyres on mine most of the time, with some mud tyres on some different rims for offroading, so i guess i'll just throw the offroad rims in the back and fit them at the site, instead of fitting them before i go if this really is what the law says!

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I once had a car that had to have a ZR rated tyres on it, when I questioned this with the 70MPH speed limit etc (just for the hell of it) the fitter replied

"it is a car capable of producing a large amount of torque and must have a tyre that can handle this amount of torque by law, regardless of the speed limit",

which I suppose kinda makes sense,

But on the same note I ask myself would I like to stop a 2 ton of Land Rover on wet tarmac in an emergency on a set of "off roaded" Extreme treckers or even Simex copies, with the wife and kids in the back, and the sensible answer is no, they're sh*te, and please don't kid yourself otherwise, they are classed as an 80% off road tyre for a reason.

And hats off to people I see who drive home from Challenge events having just competed and swapped back to a set of sensible road tyres to get them home, much respect.

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I disagree that is whole point of the police checking.

The vechile can still do the speed the manufature says it can and the police work on the worse case and that you will use that . So you have to have the tyres for that

I remeber that range rovers back a few years ago would fail an mot if they had Firestone sats on as they were not speed rated to the car

The load and speed rating of tyres is not part of the MOT for class 4 vehicles. So they should not have failed.

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I disagree that is whole point of the police checking.

The vechile can still do the speed the manufature says it can and the police work on the worse case and that you will use that . So you have to have the tyres for that

I remeber that range rovers back a few years ago would fail an mot if they had Firestone sats on as they were not speed rated to the car

With that reasoning you could get prosecuted for speeding while being parked up at teh side of the road... :)

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I've just dug out my Butterworth's Police Law and the C&U section regarding tyres makes no mention of speed/load rating - only condition i.e. tread depth, damage, etc.

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I don't know eaxactly why but Simex Extreme Trekers have a VERY low speed rating

(from memory 62 ish MPH) vs the Jungle trekers (around 100+ MPH) and hence why I went JT2s

Odd, but fact

Nige

Nige, Simex ETs are rated at 75 mph IIRC

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For those of you who asked for a brief explanation of the Construction & Use relating to tyres:

Also for anyone who thinks that police have better things to do with 'taxpayers money' - you are perfectly entitled to have a say in how your money is spent, and this is via your local MP and Councillors.

Please dont take this as verbatim and print it out or keep it in your truck ready to shove under the nose of the next old bill who stops you, if you think that you have been incorrectly treated, get a professional /legal response and have your day in court (that is after all the society we live in).

I can see that this thread has opened up a basic divide, those who can see the reasoning for such advice in the first post, and those that cannot, and we are all able to debate/discuss our thoughts and reasoning. If you have ever seen a tyre that has disintegrated because it was wrongly inflated/fitted or damaged and then the carnage that has been subsequently caused (often to other drivers/passengers/pedestrians) you might come to the conclusion that a 10 minute free road check by a copper could be a good thing if it helps prevent such a situation occuring in the future. If unfortunately you get more than words of advice (ie a Fixed Penalty Notice) and you disagree then say so and ask to go to court. Please dont argue your case at the roadside and wind everyone up (including yourself).

Have fun....

Tyres

Type of Tyre

Pneumatic and Resilient Tyres

Regulation 24 Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986

Motor vehicles and trailers, except road rollers, shall be fitted with pneumatic tyres except the following vehicles which may be fitted with resilient tyres :-

• motor tractors and locomotives and trailers drawn by them,

• motor cars and heavy motor cars which are :-

- vehicles with an unladen weight not exceeding 1020kg (1270kg if electrically propelled), or

- used mainly for work on rough ground, or

- fitted with turntable fire escapes, or

- tower wagons, refuse vehicles, works trucks, or

- first used before 3rd January 1933,

• motorcycles which are pedestrian controlled vehicles or works trucks,

• agricultural motor vehicles which are not driven at more than 20 m.p.h. (may also have smooth soled tyres if certain conditions are met),

• trailers which are works trailers, refuse vehicles, or drawn by a heavy motor car which is not required to be fitted with pneumatic tyres, broken down vehicles, or trailers drawn by a vehicle which is not a heavy motor car or a motor car, agricultural trailers manufactured before 1st December 1985, agricultural trailed appliances and trailers used to carry water for a road roller being used in connection with road works.

Re-cut Pneumatic Tyres

Regulation 24 Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986

Re-cut pneumatic tyres may only be fitted to :-

• locomotives,

• motor tractors with an unladen weight of at least 2540 kg, or a wheel rim diameter of at least 405 mm,

• heavy motor cars,

• motor cars which are :-

- electrically propelled goods vehicles, or

- goods vehicles with an unladen weight of at least 2540 kg and wheel rim diameter of at least 405 mm,

• agricultural motor vehicles which are not driven at more than 20 m.p.h. :-

- with an unladen weight of at least 2540 kg, or

- a wheel rim diameter of at least 405 mm,

• trailers drawn by a heavy motor car or motor car if the trailer :-

- has an unladen weight exceeding 2040kg if it is a living van, or 1020kg in any other case, or

- has a gross weight exceeding 2290 kg if it is not constructed or adapted to carry any load, other than plant or other special appliance which is a permanent or essentially permanent fixture,

• trailers drawn by vehicles other than motor cars or heavy motor cars.

Regulation 27(5) Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986

It is an offence for a person to use, cause or permit to be used, on a road, any motor vehicle or trailer, a wheel of which is fitted with a re-cut pneumatic tyre, the fabric of which has been cut or exposed by any cutting process, or which has been wholly or partially re-cut in a pattern other than the manufacturers re-cut tread pattern.

Temporary Use Spare Tyres

A temporary use spare tyre may only be fitted to :-

• a passenger vehicle (not being a bus) first used before 1st April 1987, and

• a vehicle which complies at the time of its first use with ECE Regulation 64 or Community Directive 92/23, or

• a vehicle constructed or assembled by a person not ordinarily engaged in the trade or business of manufacturing vehicles of that description.

Mixing of Tyres

Regulation 26 Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986

Tyres of different construction have different characteristics which if mixed in certain combinations can be detrimental to the safe handling of a vehicle. Incorrect combinations can cause oversteer and uneven braking. The different types of tyre (marked on the tyre wall ) are known as :-

• diagonal-ply or cross-ply,

• bias-belted,

• radial.

Axle Requirements

Pneumatic tyres fitted to :-

• the same axle of a wheeled vehicle, or

• the steerable axles a wheeled vehicle, or

• the driven axles a wheeled vehicle which are not steerable,

shall be of the same structure except where a temporary use spare tyre is fitted to a passenger vehicle with up to 8 passenger seats driven at not more than 50 m.p.h..

Best to Back

On two axle wheeled motor vehicles fitted with single wheels (saloon cars, motorcycles, etc.) :-

• if radials are fitted to the front axle, bias-belted or cross-ply tyres shall not be fitted to the rear axle, and

• if bias-belted tyres are fitted to the front axle, cross-ply tyres shall not be fitted to the rear axle,

except on :-

• vehicles fitted with twin tyres or wide tyres (300mm in contact with road), or

• vehicles with a maximum speed not exceeding 30 m.p.h., or

• vehicles using a temporary use spare in accordance with regulations.

Condition And Maintenance Of Tyres

Regulation 27(1)(a) to (h) Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986

A wheeled motor vehicle or trailer fitted with a pneumatic tyre shall not be used on a road, if :-

(a) the tyre is unsuitable having regard to the use to which the vehicle is being put or to the types of tyres fitted to its other wheels, except where a temporary use spare tyre is fitted to a passenger vehicle with up to 8 passenger seats driven at not more than 50 m.p.h.,

(B) the tyre is not so inflated as to make it fit for the use to which the vehicle is being put,

© the tyre has a cut in excess of 25 mm or 10% of the section width of the tyre, whichever is the greater, measured in any direction on the outside of the tyre and deep enough to reach the ply or cord,

(d) the tyre has any lump, bulge or tear caused by separation or partial failure of its structure,

(e) the tyre has any of the ply or cord exposed,

(f) the base of any groove which showed in the original tread pattern of the tyre is not clearly visible,

(h) the tyre is not maintained in such condition as to be fit for the use to which the vehicle or trailer is being put or has a defect which might in any way cause damage to the surface of the road or damage to persons on or in the vehicle or to other persons using the road.

except (none of these exceptions apply to (h)) :-

• an agricultural motor vehicle that is not driven at more than 20 m.p.h.,

• an agricultural trailer,

• an agricultural trailed appliance, or

• a broken down vehicle or a vehicle proceeding to a place where it is to be broken up, being drawn, in either case, by a motor vehicle at a speed not exceeding 20 m.p.h.,

• in respect of ©, (d) or (e), if the wheel and tyre are designed to run flat and the tyre is marked as such,

• in respect of (f) only, :-

- a three-wheeled motor cycle unladen weight not exceeding 102 kg and maximum speed 12 m.p.h.,

- a pedestrian-controlled works truck, and

- passenger vehicles other than motor cycles constructed or adapted to carry no more than 8 seated passengers in addition to the driver,

- goods vehicles with a maximum gross weight which does not exceed 3500 kg, and

- light trailers, not being goods vehicles, first used on or after 3rd January 1933.

<A name=Anchor-Depth-23522>Depth of Tread

A wheeled motor vehicle or trailer fitted with a pneumatic tyre shall not be used on a road, unless :-

Regulation 27(4)(e) and (f) Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986

• the grooves of the tread pattern of every tyre are of a depth of at least 1.6 mm throughout a continuous band comprising the central three-quarters of the breadth of tread and round the entire outer circumference of the tyre fitted to :-

- passenger vehicles other than motor cycles constructed or adapted to carry no more than 8 seated passengers in addition to the driver;

- goods vehicles with a maximum gross weight which does not exceed 3500 kg, and

- light trailers, not being goods vehicles, first used on or after 3rd January 1933, or

Regulation 27(1)(g) Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986

in respect of any other motor vehicle or trailer fitted with a pneumatic tyre :-

• the grooves of the tread pattern of every tyre are of a depth of at least 1mm throughout a continuous band measuring at least three-quarters of the breadth of the tread and round the entire outer circumference of the tyre, or

• if the grooves of the original tread pattern of the tyre did not extend beyond three quarters of the breadth of the tread, any groove which showed in the original tread pattern are of a depth of at least 1mm,

except :-

• an agricultural motor vehicle that is not driven at more than 20 m.p.h.,

• an agricultural trailer,

• an agricultural trailed appliance,

• a broken down vehicle or a vehicle proceeding to a place where it is to be broken up, being drawn, in either case, by a motor vehicle at a speed not exceeding 20 m.p.h.,

• a three-wheeled motor cycle unladen weight not exceeding 102 kg and maximum speed 12 m.p.h.,

• a pedestrian-controlled works truck, or

• a motorcycle with an engine capacity which does not exceed 50 cc.

Light trailer is a trailer with a maximum gross weight which does not exceed 3500 kg.

http://' target="_blank">Tyre Speed Rating Symbols (kph/mph) / Load Index

The speed at which a tyre can carry a load corresponding with its load index (eg E 70/43 - 70kph or 43mph)

F-80/49-J-100/62-M -130/81-P-150/93-R-170/105-T-190/118-V-240/149

G-90/56-K-110/68-N-140/87-Q -160/99-S-180/112-H-210/130-Z-+240/+149

Load Index - the code associated with the maximum load a tyre can carry at the speed indicated by its speed symbol under specified service conditions.

LI kg LI kg LI kg LI kg LI kg LI kg LI kg

0 45 40 140 80 450 120 1400 160 4500 200 14000 240 45000

10 60 50 190 90 600 130 1900 170 6000 210 19000 250 60000

20 80 60 250 100 800 140 2500 180 8000 220 25000 260 80000

30 106 70 335 110 1060 150 3350 190 10600 230 33500

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It's my understanding that it's not illegal to fit tyres of a lower speed rating than the vehicle manufacturer recommends, providing the vehicle isn't being used in excess of the fitted tyres rating.

It is however illegal to use tyres below the recommended load rating in any circumstances.

I can't quote the specific regs at the moment, I do have the C&U regs on a computer somewhere, but I've been to the pub :P tonight and cant find them.

Pat.

If you read my post on this subject..A precedent {SP} has already been set in a court of law in the UK. A Rover SD1 driver was succcessfully prosecuted for using a lower speed rating tyre than the manufactures recomended. The drivers argument was that as there was a blanket speed limit if 70mph he only required tyres to that speed. The courts didn't agree and found him guilty.

mike

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I think alot of people are forgetting is who realy runs things

if your tyres are not rated correctly to the factory specs of your cars log book it's not insured

which I would assume if your not insured the plod will slap a instant driving ban on you.

But you would have to upset a plod alot for them to dig that deep to then ban you.....but in theory...

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I think alot of people are forgetting is who realy runs things

if your tyres are not rated correctly to the factory specs of your cars log book it's not insured

which I would assume if your not insured the plod will slap a instant driving ban on you.

But you would have to upset a plod alot for them to dig that deep to then ban you.....but in theory...

Not sure about that Jules. I've been asked about modifications, but not whether the tyres are correctly rated or not, and I've never seen anything in my policy or restrictions. If you have taken out insurance and later something is found to be a bit iffy with your car or your declaration, your insurance company has to insure you to third part risks up until the point they find out about the iffyness and set aside your policy. Also, the police don't ban people, the courts do that. A dodgy tyre on its own will not get you a ban, but I believe it's a least 3 points for each tyre, you could get banned for totting up (getting 12 points or more). But remember if you're a "new driver" the rules are different and you can find yourself resitting your test for less points.

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Unfortunately the C&U regs posted above do not include Regulation 25, which is the one that covers the speed ratings.

I will try and get a hold of them, but i dont really want to have to pay for them, and the library i used last time, i think i'd need to pay to get access now as i'm no longer a student at the uni.

Edit: just checked and it seems i can get reference access for free. If i've got some free time next week i'll try and pop into the place and dig out the appropriate statutory instrument that covers this stuff and see if i can get a photocopy of it.

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wow - i didnt realise this would be such a contentious hot topic!

all i wanted to do was bring peoples awareness to the fact that plod are checking tyres. I was more worried about unknown cuts and damage to my tyres than the speed rating to be honest. I do check the tyres regularly for damage or torn off tread blocks (they're remoulds...) but you know what its like, you can miss cuts on the inside far too easily.

As for people saying its illegal or not to fit appropriately speed/load rated tyres for their specific model vehicle - wake up dudes. We aint on the suzuki 'bodgit-leggit' boards where Z bars and cheap-assed half baked modifications are the norm, all in the name of saving £2.50!!! (never fails to amaze me some of the motors on certain zuke forums are actually driven on the roads... buts thats another topic entirely!)

If you have a motor capable of 100mph, fit tyres capable of handling those forces and loads. That way there is no confusion, no grey area and you are legally safe if the worst case scenario does happen.

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Perhaps we don't even have enough checks. .... for example Travelling in Australia last year I noticed they have a high number of official pull-over areas. We even got the once-over in the 100"....everyone was being pulled, so no one was being singled out, which I think works well. If it prevents accidents I'm all for it. After all, if your vehicle meets the requirements of the law and is safe there is nothing to worry about.

Imagine how much taxpayers money would be spent on the Police and other emergency services clearing up after an accident caused by an unsafe vehicle.....

THey do the same here, and have pull over laybys with weighbridges.

Usually manned by the police, customs and VOSA(equivalent) so they will get you.

Usually an article in the paper the day after listing how many vehicles had their

plates clipped, driving ban slapped on them, advisory, and various people fined

for not producing documents, etc.

I've never been pulled though, have been stopped in breathalizer checks though,

usuall Sunday morning or lunch time.

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if your tyres are not rated correctly to the factory specs of your cars log book it's not insured

so what about people like me who have and agreed valiation on my rangie and my insurance company has a 3 page spec sheet on my car including what wheels and tyres it has and im still covered by them

plus 15 photos?

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wow - i didnt realise this would be such a contentious hot topic!

all i wanted to do was bring peoples awareness to the fact that plod are checking tyres.

It seems you succeeded!

Now more 4x4's will be fitted with correctly rated tyres and fewer people will get tickets.

That's a good thing. Isn't it?

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so what about people like me who have and agreed valiation on my rangie and my insurance company has a 3 page spec sheet on my car including what wheels and tyres it has and im still covered by them

plus 15 photos?

Regardless of what you have declared to yur insurance company, it is your responsibility to ensure yur vehcile is legal at all times it is on the public highway. As stated above, 3rd party claims will (should) be honoured, but you may well not be covered for your own vehicle if it is deemed to be illegal in any way. We all know how hard insurance companies try to get out of a claim.

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