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what drill bit to use


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grille/rad is all off except for the grille surround panel & bonnet lock supports.

the subject bolt hole is the one ringed in yellow, flush with the block face so can't grip on it.

beginning to think about grinding/cutting away the inside face to get the remains out 7 then repiaring it with chemical metal filler to restore the area & recut/helicoil the thread.

it'll have to wait till Friday afternoon now, away tomorrow on a course for work.

post-20-126391807293_thumb.jpg

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I would have gone with "loads of penetrating oil every hour for a day or two, and tapping it out with a punch" until I saw the pic. When I say punch, we ground carbide drills (or one of the fancy drills) to a point and used them as a punch.

Has it snapped quite deep, as it looks? If that's the case a punch isn't going to help.

If going with a drilling option you could make a jig up out of a piece of plate. Screw through two remaining holes, the third drilled square through in a pedastal drill with the bit you'll be using for the the extractor.

This should help prevent you slipping off into the block if that's a problem. Start small and work your way up.

Good luck whichever method you use!

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get a small holesaw, like a spotweld drill (if its long enough) and drill out the remains that way. then use keensert to get a thread back in. Or, if you grind a groove in the remains, get the block redhot locally and try to remove it with a screwdriver.

Third option: Sorry, running out of ideas!

Daan

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I've borrowed that pic, just to show which bolt hole is involved.

Daan, yes I have a spotweld cutter & did think of trying that,

I've spoken to these guys http://www.cornwallengine.co.uk/ who are able to remove the offending item, cost depends on how long it takes & they are only 3 miles away, one of the guys is coming to have a look first & then I'll go from there, hopefuuly I'll have a good result.

so for now Thanks all :i-m_so_happy: who have suggested various methods, much appreciated in my time of stress :wacko:

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Is it a blind hole?

If not you may be able to punch it through with a parallel pin punch, even if it's not, you could be really jammy and be able to get it far enough into the hole to allow you to get the bolt in, or maybe a slightly shortened one...

For re-tapping you may need to invest in a non-tapered tap, but that's pence compared to a new engine block!

This is exactly the reason gave up with easy-outs, they often cause more work than before, and charge you a fair few quid for the privilege.

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Is it a blind hole?

If not you may be able to punch it through with a parallel pin punch, even if it's not, you could be really jammy and be able to get it far enough into the hole to allow you to get the bolt in, or maybe a slightly shortened one...

For re-tapping you may need to invest in a non-tapered tap, but that's pence compared to a new engine block!

This is exactly the reason gave up with easy-outs, they often cause more work than before, and charge you a fair few quid for the privilege.

Yep, blind hole, the bolt that screws in also holds the water pump & both parts of the timing case to the front of the block, there's at least a 25mm lentgh of M8 thread in there, the bolt has about 5mm of thread left on it, the rest is in the hole with the easyout in the centre & that doesn't have the 4 flutes within it's length.

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If theres any bolt sticking out at all weld an oversize nut to it and then undo it in the usual way. The heat fron the welder will brak any corrosion and you'll undo it that way. I've never failed to remove things using this method. Those easy out extractors are really only any use if you've sheared something off by overtorquing it. They NEVER remove bolts that have siezed - I wouldnt even bother trying one cos they break too easily as you've discovered!

Jon

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Somewhere on the forum, someone recently mentioned some sort of penetrating fluid thats is extremely cold. I'l have a hunt...

its me , its called rost off ice , made by wurth and won`t get that drill out !!!!! we`ve had it happen in work and the problem you get is the harder the drill bit the more prone to snapping if flexed it is, sometimes you can be lucky and once you get a tungsten carbide drill bit started it will carry on through and drill it out. I usually start at about 2mm and work up. never managed to get a solid weld to drill bits usually if you do get em out you have to use an insert to repair damage to surrounding area of threads. Sorry to sound all doom and gloom but that`s a real **** of a job and the best of luck to you. Snap on do a left handed drill bit/extractor set and we`ve had good results with it

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Can't believe the luck of this guy in the link. He gets the broken bit out and the stuck bolt,

THEN snaps the tap off in it :(:o

I hope that this problem has better results. Sounds like the local company is the best bet if that's their skill.

Good luck as this is really demoralising when it gets more and more difficult to solve.

Marc.

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Sorry - I read your post above as saying it had 5mm sticking out.

Even if its flush I'd still weld a nut to it! Its still possible if you're careful!

Jon

that meant the bolt that fits in that hole still has 5mm of it's thread the other 15mm is in the hole, the bolt is overall shank/thread length of 85mm.

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Yes Ralph same goes for me I have a Snap-on easy out splined thing stuck in whats left of a manifold bolt I'm luckily waiting for warmer weather to sort out.

You give so much time and effort to the rest of us I wish I also could be of more help.

Just remember that the fridge is always full when you have done. It helps a lot.

Paul

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spark erosion is the only real solution.

However getting an engine into the tank of a sparker would be quite a challenge (this is a submerged process), as would finding a toolmaking firm that has such plant that is still in business.

Not totally true. We have a spark erosion machine at work for removing broken taps, Ive used it on Cummins QM20 (V20's) for removing broken taps, carbide drills. gun drills...it is not submerged. It does require a flow of coolant, but can work at horizontal so strip down is not essential. It does require removal of engine, or least very easy access to it.

I'd try an oxy set, failing that, I'd be looking at using a hole saw type cutter that would cut just outside 8mm, perhaps a 12 - 13mm bit allowing for wall thickness..? Then I'd tap this M14x 1.5 or similar, probably M16 x 1.5 would be better, and make a tapped and threaded insert to fit.

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Was going to offer to post a couple of M8x1.5D Helicoils - but if your engineering people are any good then they will have all that stuff...

Good luck!

Thanks for the thought, I do have some M8 x 1.25 helicoil inserts & the tools for fitting them.

going to wait to see if the Cornwall engine guys can do the job.

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One more idea to add to the list, if it's flush grind a thick slot in with a dremmel wheel then use an flat blade bit in an impact screwdriver to shake it loose. I used my impact driver to rid me of the door hinge screws which were seized in the door pillars. Cost about £15 from screwfix. Used a few times on stuck rusted screws.

Pete

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we`ve got a local company like that . Lyons engineering , the old guy had seen it all and could honestly either get it out or make a tool to do it. I suppose we have a problem like this say once a month whereas they are doing it every day so they know what really works. If it really can`t come out then there`s a spare 200 tdi block at work, was saving it as a spare for mine but I`ll happily donate it to keep someone elses landy running !!

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OK all, just to close this one down, I found a Dremel tungsten carbide cutter tool at local B&Q, with the aid of a 13,000rpm engraving tool [similar to a Dremel tool] I managed to remove the remains of the bolt & the easy out, after cleaning the threads with the correct M8 x 1.25mm tap, the new bolt screws in a treat, all ready for the timing case refit on Friday after work/weekend.

Thanks to all for your contributions :i-m_so_happy:

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