tweetyduck Posted March 7, 2010 Author Share Posted March 7, 2010 Re. post 64 needle bearing. the book says take it to a dealer to change the needle bearing. Is this my best bet? the bearing is £9 so it should be pretty much done in 15mins for someone who knows what they are doing. What do you think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soren Frimodt Posted March 7, 2010 Share Posted March 7, 2010 OK so the swivel i did last week is definately not right. Its like the seal is sitting too near the inside (low on the hemishere) of the vehicle and the whole thing needs pulling towards the outside of the vehicle to make the seal sit a little further up the radius of the swivel ball (higher on the hemisphere). I can't fathom how this is possible? The swivel housing is held in position by the siwel pins and these connect to the swivel ball at the top and lower bearings so it would be impossible to get the seal further up the radius of the ball and so higher up the hemisphere. Anyone got any ideas?????? I found, when I did my swivels, that the new seal from Paddocks was WAY to small in the outside diameter. This meant that when I tightened the metalplate that secures it in a rotating manner it just pushed the seal around and when I was done tightening it sat VERY offset in the hole. So I loosened it all up, did the usual 12-6-3-9 exercise and it was all nice and smooth round the swivel ball. This could be your problem? I have a mate that never could get his "paddock" seal tight so he ended up buying OEM. And when I talked to him about what I had found out he said: "of course, thats what happened with mine" The OEM ones fit perfectly in the hole in the swivelhousing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tweetyduck Posted March 7, 2010 Author Share Posted March 7, 2010 thanks Soren. I'm going to mess around as i think what you say is the likely cause. another member has also suggested i spin it about 90 degrees to see if the issue moves. This is what i'm going to do. If that fails i'll have to do it all again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn Posted March 7, 2010 Share Posted March 7, 2010 it can't be the seal as i've just changed it along with both bearings and the ball. Everything is new. I set the pull tension to 4.5kg as per the book (although this was difficult to do, due to the inertia) so the top pin shouldn't be to tight. 4.5kg is waaaay too high for the twin taper bearings on a 300tdi. Thats the setting for the railko bushed axles. The twin taper bearing setup should be using a figure around 1.2kg, i dont remember it exactly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn Posted March 7, 2010 Share Posted March 7, 2010 http://www.landroverweb.com/Pdf-files/Maunals/Defender-300-tdi-workshop-maunual-1997.pdf Look in this manual, on page 212: Attach a spring balance to ball joint bore and pull balance to determine effort required to turn swivel pin housing. Resistance, once initial inertia has been overcome, should be 1.16 to 1.46 kg. Adjust by removing or adding shims to top swivel pin. You may well have damaged the bearings doing them up to 4.5kg. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tweetyduck Posted March 7, 2010 Author Share Posted March 7, 2010 Thanks Aragorn. I;ve checked the RAVE and you're of course correct. I need to get that set a bit lower. The Haynes says 4.5kg but they seem to do it on the bench before refitting so i've cocked up,,,,,,,, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn Posted March 7, 2010 Share Posted March 7, 2010 I dont have a proper haynes, just the "rebuild manual", but as you say, the rebuild manual simply says 4.5kg and doesnt make a distinction between early and late. The fact you;ve got too few shims fitted that might be causing the seal to fit incorrectly too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dantd5 Posted March 7, 2010 Share Posted March 7, 2010 http://www.landrover...aunual-1997.pdf Look in this manual, on page 212: You may well have damaged the bearings doing them up to 4.5kg. It is surely damaged!! Buy more than 2 next time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tweetyduck Posted March 7, 2010 Author Share Posted March 7, 2010 sorry but i can't believe they're damaged at that load. Not driven and no load on them other than the setup. I'm sure the stresses on bearings are more than 4.5kg when driving. Is your statement based on anything? If it is, i'll change them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reb78 Posted March 7, 2010 Share Posted March 7, 2010 Were the seals OEM? If not then that may be your answer. If 4.5 was slightly tight (jusr read aragorns post, so it is more than slightly), then when you drive it eveything will bed in. Try removing a couple of shims and see how it all sits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tweetyduck Posted March 7, 2010 Author Share Posted March 7, 2010 Unfortunately Britpart. one side is fine but not finished yet. I'll reset the tight side tomrrow. Surely i need to add shims to lower the Kgs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn Posted March 8, 2010 Share Posted March 8, 2010 You had 4 times the correct preload on the bearings... I've no idea if that will have damaged them, which is why i said "may", however i'd be inspecting them very closely. I'd also ditch the britpart swivel seal, and fit a OEM (cortego) or Genuine seal, as for the sake of a fiver you dont really want to have to strip it all down again if it starts leaking. And yes, you need to add shims to reduce the preload. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tweetyduck Posted March 8, 2010 Author Share Posted March 8, 2010 Thanks Aragorn. Just checked the swivel seals and they were bagged Britpart FTC3401G OEM. So they should be good. Just a thought but surely when you fist install them with no shims they would be really tight so you add shims. Therefor its going to be at least 4kg at the beggining and then eventually correct. I'll give them a check anyhow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reb78 Posted March 8, 2010 Share Posted March 8, 2010 Surely i need to add shims to lower the Kgs? Sorry Neill. Dont know what i was thinking - yes add shims. You just get used to having to remove them, so that is what i typed! Sorry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tweetyduck Posted March 8, 2010 Author Share Posted March 8, 2010 :angry: if i could swear i would.... the second side was going to plan only to come to an impass of biblical proportions. I put in the top swivel pin and it was too tight so i needed to remove it to fit some more shims. Couldn't get the damn pin back out. 1 hour and 45 mins later... i decide to remove the plate and swivel seal, remove the bottom pin, remove the bottom bearing and see the top bearing is completely knackered. It must have been damaged when fitting the top pin. I manage to manouver the swivel housing free in a shower of bearings. So now i have top pin with an stuck fast bearing runner and a shagged bearing. Need to go to the shop again tomorrow and get another pin and bearing. I just hope the other side isn't the same. It seems to move freely and the tension is now corrected. At least i might have one side done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tweetyduck Posted March 12, 2010 Author Share Posted March 12, 2010 So i've put all the bits back. I'm now wondering. When i greased up the wheel bearings did i use enough? Can anyone give me guidance on this. I just smeared as much as i could into the bearings and smeared it into all the gaps as best as i could. Smeared a good dollop on the races and stuffed em in. I'm presuming thats enough for the life of the bearing but this got me thinking. I used this. Bearing Grease Link Was it enough? Is there a hard and fast rule? Should i buy a packer for the rears? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Henson Posted March 12, 2010 Share Posted March 12, 2010 Put plenty in there, but don't pack the hub completely. A good layer on the track and the same on the bearing race is usually enough. I use JCB blue grease, which is about the best I've come across. Having said that - Comma has been going for donkeys years and is good quality. Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fender1234 Posted March 12, 2010 Share Posted March 12, 2010 I find shell retinax is the best grease about, its expensive but ive noticed longer life in UJ's and wheel bearings since using it and is very resitant to water. i pack bearings with plenty of grease. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmgemini Posted March 12, 2010 Share Posted March 12, 2010 SKF recomend just a smear of grease on the rollers. !! They do sell bearings..... I fully pack mine. Grease well down into the back of the rollers..Nowhere else..... Grease I use either Castrol LM or Comma Lithum both have a desert spoon full of Wynns Charge added and well stirred into the grease. A leson I learnt from the Wynns rep when I was rallying my Imp. I was knocking front wheel bearings out every rally, about 200 miles. The rollers would be well pitted, after adding the Charge I didn't have to replace another wheel bearing on that car.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tweetyduck Posted March 12, 2010 Author Share Posted March 12, 2010 thanks so it looks like i stuffed enough in there. I'd forgot you told me about wynns Mike. I'll grab myslelf some for the rears. Thanks Les and Fender. Looks like i want a bearing packer and a gun for the next ones. Then theres as much as there can be in them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tweetyduck Posted March 21, 2010 Author Share Posted March 21, 2010 So the landy is dead. On the way to the show today there was a squeeling from the front area, could have been Engine bay or under (i.e trans box or something) so we stopped at the services (1 mile). By the time we got there the squeeling had stopped so i stopped the engine and went under the bonnet and had a look. Got Julie to start it and nothing, just clicking so this meant flat battery (thanks to 2 people who stopped to see what was wrong,,, and Mike by phone, correct diagnosis on all counts even the guy in the Range Rover also on his way to the show). I decided to call the AA out to jump me and see what the squeeling was. The Alternator is shagged. No big problem as it was getting changed for a 100amp anyhow, but its failed. They tried to botch it but no luck. We set off on the way back with AA following. Squeeling started and then some imtermittant loss of mechanical power. Like the drive train lost power and then picked up again. 1st second seem fine (ish) but theres something worng in the gearbox or trans box is my guess. Sound like this is expensive and trip to the local specialist as it may even need picking up as i don't think it would make it. So the run to see it it works...proved it doesn't. Never made it to the show. I just wish i'd got the AA parts cover as the Alternator is covered. damn..... can't get into low ratio but diff lock high works. Can basically push level left and right but cannot get it into low on either side. Any ideaS? Is this is 100amp AMR4247G ? DENSO should be OK right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn Posted March 21, 2010 Share Posted March 21, 2010 You sure its not just the alternator seizing up? The squealing could be the belt slipping? Bit coincidental that they both occurred at the same time... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tweetyduck Posted March 21, 2010 Author Share Posted March 21, 2010 it could have been just that (good point!) but theres something definatly wrong with the transmission. Coincidence certainly but the alternator is not delivering current and the tranmission is making strange noises. I've got no belt on now so don't think starting it is a good idea. I've removed the alternator and the brush is worn down so i could just replce that and see if it works but i might as well replace it with 100amp (needed anyhow). Once i;ve done that i'll diagnose the tranmission problem i think. Bit scared to drive it now as for one the bettery is almost flat and i don;t really want to break down just down the road and leave it vunerable to theft till i can get the gargage to come to pick it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn Posted March 21, 2010 Share Posted March 21, 2010 does it spin freely now its removed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tweetyduck Posted March 21, 2010 Author Share Posted March 21, 2010 yes free as anything Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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