TD5 won't crank

[SiWhite]

So, the TD5 is all wired in.

It seems to go through the pre-start procedure well (fuel pump working, glow plugs timing well etc) but I can't get the engine to turn over. I was anticipating a few problems, although the previous owner of the engine had the ECU tweaked so a 10AS immobiliser wasn't required (was a competition motor so tuned for reliability).

Any ideas before I order a Nanocom in the morning?

[BogMonster]

Does it crank when you supply voltage to the starter motor solenoid manually? Td5 starters are a bit ****e and the solenoid contacts burn out.

[yella 90]

if it wont crank and it has the 10as removed, have you grounded out the black and orange wire that comes from the green plug on the 10as loom ?

it goes down to the starter relay, thats where ive cut and grounded mine out

that allows everything to work but it wont crank over

dan

[SiWhite]

Great info, thanks fellas. I get a clicking from the starter relay but no cranking so I guess that's the issue.

I'll be reinstating the 10AS when I get central locking actuators and a remote fob, but this will hopefully do the trick for now.

[yella 90]

if you get a clicking have you swapped over relays ?

also have you grounded out the black and orange wire ( im sure its that one although i can jump in the truck tomorrow and look for you )

if you have a bad earth problem, temp guages usually climb on td5's

dan

[SiWhite]

Dan - thanks, your advise was spot on. I now have a temporary ground from the starter relay and it cranks over.

Trouble is, now it won't start! I thought if it was immobilised by the ECU it would start then die a few seconds later.

Tried the bleeding procedure a few times. Any ideas?

[yella 90]

have you got the mil light coming on and off ?

when the ignition is on can you hear a slight hum from the ecu ?

when i converted my comp truck to td5, it was a absolute b**** to get running, i ended up killing 3 optimas before it fired up despite loosing count of the bleed sequence's. ( pump pedal 7 times, mil light comes on and the pump cycles )

not questioning you, but are all the fuel lines in the correct order ?

pull the inlet pipe on the back of the regulator off and see if theres fuel there.

make sure the crank sensor is connected and clean as it wont like that either

dan

[yella 90]

si, ive pm'd you

dan

[SiWhite]

Right, some progress. The engine will fire briefly with some easy start but dies after a second or two. No indication of any diesel getting to the injectors as no smoke etc from the exhaust.

Tried purging / bleeding countless times. Followed thebiggreenthing's advise and did the purge procedure with the fuel return from regulator to filter in a bucket. Fuel runs clear for about 17 seconds, then goes VERY foamy until the cycle stops at 25 seconds.

Where on earth could this air be coming from? I can't believe it's residual air from inside the system....

Any ideas?

[Phantom]

If they won't run after they've been purged a few times, try cranking it over with the throttle flat on the floor, sometimes gets them going.....

good luck

Lee

[nicksmelly]

Filter housing is a good place to start for air ingress. They are pretty poor quality and corrode on top.

[simonr]

I've had this a few times on different vehicles!

The most efficient way to find a leak is with a short length of clear plastic pipe that you can insert between the unions in the fuel pipe. I had the right fittings lying around which made it easier. You can then see the bubbles.

Start at the engine and move back towards the fuel tank.

In the last two cases, it was managing to suck air in to a pressurised pipe - some sort of ventruri thing going on. One was a badly fitted fuel filter and the other was a pipe that had abraded almost all the way through.

Si

[Aragorn]

Cant you just jump the fuel pump to the battery and run it for a bit to see if it will clear the air, rather than relying on the ECU to prime it?

Might make it easier to diagnose the air problem?

[SiWhite]

I've been defeated and called my local LR independant

They deal with this frequently - and almost always caused by failed copper washers and O rings under the injectors. This pumps air from the cylinder into the fuel rail and causes the air in the fuel lines.

New set of washers and O rings going in this weekend, and I'm going to nab some old fuel lines to make up a snap in section of clear hose for future problems!

[T1G UP]

never had a starting problem Si.......though it is a landrover!

the rear filter was supplied with the chassis so could be an issue.

have you tried a little fuel/easy start down the inlet with your foot flat down?

[SiWhite]

Thanks for replying Marcus. It will only run on easy start at the moment might get expensive if that's all it'll take.... not tried any diesel but I can't imagine it will do anything other than easy start i.e run for a few seconds and then splutter and die.

I take it you never had probs with air in the system / injector washers etc?

I suspect there is a leak in one of the fuel lines somewhere if that is the case - were the tank and pump from the 90? And some fuel lines added with the chassis?

[Guest]

Simon,

Is there anyway of attaching an air line to the pipe and presurising it? and then looking for leaks the old fashion way with water/washing up liquid?

Jason.

[T1G UP]

pump and lines to and from the pump from the 90. lines to engine from 110 donor

when i changed the rear filter i took an age to fire, tried the priming sequence 10 times????

foot flat seem to do the trick.

as an aside we've gone from west australia to west wales at the mo! women eh........

so back in the fold in my disco auto....love it

[SiWhite]

Think I'll persevere for a little while longer then - just VERY strange the diesel runs clear for ages then foams.

Have been advised that a good long tow can bleed things pretty well too, so that is on the cards at some point.

I'm planning on making a foot long section of clear pipe with a male / female snap connector which can be tried in various places throughout the fuel system to try and identify the source of the air. Are the snap fittings a universal size? Never come across anything like them before....

[Guest]

Think I'll persevere for a little while longer then - just VERY strange the diesel runs clear for ages then foams.

Have been advised that a good long tow can bleed things pretty well too, so that is on the cards at some point.

I'm planning on making a foot long section of clear pipe with a male / female snap connector which can be tried in various places throughout the fuel system to try and identify the source of the air. Are the snap fittings a universal size? Never come across anything like them before....

Simon,

Let me know if you need a tow.

Jason.

[SiWhite]

The plot thickens.

Taking SimonR's advise, I raided my local independent LR place and swiped an old pressure regulator which gave me the male and female ends I needed for a clear section of hose to diagnose the air leak.

I can now confirm that I get clear diesel flowing into the regulator and thus the injectors, but very foamy diesel coming out again.

Problem is either injector washers / O rings or the regulator itself.

Any suggestions as to which, or should I replace both?

[yella 90]

The plot thickens.

Taking SimonR's advise, I raided my local independent LR place and swiped an old pressure regulator which gave me the male and female ends I needed for a clear section of hose to diagnose the air leak.

I can now confirm that I get clear diesel flowing into the regulator and thus the injectors, but very foamy diesel coming out again.

Problem is either injector washers / O rings or the regulator itself.

Any suggestions as to which, or should I replace both?

replace the crush washers and o rings first si before the regulator, as there only around 20 quid.

i really would try pulling it up the road first though just to see if it'll coax it into life.

have you started getting any form of smoke for the exhaust or is there still no trace ?

even if the diesel is aireated the still should be enough around them in the head to get at least abit of atomised diesel into the pots.

i take it your putting the fuel pipe after the fuel cooler and seeing the air ? as ther early cylinder cooers are prone to leaking as im aware

dan

[SiWhite]

Dan,

I've tested it everywhere - soonest I can detect air is coming out of the regulator. There is air before the fuel cooler. There is a load of air in the fuel - more like foam than a fluid at times. Will change the washers and O rings, then if no better the reg.