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Dartford toll and hardtops


SteveG
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Got stopped at an auto toll on Dartford tunnel claiming that I had to pay £2 not £1.50.

I said it's not a commercial/goods vehicle so I'm not paying and take my details if you have an issue with it, so he took reg.

Has anybody else had this? Any info should they follow up?

Thanks

Steve

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I thought that that was all sorted now, at least for the bridge. Maybe you just got the uninformed jobsworth, Steve ?

actually it was on the bridge heading south. You must have met him knowing he was a jobsworth! ;)

Highways Agency site, http://www.highways.gov.uk/roads/projects/4075.aspx , still has this wording on their site.

A15. The charge will be £1.50 if your van/SUV has a full size side facing window(s) fitted to the rear of the driver and/or front passenger seats and if the seating capacity - with side facing rear windows - is for not more than nine passengers including the driver.

The charge will be £2.00 if your van/SUV has solid side panels/does not have a full size side facing window(s) fitted to the rear of the driver/front passenger seats and if the seating capacity - with side facing rear windows - is for 10 or more passengers including the driver.

It's bollox really as point of goods tolls are to get more from commercial vehicles not private users, when it's clearly a non commercial private vehicle then you shouldn't pay.

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Had the same experience with a jap double cab a few years ago. I just go through the unattended bays now.

Similar rules apply at my local tip, "you can't come in with that mate, it's commercial". I now flytip on the local greenlanes instead.

(don't really but dodging sofa's and tyres add an interesting variation to the muddy track)

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It's bollox really as point of goods tolls are to get more from commercial vehicles not private users, when it's clearly a non commercial private vehicle then you shouldn't pay.

I get your point Steve, and I agree, but playing Devil's advocate:

Your 90 is a commercial vehicle. Knowing your habits I bet you were on a commercial journey too - related to work rather than SDP? I believe the Woolwich ferry and Blackwall tunnels are still free if you do not like the rules at the Dartford crossing! :P

I know that there is an agreement from the powers that be that all LRs are cars for the purposes of the Severn Bridges.

Our local tip have a very enlightened attitude to commercial vehicles. They let them in as long as they are not dumping trade waste - simples. On one occasion my father and I each made two trips (together) in a day with trailers on to deposit hedge trimmings - me in 110SW, he in estate car. Seeing this, the guys from the tip asked us to complete a form making a declaration that we were dumping domestic and not trade waste. No arguments, no problems, no messing about with black bags in the boot, an enlightened system.

Chris

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Had the same experience with a jap double cab a few years ago. I just go through the unattended bays now.

I was going through auto bays, guy was walking back from far side. I've been through both attended bays and auto ones tons of times before and never had a problem.

I get your point Steve, and I agree, but playing Devil's advocate:

Your 90 is a commercial vehicle. Knowing your habits I bet you were on a commercial journey too - related to work rather than SDP? I believe the Woolwich ferry and Blackwall tunnels are still free if you do not like the rules at the Dartford crossing! :P

Bit of both, yes a meeting, but also popped in to see Graham about paintwork etc and also parents on way home. ;)

I get your point Chris, but Dartford 'project' uses terms goods vehicle, which implies it's a commercial goods vehicle to me.

Anyway, if they follow up for the extra 50p I'm of the mind to argue the point.wink.gif

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There's similar problems with Southampton's Itchen Toll Bridge, my brother-in-law's soft top 90 fitted with 2 seats goes through as a car at 50p, my friend's van side hard top S3 88" fitted with rear inward facing rear seats gets classed as a comercail and pays £1.50. That said, I always pay £1.50 in the work's Ford F350 despite it being well over the 3.5T cut off for that price!

In defence of the toll staff and management it's very hard to identify what's commercail and what's not. Vehicles like short WB landrovers and crew cab pick ups expecailly blurr the boundaries. Wasn't there some issues a while back on the M6 toll of Landrovers getting classed as HGVs if they had a spare tyre on the bonnet?!

The French toll roads are similar, I've had arguements with staff while in the F350, towing a 45ft trailer, claiming that I'm a car on SDP use, rather than an HGV on commercail use (sometimes a €30 difference!). Normally though the French can't be arsed and just charge you the lower rate.

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Guest noggy

M6 toll tried to charge me a tenner for my van sided 90!!

i argued for about 25 mins that it wasnt commercial and got away with paying a fiver!

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This all reminds me of a little toll bridge over the river Avon just outside Bath. I went over in my Transit Connect van and, as such, had the van toll in my hand. I handed it over and the attendant (on foot, not in a booth!) looked at me as if I were an idiot, told me the van rate was only for Transit vans and the like, gave me back the difference and kept only the car rate. Common sense if ever there was. :)

Chris

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Our local tip tried this by installing a fixed entry barrier that was only 1.8m tall. So only standard euroboxes could get in.

You're lucky...

Our local tips all have barriers but if you have anything that looks vaguely commercial then you have to get a permit - you send a copy of your V5 and an application form to state you aren't a trader !

Still doesn't stop plumbers and electricians with their '££ waste ££' dropping in without a permit... :ph34r:

Cheers

Peter

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thats very interesting. is it written anywhere or just a "guide". £11 over the bridge in my 110 hardtop seems a bit steep!

IIRC it was arranged by the S2 club who have a letter from the bridge authority confirming the car rate applies to Landrovers. There is an old thread here relating tax exempt cars and the Severn bridge.

Motorbikes are free on the Severn Bridges. biggrin.gif

Chris

Edited by GBMUD
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I bought my Defender 90 without rear windows and purposely put £1.50 in the car, to pay the Dartford toll.

...You should have seen the queue behind me when they refused to let me through, as it's classed at a commercial vehicle.

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Whenever I have gone anywhere near the auto booths at Dartford in my 90 HT the jobsworths seem to spring out of nowhere :angry: An arguement ensues, I end up ££ worse off every time. I had the same thing when I used to go through in my old 88" rag top, the sarcastic banker suggested I cut some windows holes in the canvas, then I could go through as a car.

The Severn Bridge has only ever charged me car rate :)

As for the local tip, they normally come rushing out to open the barrier when they see me coming. I don't know any of them, and I wasn't charging at the gate either :lol:

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I had this yonks back when the 90 was ahardtop

I went through to my mums fine, back they said "Non"

I got out an argued for ages, then they "Agreed" that I was OK

this was after shouting at them and producing MOT Isurance and V5, when they then said OK I argued some more

re them holding me up with no good purpose and with the traffic building they wnated me gone (friday 6.00pm ish)

So I was let through for free as a special favour

I was in one of those "I have loads of time, and I'm hacked off, and could do with a vent pointless arguement - and you are the lucky winners" Mode

:rofl:

Nige

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My tip has an enlightened attitude. If your "commercial" is less than 2.2t gross weight and it is your only car you can get a license from the local authority (provided you declare it is not used commercially)

Alternatively you can join the queue of L200's, vans and lr's parked outside the tip while you carry the stuff in.

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Yes, the M6 toll go off height so when my spare wheel was on the bonnet, I was getting charged on my TAG as an HGV, although I must say in their defence once I pointed it out they were very good in sorting it out and gave me all my money back.

Jason.

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The last time I used the M6 toll (in my 110 commercial), I had the £10 "van" charge in my hand.

I rolled up to the toll booth and the very nice lady asked for £5 and then complimented me on my Landrover.

Realising that she probably spends 8 hours a day/5 days a week watching cars, vans and lorries pass by - I felt rather special :)

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the very nice lady asked for £5 and then complimented me on my Landrover.

Realising that she probably spends 8 hours a day/5 days a week watching cars, vans and lorries pass by - I felt rather special smile.gif

Or she says that to all the guys!!!unsure.gif

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