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B+E Licence


Adam001

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The engine braking thing is frustrating. I have much better control of my car if i use the engine and the brakes and no matter how efficient the brakes, using the engine as well still anables me to stop faster. Corners are particulary frustrating with this silly rule, it can leave you in an innappropriate gear to drive out of the corner. If you are braking on the gears, it is likely that you are in the correct gear to drive out of the corner and change once the corner is complete.

As for the lights, it seems odd that with long vehicles, you are encouraged to go through the light if the front axle has passed the line. In a car, this might be ok, but with a trailer, it could result in the trailer being in the junction when the traffic crossing your path is allowed to proceed. Bit rough that you got a fail for that provided your manouvre was safe IMO.

I was taught to change into the relevant gear (usually second or third depending on corner speed) before the corner and engine brake into and around the bend, enabling a smooth pull-away afterwards :)

I always cover the brake pedal when engine braking anyway, just in case the skituation changes and you need to stop suddenly.

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I was taught to change into the relevant gear (usually second or third depending on corner speed) before the corner and engine brake into and around the bend, enabling a smooth pull-away afterwards :)

Thats exactly what i do - this makes for much smoother and safer driving. It seems to be frowned upon today though. If you are not allowed to brake on the gears, you may find yourself in too high a gear to pull smoothly out of the corner and may need to change gear half way through the corner when your hands should be on the wheel.

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When I did my HGV it was ok to proceed towards, and drive through, a red light if by not doing so the junction would be obstructed due to the size of the vehicle.

Sometimes examiners are also wrong. I 'sacked' my HGV examiner for requesting I carried out an illegal manoeuvre. He failed me but DVLA suspended him for retraining and refunded me my test fee.

I guess in the case of the OP it could be seen as failing to make good progress when it was safe and legal to do so.

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Yeah that was the examiners view, but even so on such a questionable subject you would think it would be a minor if nothing else. I did like his comment at the debreif though... 'Your driving was exemplary, however, unforunately you didn't pass' lol

I am always quite questionable when it comes to driving tests, like above, for my car licence my first examiner was suspended for failing me, and I was refunded for that test.

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The engine braking thing is not a emmissions thing, it is to do with the fact they expect you not to be able to work out your gearbox and not be able to get it into gear leaving you in neutral and effectively coasting...even though the alterative by not engine braking leaves you in neutral anyway haha!

So, they assume you're stupid and thus say you can't attempt to be intelligent about it. Sounds familiar :rolleyes:

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What you need to remember is examiners are all individualls who have good and bad days. I'm not defending them as a driving instructor they are a constant cause of frustration with inconsistent decisions. A few months ago I had a student fail on his use of the clutch. He was a little jerky when bringing the clutch up on gearchanges and ended up with four minors against his use of the clutch. It was a driving fault that anyone with any common sense would overlook as once he started driving on a daily basis it would soon smooth out. Anyway I managed to get him a retest 2 weeks later and he passed without a problem. Same examiner and his driving was still the same as he had made very little improvement on his use of the clutch.

While I do not belive in the perpetual rumors about quotas and limiting the number of passes I do think certain examiners can be very inconsistent.

Recently the DSA have changed the rules about push pull steering and are now bannging on about "Coaching" rather than "Instructing" all a load of psycho babble from the EU!

In October the next change to the driving test comes in, where they will only ask a candidate to do one manouver but will be introducing the "independent drive" where the candidate is stoppped and given or shown a number of directions to follow for 5 to 10 minuites. So can they fail if they go the wrong way? No! so whats the point? When I asked the examiners about it I was told that while candidates can not fail for going the wrong way doing so is more likely to make them commit other driving faults. When I said to the examiner, what is there to stop me briefing my students to try and follow the directions but if not sure just turn left? His response was, err well nothing but we would prefer it if you didn't!

As for gears and cornering it is still correct to change down for corners the whole enging braking V's foot brake is still causing confusion for some. What you should do is use the foot brake to slow the car then change down in to a lower gear before the corner. What you should not do, is just chuck it in to a lower gear to slow the vehicle or slow down and then roll around the corner in the higher gear.

HTH

Brookers

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In October the next change to the driving test comes in, where they will only ask a candidate to do one manouver but will be introducing the "independent drive" where the candidate is stoppped and given or shown a number of directions to follow for 5 to 10 minuites. So can they fail if they go the wrong way? No! so whats the point? When I asked the examiners about it I was told that while candidates can not fail for going the wrong way doing so is more likely to make them commit other driving faults. When I said to the examiner, what is there to stop me briefing my students to try and follow the directions but if not sure just turn left? His response was, err well nothing but we would prefer it if you didn't!

The way I read it I saw it as a way to see if a learner can make decisions while driving. A change from the old 'keep following the road ahead until instructed otherwise' routine. It would make the learner examine the road ahead and decide if and how to take a junction in advance. So driving towards a give way the learner will need to recognise it, establish a safe road position and then execute the manuvoever properly and safely, even if it is not the direction previously given. Obviously it would penalise a learner who turns the wrong way onto a one way road or heads down a motorway slip road or a no through road. It would also show up hesitancy and indecision while still driving towards a junction.

A young lad I teach recently had to pick up his first car and drive it home. He was supposed to follow his friend home but got himself confused on the motorway and missed his junction. He eventually left the motorway, saw a bus and followed it home, stopping at each stop, as he couldn't follow road signs or make the decisions where to go on his own.

As for gears and cornering it is still correct to change down for corners the whole enging braking V's foot brake is still causing confusion for some. What you should do is use the foot brake to slow the car then change down in to a lower gear before the corner. What you should not do, is just chuck it in to a lower gear to slow the vehicle or slow down and then roll around the corner in the higher gear.

HTH

Brookers

So is it still ok with a LGV to change up a gear while cornering so long as the steering isn't turned at the same time?

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Just thought I'd add my B+E experience, passed first time about 2 months ago. In my opinion all this stuff about you must use brakes not gear, feeding the wheel, make set go at lights. Total rubbish!!

I used my gears to slow down as learned from my series land rover days, no feeding the wheel (again series days).

The examiners are looking for safe driving above all, of course you will get a the odd unlucky incident and there are thing's you must not do. But give them a nice smooth safe drive, stick to the speed limit and learn the set maneuvers.

I think a lot of instructors try to make things more complex than they have to be partly due to you wanted to get something for your money, but also to make the training last as long as possible. (just my opinion)

Again in my opinion I thought the B+E test was a bit of a joke, i'd consider one of the most important things about towing is "trailer sway" and how to deal with it. But not in my training, notes or test was it ever mentioned.

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I think the idea of new drivers having to pass a towing test is great, infact i think older drivers should be tested too,

I dispair at the standard of trailer towing when I go to the local tip, I end up square in a sraight line within the lines, the others seem to drive across 4 parking spaces and still need to unhitch to turn things around.

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