eyes broken off a internal circlip

[western]

my Gemmer 6 bolt steering box has been leaking from the shaft bottom seals, I've got a seal kit & have removed the drop arm from the shaft [easier than I thought] & the box is now off my 110,

problem is the big circlip that secures the bottom seal has no circlip plier eyes on it, I've tried lifting the end to get it to move away from the back of it's seating groove but no joy I don't know when these eye bits broke off & they were not inside the bottom dust seal

any suggestions on how to split or remove this busted circlip -- short of stripping the complete box [which I really don't have time to do] or replacing it with a rebuit unit which is my only other option if I can't get this darn circlip out.

[Retroanaconda]

What's behind the circlip? Just the old seal? Is there enough showing to drill some small holes in it and use the pliers in those?

[western]

AFAIK just the seal & circlip, don't think a drill bit will touch the circlip as it's hard spring steel, don't want to get any swarf inside the box either.

this the seal kit I've got

the circlip can be sen on the left of this photo of the contents.

[cackshifter]

Could you cut/grind a small V down into the groove at the end of the circlip that would let you get something like a small screwdriver or chisel in to push it start 'flicking' it out of the groove. When you put it back/replace it, you could put it back in the same place? Ok I realise its a bit of butchery but desperate times call for desperate measures. Or maybe drill a small hole through into the bottom of the groove from the outside and push it with a fine punch? You could always fill the hole with epoxy.

Nigel

[western]

only just enough space in the shaft recess to get the circlip in/out, just had a thought the small tungsten carbide bit that I used to remove a broken bolt, might just do the job of splitting the remains of the circlip so I can collapse it in on itself, failing that a drill through the casing into the circlip groove would probably work.

[cackshifter]

Ah well good luck anyway. Just have a supply of plasters & Anglo-Saxon dictionary handy...

Nigel

[cackshifter]

You sure it's not a snap ring - if it is, the ends are kind of cut at an angle. I think there are tools for removing them easily but...if you have quite a new screwdriver (important the edges aren't too worn) and catch one side of the blade against the casing and the other on the end of the snap ring, with a twist you can compress the ring slightly, enough to get, using your third hand, another very fine screwdriver in the groove behind that end of the ring. With a bit of prising you can then get one end out of the groove, and kind of work it out, like getting a piston ring off a piston (only internally rather han externally). Repeat about 100 times, until successful.

Nigel

[Les Henson]

Should be a circlip - the eyes busted off is a right pain. I would snap the ring into bits that will easily be removed/fall out. A small, sharp chisel would snap it (they are spring steel). You could cut a 'v' into the side and remove it - the same as a 300TDi belt tensioner bearing replacement, but as you say - room is a bit of a problem if you are doing it in situ. You could drill through the clip, but 50% of it will still be in the groove, so only 1 - 1.5mm drill to weaken it perhaps enough for it to break.

Les.

[western]

It's defo a big circlip, same as in the photo of the seal kit above.

I'll try my TC bit tomorrow & if that doesn't cut through the circlip, I'll drill through the groove & use a punch to shift it.

[jbs]

Ralph, When I've had this before on prop UJ's I've got a small flat headed screwdriver in there-in between the circlip and the "groove"( for a better word) and prised it away from the groove-then using another small flat headed screwdriver I've levered the circlip away a bit more and like a bike tyre slowly worked my way around it that way, as soon as you find you have enough circlip out then you can get some rat nosed pliers onto the remains of the circlip and remove it that way

HTH

John

[western]

tried that, but limited space to get anything in & circlip is a big un, going to try my Tungsten carbide cutter or drill through the groove so I can push the circlip into the centre & grab it with pliers.

[western]

A 3mm drill through the box body into the circlip groove & circlip tapped inwards with a small punch & it just popped right out, Hurray now to fit the new seals & refit the box.

[jbs]

Glad you got that sorted-niceone

[western]

all back in one piece & refitted to my 110 & filled/bled with fresh fluid, leak seems to be cured.

[western]

all back in one piece & refitted to my 110 & filled/bled with fresh fluid, leak seems to be cured.

Oh well, the above was wasted effort, box still leaks & doesn't feel right, looks like a new box is required, more flippin' expense.

[V8 Freak]

Sounds like you are on that cusp of things showing their age Ralph. Replaced mine just over a year ago and had to replace the recon only a few months ago because it was leaking. Thankfully god a good one from TC which seems to be dry and working fine.

Where ever you get it from, fingers crossed you get a goodun!

Neil

[western]

new one will come via my local LR parts supplier at t'other end of town.

new genuine LR exchange Gemmer unit on it's way to my LR parts man, should get my grubby mitts on it on Weds this week, & it'll be fitted ASAP.

[western]

my parts man informed me earlier that LR have no 6 bolt gemmer boxes in stock, so I've gone for a Adwest 4 bolt & matching drop arm assembly, for slightly less cost than a LR exchange 6 bolt box. just need to fit it now.

[V8 Freak]

Is that going to involve any pipework changes Ralph or do they literally bolt on ?

Neil

[western]

Far as we can find, the pipe connections are only different at the pump end, so hopefully the new steering box will be plug & play

[RustyNissanPrairie]

Oh well, the above was wasted effort, box still leaks & doesn't feel right, looks like a new box is required, more flippin' expense.

the seals kits are carp-the main seal dosnt stand a chance of sealing. My post here;

http://forums.lr4x4.com/index.php?showtopic=58812&st=0&p=514650&fromsearch=1entry514650

has all the info for rebuilding a Gemmer properly. Mines been 2 or 3 years now since I rebuilt it and its been no trouble. Its a fair bit of tinkering though and sourcing all the bits so I dont know how much money would be saved vs a recon box, but I sourced all the bits through work and did it in my lunch times!

[western]

I'll be keeping the 6 bolt as my supplier doesn't need it as a exchange, so with the info you have provided I can get the seals & rebuild it at my leisure & suitable corrosion protected inside & out keep it as a spare as I have the matching drop arm with it.

[Jon White]

Try the Zeus seal kit. I've re-sealed my 6 bolt box twice over the year with one of these now!

Jon

[western]

Cheers Jon, I'll keep that in the memory banks.

[western]

just to close this thread, my 110 now has a Adwest [sTC8384E] 4 bolt power steering box & correct [QFW000020G] drop arm with new pre-fitted ball joint fitted this afternoon, the existing PAS pipes screw into the new 4 bolt box, [the pipe difference is at the PAS Pump end connections] the now removed leaking Gemmer 6 bolt is now retired to the garage bench, maybe it'll get a reseal with the correct items at some future point, test driven, no slop around centre position & steering feel & self centre is excellent.