Orange Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 See: 2011 Challenge Technical Regs and: Challenger 4x4 Championship Supplementary Regulations I believe these to be current, but I'm sure Neil and/or Paul/Lucy will confirm... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soliholic Posted January 3, 2011 Author Share Posted January 3, 2011 Hi, I completely get what you are saying about option 3 but people who were in class 2 last year did have the gear but chose to disable it so they could be in that class, I wonder whether if it didn't make any difference what you had then would it be an issue. If you go to a pay and play days people have lockers etc. Also with option 3 I would be relying on scrutineers to check every round that people had been honest with me on their form. We could do option 3 but with less categories to handicap. Lucy x Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
will4x4 Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 I think the aids you have listed would all be advantageous to a car with them ... i suppose you could cut the center winch and front locker category as if you have a rear winch there are not many occasions where a center winch is better... same with lockers the rear does 70% front 30% in my opinion. 1 x diff lock rear / front or both 1 x front winch 1 x rear winch 1 x tyres over 35" (measured not written) 1 x portal axles 1 x fiddle brakes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kellyv8 Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 do whatever you think is the fairest and easiest to work out as you cant please everyone all the time, so **** em if they dont like it then bolocks to them,they can go and enter a different comp or spend the whole year whinging about it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simonr Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 What about a hybrid of option 1 & 3? After all, a newcomer is unlikely to have as much kit as someone experienced so, divided into classes it gives less well equipped vehicles an idea of how they are competing based on driving ability alone. Though from a commercial point of view, option 1 works best as there is an incentive for people to buy as much kit as possible! I hope to enter some rounds this year - can I have something other than No 13 this time please Lucy?! It seems to guarantee me coming last! Si Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Fall Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Hi guys, Firstly, thanks to Orange for the kind comments about myself and Kev! Personally I really like Option 3, but with the fewer options for points drop. I'd say points off for the following items: 1x Lockers 1x Rear Winch 1x Portal Axles 1x Fiddle Brakes 1x Tyres over 35" (Agreed, should be measured not read off the sidewall) I fully agree with Simon in that novices (for whom the challenge is intended) won't necessarily have all the kit, so it gives them a better chance to get into the points! Hope to see you all soon, and Lucy you have a PM. Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orange Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Will is thinking along the same lines I was, but I can't come up with a scheme that is any less complicated than the previous ones! Assume a 'standard' entry car that has one winch and tyres up to 35", gets 100% of the punch value, then... -5% for 2 or more winches -5% for lockers (any combination) -5% for portals and/or fiddle brakes -5% for tyres over 35" (measured) So, in effect, my car would end up with a handicap of 90% (3 winches and 2 lockers). Worst case scenario is that a car ends up with 80% handicap. Basically I ended up getting back to Lucy's original option 2... The same class structure as previous years, but with the handicaps closer together...!! Of course, Chris's idea would work too, but it isn't exactly the best method to encourage newcomers as there would be a large financial outlay to even begin to feel competitive. However Chris is right that you won't please everyone, so the best thing is to pick an option, stick to it and see what happens. Worst case scenario is that you change the format for 2012... To what, though??!!?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trusty co-pilot Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Totally agree with Kelly v8 post, "you cant please everyone!!" It has been commented in the past that this series was very friendly yet competitive. With the previous class structure it allowed novices to enter the sport either with or without the toys and potentially create the opportunity to compete against experienced crews allowing the novice crews to develop their skills. The 2010 structure differentiates the series from the others on the challenge calendar, but some of the proposed options will just bring this series inline with everything else. Organisers decision....dont ask the competitors! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richy B Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Totally agree with Kelly v8 post, "you cant please everyone!!" It has been commented in the past that this series was very friendly yet competitive. With the previous class structure it allowed novices to enter the sport either with or without the toys and potentially create the opportunity to compete against experienced crews allowing the novice crews to develop their skills. The 2010 structure differentiates the series from the others on the challenge calendar, but some of the proposed options will just bring this series inline with everything else. Organisers decision....dont ask the competitors! I think the above comment is a very good and fair one, The series has worked very well in the past, So therfore why not leave it alone ?, Also as quoted on here " you cant please everyone" And there are enough different types/levels of events should you think its not for you, The series i think has a friendly welcoming feel to it and the exellent selection of punches available will appeal to first timers through to The more experienced out there, The more experienced teams can be inspiration/help to the less experienced Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soliholic Posted January 5, 2011 Author Share Posted January 5, 2011 Hi, Thanks for your comments, I know it is ultimately our decision but just wanted some feedback really. Had alot of comments last year that if we kept it the same people would not be so keen to enter this year so just trying to find a way to keep everyone happy so that all of you who make the series what it has become, remain loyal to us! Lucy x Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richy B Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Hi lucy, If i may dare to say - A lot of people talk about " what i would do is" And "if it were up to me" The fact is You guys are making it happen and really doing a really great job, Being involved for the first series i know first hand there is a massive amount of hours involved in the series, So please do source feedback but ultimately keep it doable for all concerned xx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soliholic Posted January 6, 2011 Author Share Posted January 6, 2011 Right.....after MUCH deliberation we have decided to go with "option 2" so effectively the same system as the last two years but with the points difference being less! Experienced 80 points per punch. Intermediate 90 points per punch. Novice 100 points per punch. We have analysed most of last years rounds and applied the scoring with each of the options listed earlier and found this one to be the best in terms of fairness to all, attracting newcomers, ease of use in fact it appears the best solution for pretty much all angles!! Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trusty co-pilot Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 Looks good. Cant wait for the first event!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soliholic Posted January 7, 2011 Author Share Posted January 7, 2011 More important is when will the complete regulations become available? Are there any major changes over 2010? There is no change to roll cage regs from last year and helmets are not compulsory but advisable. A spill kit is necessary. "Vehicles must comply with the AWDC Challenge Technical Regulations. AWDC supplementary Challenge regulations for roll cage do not apply see MSA blue book regulations(P)58.2 to 58.2.1" Hope this is clear Lucy x Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soliholic Posted January 7, 2011 Author Share Posted January 7, 2011  Challenger 4x4 and the AWDC are pleased to announce the series for 2011. The series operates a handicap system which allows teams of all levels of experience to compete against one another. 40 punches will be set out in various points around the competition site. In addition special stages will be set out in certain locations which will be worth extra points. There will be six rounds they are as follows: Round 1- 13th March 2011- Muddy Bottom Minstead Round 2 - 17th April 2011-West Harptree Round 3 - 5th June 2011-Slindon Safari Round 4 - 24th July 2011-Mud Monsters, East Grinstead Round 5 - 18th September 2011- Yarwell, Peterborough Round 6 - 23rd October 2011-Coney Green The events will cost £60 per round or £320 if you pre enter all six. Both driver and co-driver must be members of the AWDC and the driver must also have a MSA clubman’s license, which can be applied for online at £23. Each event will start at 10am until 4pm and the sites will all be available from 2pm on the Saturday for camping overnight. Scrutineering is from 8am on Sunday. A handicap system will operate. We will categorize teams based on their previous experience. The punch value will be handicapped accordingly: Novice: 100% Intermediate: 90% Experienced: 80% There will also be a class system in place for vehicles: Class 1 - Two or more winches and/or diff locks or other traction aids including fiddle brakes. Vehicles do not have to be taxed or insured but a valid MOT certificate must be available for inspection at scrutineering. Class 2 - One winch and no other traction aid of any type. Vehicles do not have to be taxed or insured but a valid MOT certificate must be available for inspection at scrutineering. Entries are limited to 40 vehicle per round. An entry pack including all regulations will be sent out on receipt of a registration form, these can be found at: www.challenger4x4.com www.awdc.co.uk Or alternatively please call Lucy on 01252 325930 or 07836 713677 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richy B Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 Stick me n steve down on the list please lucy We can do 4 rounds for sure Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kellyv8 Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 stick me and me new co driver down for the series, so who else is up for it,orange has gone realy quiet he must be saving up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sam coulton Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 ill be there doing a few rounds not sure if my trusty bitch will be there tho!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
general-confusion Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 Ade and I will be there for the whole series Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soliholic Posted January 9, 2011 Author Share Posted January 9, 2011 I have sent everyone who entered last year an email with the regs and registration form attached . If you wish to enter even for one or two rounds and you don't know which yet get the form to me asap so j can allocate you a team number. Thanks for your support, really want to get the numbers up this year. Lucy X Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soliholic Posted January 9, 2011 Author Share Posted January 9, 2011 P.s. We now stock spill kits @ £9.99. If you pre order I will bring it to round 1. X Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
general-confusion Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 put me down for one please Lucy Ta Steve Beck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richy B Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 I guess we will be requiring on of these also please, stick one by and ill collect next time in the shop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave W Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 Why do you need a spill kit ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richy B Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 Why do you need a spill kit ? Cause it says so Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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