CwazyWabbit Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Well the algorithm helped fill in some of the holes I had in this run. Worst case scenario I guess we could just have a csv file of all the values we know, we could manually work out a good selection above and below the pulse per mile and pulse per km values. Hopefully we can work out the last part of the algorithm though so that isn't needed.... 0x0E05 -- 0x45FF 0x0E04 -- 0x46FF 0x0E03 -- 0x43FF 0x0E02 -- 0x44FF 0x0E01 -- 0x41FF 0x0E00 -- 0x42FF 0x0dff -- 0xBEFF 0x0dfe -- 0xBDFF 0x0dfd -- 0xC0FF 0x0dfc -- 0xBFFF 0x0dfb -- 0xBAFF 0x0dfa -- 0xB9FF 0x0df9 -- 0xBCFF 0x0df8 -- 0xBBFF 0x0df7 -- 0xB6FF 0x0df6 -- 0xB5FF 0x0df5 -- 0xB8FF 0x0df4 -- 0xB7FF 0x0df3 -- 0xB2FF 0x0df2 -- 0xB1FF 0x0df1 -- 0xB4FF 0x0df0 -- 0xB3FF 0x0def -- 0xAEFF 0x0dee -- 0xADFF 0x0ded -- 0xB0FF 0x0dec -- 0xAFFF 0x0deb -- 0xAAFF 0x0dea -- 0xA9FF 0x0de9 -- 0xACFF 0x0de8 -- 0xABFF 0x0de7 -- 0xA6FF 0x0de6 -- 0xA5FF 0x0de5 -- 0xA8FF 0x0de4 -- 0xA7FF 0x0de3 -- 0xA2FF 0x0de2 -- 0xA1FF 0x0de1 -- 0xA4FF 0x0de0 -- 0xA3FF 0x0ddf -- 0x9EFF 0x0dde -- 0x9DFF 0x0ddd -- 0xA0FF 0x0ddc -- 0x9FFF 0x0ddb -- 0x9AFF 0x0dda -- 0x99FF 0x0dd9 -- 0x9CFF 0x0dd8 -- 0x9BFF 0x0dd7 -- 0x96FF 0x0dd6 -- 0x95FF 0x0dd5 -- 0x98FF 0x0dd4 -- 0x97FF 0x0dd3 -- 0x92FF 0x0dd2 -- 0x91FF 0x0dd1 -- 0x94FF 0x0dd0 -- 0x93FF 0x0dcf -- 0x8EFF 0x0dce -- 0x8DFF 0x0dcd -- 0x90FF 0x0dcc -- 0x8FFF 0x0dcb -- 0x8AFF 0x0dca -- 0x89FF 0x0dc9 -- 0x8CFF 0x0dc8 -- 0x8BFF 0x0dc7 -- 0x86FF 0x0dc6 -- 0x85FF 0x0dc5 -- 0x88FF 0x0dc4 -- 0x87FF 0x0dc3 -- 0x82FF 0x0dc2 -- 0x81FF 0x0dc1 -- 0x84FF 0x0dc0 -- 0x83FF 0x0dbf -- 0xFEFF 0x0dbe -- 0xFDFF 0x0dbd -- 0x00FF 0x0dbc -- 0xFFFF 0x0dbb -- 0xFAFF 0x0dba -- 0xF9FF 0x0db9 -- 0xFCFF 0x0db8 -- 0xFBFF 0x0db7 -- 0xF6FF 0x0db6 -- 0xF5FF 0x0db5 -- 0xF8FF 0x0db4 -- 0xF7FF 0x0db3 -- 0xF2FF 0x0db2 -- 0xF1FF 0x0db1 -- 0xF4FF 0x0db0 -- 0xF3FF 0x0daf -- 0xEEFF 0x0dae -- 0xEDFF 0x0dad -- 0xF0FF 0x0dac -- 0xEFFF Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrKev Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 0x1080 -- 0xE0FF apply algorithm = 0x170 Remember, you're only after a byte for the answer, so chuck the rest away (and with 0x00FF if you like). 0x170 >> 0x70. Algorithm still applies. Kev Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrKev Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Worst case, you only have to try any value with 8 choices of check bytes, but give me little longer, I'll probably spot it, once my brain has cooled down. Unless anyone else wants to get there first..? C'mon, only 4 bits left to work out! Kev Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CwazyWabbit Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Worst case, you only have to try any value with 8 choices of check bytes, but give me little longer, I'll probably spot it, once my brain has cooled down. Unless anyone else wants to get there first..? C'mon, only 4 bits left to work out! Kev I found the result of the algorithm for the ones I tried is the same for groups of 16 which makes sense, makes it very to get the next checksum till you hit the end of that group. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CwazyWabbit Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Wabbit, I'm looking forward to you getting your Bus Pirate and posting how you use it, I've ordered one too. Just waiting for it and my VDO speedo to turn up. I had worked out that I need to set my Pulse Per Km rate to around 2400 based on my T/Case ratio, diffs, wheel size etc and was pleased to see that your KPH speedo had revealed a similar value. I will be able to set it through the push-button on the VDO, but I need the bus-pirate to set the Odo to my current distance. I was quoted $160 by a shop to do it and the Pirate is less than half that and should be a bit of fun! Good work guys! Ray. Ray, Out of curiosity, are you a windows or a linux person? That way once I get the Bus Pirate working I can taylor instructions for your prefered operating system. I'd be really interested to see your memory dump when you get it extracted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CwazyWabbit Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Thought I'd upload some pictures on opening up the speedo as I imagine most people are a bit bored of staring at hex for the last several million messages... 1) & 2) This is the tool I used to prise up the edge of the crimped rim, it's a mobile phone cover removal tool apparently... looks like an electrical screwdriver with a bent tip to me. 3)Stick the opening tool in the gap between the rim and plastic (you'll need to lever against something. Just lever up a little at a time working your way around the rim. Only lever up enough so you can just about get the rim off. The more you bend the rim up the more you have to bend it back again later 4) If you look closely you'll see the rim hasn't been bent much and I've been able to force it up with my thumbs. There isn't much of a lip on the white plastic casing. 5) There is an inner black rim that is sort of clipped in, just pop it up with a knife 6) err... it's popped up in this pic. 7) Turn it over and undo the three torx t10 screws to release the guts of the speedo. 8) This is the side of the speedo you will be working on, the memory chip is in the top right corner. cont..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CwazyWabbit Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 .... 9) Just to give an idea of scale, this is the memory chip we need to solder to (or you can buy a special clip if you feel flush) 10) I used thin enamelled wire to make the connections as it means you are far less likely to rip the chip or tracks off when moving the wires about. 11) After the wires were removed and cleaned up with desoldering braid the chip looks mostly unscathed. 12) The rim was re bent by placing the face down on some MDF that had a hole drilled for the reset button to sit in. The speed had light pressure placed on the back with a clamp and then the rim was bent down by lightly tapping with a hammer on a piece of scrap plastic place on the rim. 13) A page from the memory chips data sheet giving the pin connections of the chip.... you'll have to wait for the write up dealing with connecting a programmer up There will be more pictures when I find them and get organised.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiwi_110 Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Ray, Out of curiosity, are you a windows or a linux person? That way once I get the Bus Pirate working I can taylor instructions for your prefered operating system. I'd be really interested to see your memory dump when you get it extracted I'm a Windows type, me, and only slightly micro-p savvy. Though I did do a hi-reliability hand-soldering course 30 years ago in the RNZAF!!! Ray. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiwi_110 Posted July 8, 2011 Share Posted July 8, 2011 Wabbit, just as an aside, if you need a home for that KPH speedo, I'll take it off your hands for what you paid, plus your handling/Odo setting fee, plus postage to NZ if you want to get shot of it at some point. That way I'll have a backup if I blow it trying to doctor the VDO when it arrives... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickwilliams Posted July 9, 2011 Share Posted July 9, 2011 So here's what's possibly an interesting twist... I've spent the day fitting a TD5 speedo (thanks, Landroversforever) but having taken it out for a road trial I find it is reading much higher than it should be. I can't decide if the indicated speed is 2 x the actual speed or 1.6 (which makes more sense, I think) but it's certainly way more than would be accounted for by having the wrong cog in the transfer box. I know the cog is right for the tyre size, anyway. The speed appears to be a UK spec MPH unit. It has a sticky label on it which says (among other things) "YBC101530" but the '30' has been crossed out and '20' has been written along side it in pen. So far as I have been able to find out, YBC101530 is a KMH reading speedo, so I wonder if this one has been converted at some point but has somehow lost it's memory of the conversion. I believe it has been stored for a fairly long period without being powered but it still retains the odometer reading. There is no sign of the unit ever having been opened so if it has been converted then it must have been in the factory. I have not worked out the logic of what could have happened in my head. In any case, this might turn out to be the first 'in anger' application of Mr Wabbit's mph/kmh conversion investigations. I will need the odometer changed at some point as well. Nick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retroanaconda Posted July 9, 2011 Share Posted July 9, 2011 What brand is your transducer, in the transfer box? The double-reading is a common problem with Britpart and other non-genuine transducers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CwazyWabbit Posted July 9, 2011 Share Posted July 9, 2011 So here's what's possibly an interesting twist... I've spent the day fitting a TD5 speedo (thanks, Landroversforever) but having taken it out for a road trial I find it is reading much higher than it should be. I can't decide if the indicated speed is 2 x the actual speed or 1.6 (which makes more sense, I think) but it's certainly way more than would be accounted for by having the wrong cog in the transfer box. I know the cog is right for the tyre size, anyway. The speed appears to be a UK spec MPH unit. It has a sticky label on it which says (among other things) "YBC101530" but the '30' has been crossed out and '20' has been written along side it in pen. So far as I have been able to find out, YBC101530 is a KMH reading speedo, so I wonder if this one has been converted at some point but has somehow lost it's memory of the conversion. I believe it has been stored for a fairly long period without being powered but it still retains the odometer reading. There is no sign of the unit ever having been opened so if it has been converted then it must have been in the factory. I have not worked out the logic of what could have happened in my head. In any case, this might turn out to be the first 'in anger' application of Mr Wabbit's mph/kmh conversion investigations. I will need the odometer changed at some point as well. Nick. Hmmmm That's strange, the YBC101530 is indeed on the KMH speedo I have here and YBC101520 is on both of the MPH speedo's I have seen, what confuses me though is that if it had been converted to MPH they would have to have changed the dial face as well. The config details that we have been playing with that allow the conversion are in an eeprom so shouldn't be able to revert regardless of how long they are disconnected for. Also if the details became corrupted then the checksum wouldn't match and your needle wouldn't move at all. Even if the eeprom fails completely (or is removed) you would notice as the odometer will either read as 999 999 or 0.0 ( I have seen both). I am at a loss to explain what has happened to yours without seeing it To work out what's going on could you do a 10 mile journey measured on your trip meter and also with a satnav and then work it out? Still on the plus side it will be quite novel to see your landy doing over 100MPH on the motorway If you'd like me to investigate yours and set your odometer feel free to PM me Nick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CwazyWabbit Posted July 9, 2011 Share Posted July 9, 2011 What brand is your transducer, in the transfer box? The double-reading is a common problem with Britpart and other non-genuine transducers. Good point, that would be a simple cause to it..... do they really get the design so wrong as to double pulse it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickwilliams Posted July 9, 2011 Share Posted July 9, 2011 What brand is your transducer, in the transfer box? The double-reading is a common problem with Britpart and other non-genuine transducers. Ahh, OK, i could not find any reference to this when googling earlier but it is indeed a Britpart sender. (I ordered OEM but it came in a blue box). If you'd like me to investigate yours and set your odometer feel free to PM me Nick. I will take you up on that offer, but I will get a replacement sender and try that first. Thanks. Nick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mo Murphy Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 Britpart transducers are well known and documented for being hopelessly inaccurate ! Only use a genuine Land Rover speedo transducer. HTH Mo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiwi_110 Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 Britpart transducers are well known and documented for being hopelessly inaccurate ! Only use a genuine Land Rover speedo transducer. HTH Mo And as for the build/assembly quality.... this is fresh out of the blue-box... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CwazyWabbit Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 Didn't you say in your other thread that it's just a reed switch and a magnet? If so at 60 mph it would be switching almost 70 times a second .... that sounds a lot to ask of a mechanical switch to me. I wonder if the genuine one has different internals? Maybe a semiconductor based solution better suited to that speed of operation. Has anyone looked in a dead genuine one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 this is the best transducer to use & the one I fitted] TRANSDUCER SPEEDO DRIVE, YBE100530 & looks like this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickeyw Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 I had a blue box one before I sent it back for a genuine item. The construction was the same, but the BP one was very poorly finished. The moulded part was so loosely clipped to the die cast piece, you could just pull it apart with fingers. I didn't bother finding out whether it worked. The gen item looks like a quality component and works perfectly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bos Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 Most of what you are all talking about is complete double dutch to me! But I've been following with interest because this has been on my to do list for a while. Decided I would get the td5 Binnacle ( which I got off Ebay about two years ago) out to see what mileage was on it, however I've tried putting 12v onto pins 6 & 11 and pin 1 of the loom (and even all together) but the Speedo wont light up. Am i doing something wrong or is my speedo dead ? - Btw I've also been putting pin2 to earth/Neg. Thanks Mark. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 you need 12v to pins 6 [brown/blue] 9 [purple/brown] 10 [white/green] earth to pin 7 [black] on the speedo top plug . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bos Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 Thanks Ralph The numbers I was referring to were the other end of the loom. Looks like my Speedo is U/S then, guess it wasn't the bargain i thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bos Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 It's OK i've worked it out now. If you want to test it via the loom you have to use pins 7 or 9 for the earth, pin 2 is only the earth for the lighting circuit. So my speedo works and is only 5K low Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 glad you found it works & not to much mileage to add to make it correct for your vehicle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickwilliams Posted July 15, 2011 Share Posted July 15, 2011 I'm pleased to be able to report that a new genuine LandRover transducer arrived in this morning's post. It took all of 10 minutes to fit (including putting my overalls on first and taking them off again afterwards) and I now have a rock steady speedo reading which I find entirely believable. Credit also to Duncan and his colleagues at Brit-Car for sorting me out with a credit for the faulty Britpart item and supplying a genuine replacement as well as a some other bits with no hassle or fuss. Nick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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