simonr Posted August 21, 2012 Share Posted August 21, 2012 There is little wrong with the defender heater matrix, it's just that the blower is pathetic! Today, I tried connecting the motor to 24v - and it blew a gale! After 10 mins the motor was warm, but not hot - so its probably happy-ish being over volted. I've ordered a 12v to 24v converter from China rated at 10A which might be sufficient. It opens up the possibility of a 4 speed heater control - though more likely just a boost switch on the dash somewhere. I'll keep you posted with how it goes! Si Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UdderlyOffroad Posted August 21, 2012 Share Posted August 21, 2012 Should be interesting Si! One idea I have seen floating around is using a PWM controller to get rid of the stupid selector switch from the equation altogether... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diablo Posted August 23, 2012 Share Posted August 23, 2012 http://www.landroverscene.com/forum/index.php?topic=1944.15 That's a heater upgrade! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miketomcat Posted August 23, 2012 Share Posted August 23, 2012 Si the bit of foam from the wing duct to blower is missing on mine and does seem to be an improvement. So perhaps input flow plays a part as well. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted August 23, 2012 Share Posted August 23, 2012 That looks like it could be made up with the air con heat exchanger, and the fans from a late RRC pretty easily... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soren Frimodt Posted August 23, 2012 Share Posted August 23, 2012 Great subject to be put under your creative knife Si, intrigued as to what you will find out Although I thankfully have no issues with the heater, because I no-longer own a defender, but a good old RRC V8, these things can deliver some proper heat, fast! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Team Idris Posted August 23, 2012 Share Posted August 23, 2012 I've seen those squirel cage fans in the Spal catalog. They have a load more push. I'm thinking of giving up completely on water heating in the S1. It has a stainless steel exhaust, and is ripe for an air tube around it under the cab. Would also be instant heat What about a de-cat heat exchanger? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julian Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 There is little wrong with the defender heater matrix, it's just that the blower is pathetic! Today, I tried connecting the motor to 24v - and it blew a gale! After 10 mins the motor was warm, but not hot - so its probably happy-ish being over volted. I've ordered a 12v to 24v converter from China rated at 10A which might be sufficient. It opens up the possibility of a 4 speed heater control - though more likely just a boost switch on the dash somewhere. I'll keep you posted with how it goes! Si You're a genius and I owe you a beer! I modified the heater on my series three to incorporate two heater matrixes, and with an 88 degree stat I can get very hot air from it but the actual fan is too feeble. I've been racking my brains to find a better fan and even got one from a (Fiat Ducato?) van that looked just the job, but alas it would not quite fit in the space :-( I'm going to try running my motor at 24 volts as per your brilliant idea, or maybe rig up some sort of dropper resistor so that I can run it at about 18 volts and have it last a bit longer! Julian. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MECCANO Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 Thought about using a motorbike cooling fan? they are basiclally mini kenlows, They tend to be nosier than centrifugal fan, but seem to chuck out alot of air. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
=jon= Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 I modified the heater on my series three to incorporate two heater matrixes, and with an 88 degree stat I can get very hot air from it but the actual fan is too feeble. I've been racking my brains to find a better fan and even got one from a (Fiat Ducato?) van that looked just the job, but alas it would not quite fit in the space :-( I fitted a 4" bilge blower instead of the original fan on my s3 (it squealed and drove me barmy) - it shifts about twice the amount of air as the original, but it's still pretty pathetic compared to a modern car... I did think of using two of them, or putting them underneath the ducts to the demister vents (in the big empty airbox bit of the dash) but haven't got round to it as yet... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julian Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 I fitted a 4" bilge blower instead of the original fan on my s3 (it squealed and drove me barmy) - it shifts about twice the amount of air as the original, but it's still pretty pathetic compared to a modern car... I did think of using two of them, or putting them underneath the ducts to the demister vents (in the big empty airbox bit of the dash) but haven't got round to it as yet... I thought of the bilge blowers too, or brake cooling fans for (for eg) NASCAR cars - as that's also what they are used for.However I've had experience of these little but powerful 'turbine' style fans in the avionics/equipment bays on Boeing aircraft, here they are 200volt 400Hz jobbies that turn at around 10,000 rpm and make such a racket that you need ear plugs if close up to one. LR's 'snail fan' is fairly large diameter and turns slowly - obviously that's to cut noise - I do however fancy trying it at 24V as I suspect it will still be inaudible above the racket of the 2.25 Diesel :-) Julian. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philip Tonkin Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 Over-volting the motor is likely a good way to produce a plug in upgrade but a change in the motor would achieve the same thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simonr Posted August 24, 2012 Author Share Posted August 24, 2012 Any of you happen to know what the 3 pin connectors on the fan are? Presumably Tyco? Si Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 PaulMc might know, he usually pops up when that type of question is asked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GW8IZR Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 Hi If your going to increase the supply to this poor little motor just spare a thought for its brushes - current limit the the first few seconds at start up. HTH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retroanaconda Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 Any of you happen to know what the 3 pin connectors on the fan are? Presumably Tyco? Si I think the later (300Tdi on) models use 3-way TY Econoseal connectors. Earlier models use those annoying moulded-on-to-the-loom rubber ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big.Mike Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 Ha, I was thinking about this today (it took 10 minutes to demist the windscreen)... This really sounds like a cracking idea... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulMc Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 Any of you happen to know what the 3 pin connectors on the fan are? Presumably Tyco? Si I think the later (300Tdi on) models use 3-way TY Econoseal connectors. Earlier models use those annoying moulded-on-to-the-loom rubber ones. As said above - the 300Tdi models use an Econoseal 3-way female connector The TD5 models use a Sumitomo HW Series 3-way (inline) female connector - . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big.Mike Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 This is a complete lash up, (born out of desperation) but I thought I'd have a bit of a try with some spare fans that I have. Basically it's an attempt to demist the screen and help draw more air through the matrix, I'm never going to drive with them in place. I've simply added a plug so I can plug them into the cigarette lighter. These fans are interesting, it's possible to bunch them up with only one input and I have 15 of them. Next thing is to put them on a strip of plastic to make it easy to add and remove them! I just need a cold morning to try it! Cheers, Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simonr Posted September 10, 2012 Author Share Posted September 10, 2012 Why don't you just cable-tie them together by the mounting holes to form a long strip of fans? I used to have a block of eight fans (4x2) tied together which I could jam in the passenger side window for extra cooling in the summer! With those little fans you count use them for both! Si Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big.Mike Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 Why don't you just cable-tie them together by the mounting holes to form a long strip of fans? I used to have a block of eight fans (4x2) tied together which I could jam in the passenger side window for extra cooling in the summer! With those little fans you count use them for both! Si Ha, I have some strips of plastic, I don't have any cable ties. See, I told you it was lashed together! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffR Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 As my V8 has a gas conversion, I was thinkin of one of these: :hysterical: :hysterical: I'll get me coat.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big.Mike Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 Right, just thinking about it a little more, I think using Venturi effect, adding the fans to one side would "suck" more air out of the vent. This would also recycle air from the cab (which is not something the current fan does). I'll try both orientations one cold morning and post the results! Cheers, Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSD Posted September 10, 2012 Share Posted September 10, 2012 I completed my latest heater upgrade experiment at the weekend... I replaced the on/off air flap in the heater box with one of the PTC heater modules used in a lot of modern cars to give instant demist. This ones from a Peugeot 807 I think, and it was cheap on the bay because of the obvious (and irrelevant) damage to the wiring. It's a little bit longer than the width of the heater box, so CNC'd a couple of brackets to mount it nicely... All mounts up nicely, with an 80A Albright solenoid on the fan housing, to switch it on with. Since the Ibex doesn't have a rear screen demister, I can use that switch and get a meaningful warning light on the dashboard. I have to wait for some duff weather to find out if its really any good, but on a warm afternoon this weekend, the output air was noticeably warmer than ambient in 15-20 seconds from startup, with the fan running at full speed. Startup current is close to 100A, dropped to a stable value just below 50A with the fan running at full chat, so typically around 800W (Best not forget and leave it switched on!) Being PTC, it will draw more current as the intake air temperature falls, trying to maintain the temperature of the heater element. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MECCANO Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 Brilliant, i've been waiting to see some one use one of these. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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