Les Brock Posted November 29, 2012 Share Posted November 29, 2012 Holy switch-a-rama Batman, I now know I'm cured and normal life can resume at last Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Noisy Posted November 29, 2012 Author Share Posted November 29, 2012 SO Has anyone ever been in the situation where this... ...orange light is on all the time because you have purposely wired your On Off On switch backwards? Basically this is because I am using the switch as a selector between Main Beam on, Off, and Constant On for the roof lights, and the way it is wired puts permanent live to the pin to which the orange light is wired. Why not switch the main beam and permanent feeds you say? BECAUSE my default position is main beam, and to have the switch downwards to match the others, main beam must be wired to the top pin and permanent live to the bottom pin, which puts the orange light on. So, we must change the switch. This COULD be a first for teh internets! Pop the back off, caution, springs! And we have a beautifully simple switch inside, truly American! These are the little chaps that do the lights. Notice there is a spring and a resistor. Some Carling switches are available with incandescent lamps and I guess they don't have the resistor, just a longer spring like the earth spring: So it wasn't too much trouble to do a cheeky move on the positive wire for the orange led (cathode?) to the spare position: I decided I needed access to the centre pin so I could fit a fairly crude jumper wire. The only way was to drill from the outside, straight through: And here is a visual circuit diagram Soldered the wire into the centre pin bucket, shoved the untinned end into the spring hole, popped the resistor in then shoved that down which kinda crimped the wire in place and popped the spring in: Then carefully clipped the switch back together, plugged it in and exclaimed hurrah out loud when it worked! Well chuffed with that one Now I've got three to do for my mate's Hilux, he has put up with switches not matching his other switch positions for a year, I persuaded him to change them but he said only if I can find a fix for the lights Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Noisy Posted November 29, 2012 Author Share Posted November 29, 2012 Also altering the d37 patch lead. Marked the SPR wires as 'somebody' made them all the same colour Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Noisy Posted November 29, 2012 Author Share Posted November 29, 2012 Bah. Now got 12v at S1 on relay board (checked other three for continuity too, all ok!) but still no rev counter Will check rev counter is wired up properly first! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted November 29, 2012 Share Posted November 29, 2012 Like the carling switch mod Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Noisy Posted November 29, 2012 Author Share Posted November 29, 2012 Thanks matey Yes, the rev counter is wired up correctly! So, is it a case of this rev counter not being compatible?? It was previously wired to coil negative! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Noisy Posted November 29, 2012 Author Share Posted November 29, 2012 Ok so I need to call on someone with the tecknikal info here! Is the output from the ECU similar or distinctly dissimilar from a coil negative? I thought coil negative was positive with a negative pulse? Or is it the other way round? Basically why night this counter not be working?? Help would be appreciated before I start ripping the dash apart again!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robp Posted November 29, 2012 Share Posted November 29, 2012 Ok so I need to call on someone with the tecknikal info here! Is the output from the ECU similar or distinctly dissimilar from a coil negative? I thought coil negative was positive with a negative pulse? Or is it the other way round? Basically why night this counter not be working?? Help would be appreciated before I start ripping the dash apart again!! Sam Is THIS any help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted November 30, 2012 Share Posted November 30, 2012 Sam - 1st off check you're getting pulses on the SPR1 pin when it's running. Set multimeter to AC volts, see if it registers (I'm assuming you don't have access to a 'scope or have a frequency counter on your multimeter). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Noisy Posted November 30, 2012 Author Share Posted November 30, 2012 Hi chaps. Thankyou for that diagram rob, I see it needs more than a simple direct connection! Fridge, will check. No, I don't have a scope, recentty sold one, but was just thinking I could bloody do with it now!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRecklessEngineer Posted November 30, 2012 Share Posted November 30, 2012 http://www.ledametri...cope/index.html Might be useful. However - make sure you recalculate the resistor values for say 15v. I'd add coupling capacitors as well as crude isolation. FF would be able to advise further, but I think the diagram from Rob is taken care of inside the ECU. (You also might like to try the IDM pin from EDIS. I've had success with it in the past) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Noisy Posted November 30, 2012 Author Share Posted November 30, 2012 Yes, I am under the impression that tacho out has been handled to some extent inside the ECU. It definitely has gubbins but I was under the impression it would drive a tacho direct, that was the point in having it done!! Those tach fix boxes that extra EFi sell look like the item which is required, or have I basically got that inside the ECU already?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bull Bar Cowboy Posted November 30, 2012 Share Posted November 30, 2012 If your tacho was coil connected then it needs high voltage pulses. ECU direct tachos have a digital input. If you look in the MS manual this is what you need to do …………… I did the same with my tacho and it works fine. It just ‘gates’ the coil pulses for the tacho Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Noisy Posted November 30, 2012 Author Share Posted November 30, 2012 Thanks for that bbc, will investigate all options! These fancy component numbers hurt the eyes a little Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted November 30, 2012 Share Posted November 30, 2012 Your ECU has this circuit inside: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Noisy Posted November 30, 2012 Author Share Posted November 30, 2012 Ok so basically it provides a pulse, but not enough to drive a coil driven tacho, which is where those tach fix boxes come in. Have emailed the seller of one of these tach fix boxes to get his input on the subject! Thankyou again for your valuable help gents Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bull Bar Cowboy Posted November 30, 2012 Share Posted November 30, 2012 I have never got the circuits that Jon (FF) post to work with any reliability on ‘pick up’ pulse tacho’s. However, I guess you could get it to work by just switching a relay coil (just strip off the mechanical bits) and using the back EMF to drive the tacho ……….. I bet that’s all a tacho box is ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRecklessEngineer Posted November 30, 2012 Share Posted November 30, 2012 Yup, I'll bet that too! There's a diagram in one of the links on the last page on how to wire up a relay coil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted November 30, 2012 Share Posted November 30, 2012 What they all said - the box will not have anything clever in it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Noisy Posted November 30, 2012 Author Share Posted November 30, 2012 Oh yeah, guaranteed the little box of tricks will be a nice expensive way to sort the problem! MIGHT have a bit of a mess about with some options or MIGHT just save some time and get the product!! Thanks for the help on it guys, will be interesting to say what the seller says! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zim Posted November 30, 2012 Share Posted November 30, 2012 Sam, if you need a scope i have a hand held one you could borrow. I'll be around tomorrow (by the airport) & trialing near congleton on Sunday. Gordon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted November 30, 2012 Share Posted November 30, 2012 You can also run some tacho's from the alternator W terminal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted November 30, 2012 Share Posted November 30, 2012 You can also run some tacho's from the alternator W terminal. My VDO tacho runs from the W terminal on the alternator . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Noisy Posted November 30, 2012 Author Share Posted November 30, 2012 My standard disco tach runs off the alternator as all discoverys do, but it is woefully inaccurate and stops working when it gets wet! Thanks zim, gonna dig out the draper multimeter coz its a bit more fancy but yes otherwise will give you a shout! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Noisy Posted December 1, 2012 Author Share Posted December 1, 2012 Morning gentlemen So! Moving on temporarily from the tacho business, better talk about tuning for a bit. Have been doing various runs datalogging, trying different driving styles and generally trying to visit all bins. I think I have visited about 85-90% of bins in total now. Here is the AFR table I am working to: I think it is quite conservative, with lean only on overrun. I have also shifted the rpm scale a bit to give more control at low rpms, I do not spend much time at all over 4500 rpm so as far as AFR is concerned anything above there can be lean overrun, stoich or gung-ho 12.5:1 WOT. I am tuning on WB and have turned off EGO correction on the last three runs (have been doing three runs at a time and then returning to base map if I am changing settings) It seems to have pulled towards target AFR much more quickly with EGO correction turned off, this is understandable. I wish to work on a cruise section and would like to discuss leaning out the target AFR slightly in the cruise area. I have not yet exactly established where that area is but am commandeeringy brother again to sit in and take notes on the motorway Anyway, after three runs without EGO correction, the first had a max cell change of 15, second 12, third 5 I think, so it is closing, but more to do yet. My plan is to get it nice and tight so that I can run with or without lambda sensor and know that the fueling will be acceptable. I would run with NB quite happily but if I am not tuning to 14.7 on the motorway anyway then there seems little point running the sensor, unless the ECU works in a crafty way to aim for target AFR when using NB? So anyway, here is the third incarnation of the VE table, originally starting with nige's base map: Just looking for advice or comments please gents. I am very happy with the way it runs etc, but would like to explore a teeny bit more economy where possible (not going to spend my life making it economical because it is not possible but if it can be better than Hotwire on the motorway I will be happy) and if those in the know could just advise generally on how the two tables are looking I would be most chuffed. Thanks in advance, Sam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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