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Scotts90

Loom advice

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I'm currently rebuilding my 200tdi and after spending countless hours fitting new footwells/a-pillars/feet I discovered the bulkhead had a bit of a twist (explains the mountain of cataloy in both the a-pillars).

So, I sourced an early td5 bulkhead which I'm sending off to galv, but would like some thoughts on using the td5 loom.

I only have the bulkhead loom (ymc000550) which is a non-abs loom with alarm . I got the dash less instrument cluster ( I have one and all the appropriate parts thanks to retroanacondas guide), but I don't have the the ecu or any other td5 based looms to go with it.

My current loom is the old glass fuse model and I was going to replace the fuse box with a new blade type one if it was to be re-used, as well as adding the ancillary wiring for the e/w, cdl,heated front screen and seats, replacing the dodgy bullet connectors for new econoseal type ones as I go.

So, with future upgrades in mind (ie a td5 engine at some point?), would sourcing a td5 chassis loom as well as the front and rear lighting looms be a wise upgrade? My new doors have leccy windows and central locking, plug and play would have been nice but not essential as these aren't the hardest to wire up.

I have read Les Brock's rebuild thread comprehensively (stunning detail) and it's something similar wiring-wise I would like, I realise Les has the entire loom and ecus though.

It would have been ideal to get the whole wiring setup with the bulkhead but I was just glad to get a solid one!

Thoughts, opinions and advice welcome

Scott

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Scott, you will need the dash harness, rear chassis harness, lh and rh wing harnesses and an old engine harness to keep engine bay plug and play.

You will also need the satellite fuse box that is found in the same place as the ecu as this supplies the power to virtually everything. You will need to sort a seperate glow plug circuit and you'll need to make some changes for the temp gauge and stop solenoid but overall a quite easy conversion of you take your time and work methodically. Mine has been in nearly 3 years now.

HTH

Mo

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Hi Scott,

Installing a TD5 loom isn't worth the effort IMHO while still running a 200 Tdi you will spend ages working out what stuff you don't need. The loom compared to the 200's is at least twice the size and will make it painful to fault find in the future.

If you need to change loom then suggest you look at the loom from a 300 as it's much simpler to adapt has better fuse box (blade type) better construction (headers and connectors) and good circuit diagrams than the 200's and is reasonably easy to get replacement terminals for all the connectors.

If you want to use the TD5 instruments then it's not too difficult to incorporate into your existing bulkhead loom.

However I think I would only do this if I needed to (my original loom had been well butchered over time by previous owners and the 200 style fuse box became rather temperamental) if its only a "nice to do" then I'd think twice about even sticking the 300 in.

I've modified and fitted a 300 loom into my Ibex which has a 200tdi installed and also dismantled a Td5 bulkhead loom to strip out the instrument loom to graft in to get the electronic instruments.

Hope this helps.

Rob

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Thanks for the advice.

After looking for and pricing up the missing looms from the td5 setup it's not a very cost effective option, sourcing mismatched looms from eBay is a gamble and still isn't cheap. Ideally a complete donor vehicle would give up its wiring innards but I haven't the patience to wait!

I think the 300 option is one to look into and may be more readily available

Cheers

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Find a local breakers you can take parts off and go on a mission. I've used CWS in Glastonbury who are convenient for me in the south west and pretty good when they understand what you're doing. Be prepared to remove dash board when after a bulkhead loom, don't forget to label the ends so you know where they go a bit quicker than digging through the drawings.

Be prepared to take a loom with some damage to repair as some careless sod has probably bent the front against the scenery for it to be in the scrapper. It's not difficult to repair them.

Any help or advice you want get in touch.

Rob

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Thanks Rob, finding a defender in a breakers up in SW Scotland is a rarity, even ones that are total loss seem to be bought entirely and rebuilt.

I've done a 200 to 300tdi loom swap when the bulkhead got swapped on the farm 110 pickup (it came with the bulkhead). I just wish now that I kept the loom from the 300tdi pickup donor....hindsight is a wondrous thing!

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Thanks for the compliment :blush:

I have the bulkhead loom, rear loom, and wing looms,door looms and roof loom

This does all the main controls/lighting/indicators/charging/starting/Htd everything etc, I use a few aftermarket guages

No TD5 ECU's are used at all other than alarm.

Td5 loom is unmolested and standard

I went this route in case I ever wanted to just fit a TD5, remove my aux loom and fit, connect and run

:i-m_so_happy:

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If you have a 200TDi, I would recommend using the same loom.

There are many differences between 200 and 300 looms, and TD5 looms are different again.

For example, 300 looms use different connectors for side lamps, indicators, washer bottle, column stalks, etc etc.

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I've got 300 tdi electrics on my 200 tdi 90, The reason for this is-I bought a late 300tdi defender bulkhead when I was rebuilding my 90 then because of the time factor (3 weeks off from working away) I then worked out it'd be cheaper to A, get a 300 tdi engine loom, and B, get a 300 tdi chassis loom all of which are a plug and play job-than to chop and solder the connections from a 200tdi defender loom to the 300 tdi bulkhead, This is still running now as It's my daily driver when I'm home-Means I also get to use later light assemblies etc. for my truck too as they're also plug and play

John

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Well, the eBay gods have been kind, I now have winging my way a td5 xs main/bulkhead loom and a rear loom. I already have the td5 door looms.

I had given up on the idea of the upgrade as decent 300 or even late blade style 200 looms were making strong money and was resigned to tweaking the existing.

So, what are the thoughts on internal or external running of the chassis loom? At the moment the old loom is run per factory inside the chassis rail, but I've seen a fair few on here that have kept them on the top of the rail. I can see the benefit of fault finding and modifying if need be when place on top , whereas the only good part about it being run internally is the protection afforded by the box section.

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External for me

IMG_2159_zps88b897aa.jpg

I put stainless basket tray (free from work) on top od the chassis, all the cables, brake llines, air line all just sit inside and ty-rapped in place, you can just see it on the RH of pic

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Likewise, outside for me, where I can get to it if I have.

Mo

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After a chassis swap I chose to route the loom externally (with conduit and P-clips) for the following reasons:

- sharp galvanising on inside of chassis legs could chafe the wires

- fault finding or loom removal/modification is quicker

- no need to fiddle with trying to get the loom through the chassis

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disconnect from the engine bay end & carefully pull the loom from the rear end, there are less connections at the front end & most are in multiplugs.

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External for me

IMG_2159_zps88b897aa.jpg

I put stainless basket tray (free from work) on top od the chassis, all the cables, brake llines, air line all just sit inside and ty-rapped in place, you can just see it on the RH of pic

How did you mount the basket tray to the chassis? Did you drill and rivnut and use the basket mounts?

I have the old loom now removed and have got all the multiplugs tagged up (I think). Waiting on my front LHS wing loom to appear, battery to underseat fusebox cable is on order. So just the RHS front loom, rear door loom and engine loom to procure.

The loom upgrade has as always led to another set of choices. With regards to the seat box, my 90 no longer has the side mount tank and with the upgrade to td5 looms this is ideal. I have new end panels for my old seat box with the drivers side freshly riveted on and the passengers side cleco pinned together

F6DF22AC-1044-4A6F-B3BB-E5885562F48B_zps

My current train of thought is to stop refurbing the tdi seatbox and and source a td5 one, transferring the new ends to this as most appear to be corroded on the ones I've looked at. This would then give me suitable ecu/fusebox locations and almost factory spec. I realise the transmission tunnel mount needs swapped, so carefully removing the td5 one ( and keep for swapping back over) and refit the 200 version.

I did look into the YRM battery and toolbox kits as I had considered these when the loom upgrade wasn't on the cards, the td5 box is the more cost effective option though.....yes I mentioned cost effective on a defender rebuild! That'll be the last...honest

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I simply drilled and tapped the holes (pretty thick steel on the Richards Chassis) with basket clamps to hold it all down

yes it a couple of holes, but nothing compared to the amount to "P" clip everything and its easy to add/remove cables of pipework etc, from it with no empty holes, just cut the ty-raps off remove and re-do

http://www.neweysonline.co.uk/neweys/pdf/literature/customer-guides/newlec-wire-basket-cable-tray-and-accessories.pdf

TD5 seat box with YRM battery box, with Devon 4x4 twin battery tray used in mine FWIW

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Thanks Les. I've ordered a cable tray so that should arrive tomorrow. I wasn't too keen on drilling the chassis but needs must. At the moment my fuel lines are cable tied through existing holes to the top of the chassis and if I was completely honest I wasn't too happy with this arrangement.

Need to break the news to the wife that I'm buying another seatbox....lol

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I've been gathering up the looms to carry out the conversion and I'm looking for some info.

I have, the main(bulkhead),chassis,RH front wing/LH front wing/ battery to underseat fuse box link wire.

I have traced and labelled everything common to the "standard" wiring ie lighting/ew/cdl/HFS/HRS and all the switchgear. The only missing items are the difflock switch, reverse light switch and speedo transducer connections.

The difflock, transducer and reversing light multiplugs are definitely not on my chassis or main (bulkhead) loom. A search on the forums suggest it's fed from the engine loom and there also appears to be a link harness AMR5725 which has the speedo transducer connection. AMR5725 has an ecu multiplug, two 2pin plugs (similar to those on the ABS leads) and two econoseal type multiplugs, with a large grommet fitted.

In order to utilise the "whole" td5 setup I will need an engine loom and the above link harness....I think....can anyone confirm this? I know most of the engine harness will be defunct unless connected to a td5, as are the ABS systems. I think it would possibly be easier to knock up a patch loom for the difflock/reversing switches, and I already have the econoseal plug for the speedo transducer.

Following the wiring diagrams for the td5 seems to back this up, the transducer, difflock and reversing light wires all pass to multiplug C0162 which contains the oil pressure, alternator and other engine warning light feeds (14 way plug). They then pass to their respective multiplugs.

I'm going cross eyed looking at wiring diagrams.....

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Is there a ROW spec engine loom available which would plug into your main loom and fit your tdi better?

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If you haven't already, have a look at Retroanaconda's guide to installing a TD5 instrument pack in an older vehicle (the sissy's version of what you're doing :hysterical: ). From looking at his schematic, it appears that the speedo transducer is directly plugged into the rear instrument pack? Difflock switch is a simple circuit, ditto reverse light, so you should be able to make up simple "transmission loom" yourself.

That's my plan anyway, but I'm taking the sissy route....

Matt

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If you haven't already, have a look at Retroanaconda's guide to installing a TD5 instrument pack in an older vehicle (the sissy's version of what you're doing :hysterical: ). From looking at his schematic, it appears that the speedo transducer is directly plugged into the rear instrument pack? Difflock switch is a simple circuit, ditto reverse light, so you should be able to make up simple "transmission loom" yourself. That's my plan anyway, but I'm taking the sissy route.... Matt

If all else fails the sissy route will happen. Logic would dictate it should be on the chassis loom, or at least the main bulkhead loom but after asking Les he has confirmed these switches are fed from the engine harness. I'm sure when they designed the td5 looms they didn't anticipate them being retrofitted to 27yr old defenders. More looms are in the post....yay!

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