Jump to content
garrycol

101 Power Steering

Recommended Posts

Discussion on the 101 forum on this at the moment. Apparently a LHD Cherokee box goes in without cutting the chassis but the drop arm needs cutting and welding which most aren't happy with. This is on a RHD vehicle.

An RB44 steering box has also been tried.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks - I assume the Jeep box is a LHD version on what I have tried - unfortunately a LHD box would be almost impossible to get here to try.

By RB44 I assume you are talking about the mil truck that looks like a pumped up VW transporter. Again impossible to get here to try.

I am happy to source boxes form elsewhere but I need to do that only with a proven mod. I sourced the RHD Jeep box locally on the off chance that it would work and it did prove the mounting arrangement except the drop arm goes the wrong way. I cannot see any reason why the 101 drop arm could not be modified to work on the Jeep box.

Cheers

Garry

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes it was lhd 131x box.

Hopefully you'll find an alternative but the Jeep and RB44 (Dodge/Renault based) are the only ones I've heard of that don't need major chassis mods.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You're right about the RRC, Defender and Discovery units, but P38 boxes sit outboard of the chassis, so shouldn't need any cutting. That's why there has been a shift towards them by the Series crowd.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The RRC, Defender and Discovery units can all fit outside the chassis but the output shaft housing is too long and results in having to cut the chassis to make room for it - the drop arm is then on the inside of the chassis. I thought P38 boxes had to be installed in the same manner.

Cheers

Garry

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The RHD P38 box sits on the outside of the chassis as standard. The RRC, Disco and Defender sit in the inside and are more bulky.

I have never seen the chassis on a 101 so cant help much....................

Another one you might look at is from a Vauxhall Omega B...........Holden something or other there I guess ?

That sits on the inside of the frame but is less bulky. It would certainly be up to the job !

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for that - on the 101 all boxes need to be mounted on the outside of the chassis or else a couple of right angle boxes are needed to take the steering drive to the steering box.

The RRC, Disco and Defender boxes can be mounted on the outside of the chassis but it needs to be cut as per the following pic - something I do not want to do.

grumble-101-pas-006_zpsd52410f3.jpg

I need to double check the P38 steering box when I can get hold of one.

The Vauxhall Omega B is our Holden Commodore but here it runs a rack and pinion system not a separate steering box.

Thanks for the leads.

Cheers

Garry

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Could you post up a pic of the standard steering set-up? It may prompt some discussion.

G.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Pics will not be much good as most of the system I am taking about is hidden - basically from the steering relay to the wheels it is the same basic system as any other series vehicle. The steering column with the steering box attached at the bottom is nearly vertical and has a steering arm and tube that goes back to the steering relay. Hopefully some pics below but will be hard to interpret if the system is not know,

I am not after suggestions on how to do power steering and I have no intention of experimenting. I am after someone who has actually done it on their 101 without cutting the chassis. There are plenty of people who know someone who has done it but with one exception I have not found anyone who has actually done it themselves.

The first pic is the steering arm attached to the steering box and the steering rod that goes back to the steering relay (steering box bottom right corner).

The second pic is taken from between the chassis rails and shows the same as the first pic but from the opposite side.

The last pic is the steering box. The steering column is at the top. The output side of the steering box is obscured by the chassis.

Had to add pics as thumbnails as Photobucket is down.

Cheers

Garry

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Pics will not be much good as most of the system I am taking about is hidden - basically from the steering relay to the wheels it is the same basic system as any other series vehicle. The steering column with the steering box attached at the bottom is nearly vertical and has a steering arm and tube that goes back to the steering relay. Hopefully some pics below but will be hard to interpret if the system is not know,

I am not after suggestions on how to do power steering and I have no intention of experimenting. I am after someone who has actually done it on their 101 without cutting the chassis. There are plenty of people who know someone who has done it but with one exception I have not found anyone who has actually done it themselves.

The first pic is the steering arm attached to the steering box and the steering rod that goes back to the steering relay (steering box bottom right corner).

The second pic is taken from between the chassis rails and shows the same as the first pic but from the opposite side.

The last pic is the steering box. The steering column is at the top. The output side of the steering box is obscured by the chassis.

Had to add pics as thumbnails as Photobucket is down.

Cheers

Garry

post-414-0-96332500-1399526427_thumb.jpg

post-414-0-85765700-1399526475_thumb.jpg

post-414-0-58610000-1399526522_thumb.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Garry

I did this mod on my since departed 101 some years ago.

If memory serves correctly, the box was from a Leyland Daf van, possibly badged as a Freight Rover.

There was an adapter plate which bolted to the chassis, and a brace which welded to the bumper I think.

If you are a member of the 101 owners club, post up on there as the new owner is a member.

I may have pictures on my PC at home, but am working away at present.

If you can PM me a reminder in a week or so, I will have a look.

It was 14 years ago, so the memory is a bit hazy!

Mike

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Could you make use of an electrically assisted power steering column from a modern vehicle? Quite a few Vauxhalls etc. have them and they can provide a fair bit of oomph, and it moves the alteration from steering box to indoors.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'd have worries about the strain on the steering box and relay with a column mounted electrical assister. While fitting the Defender or P38 systems gets around this on standard Series LRs, the 101 still needs the steering relay. I've heard of pattern relays shearing with manual steering, so I'd be nervous of having PAS even with a genuine relay. I think I'd go down the hydraulic ram route and live with the original gearing and relative sloppiness the original system with a ram has compared to the LR PAS systems (the relay is still going to give some of that even with a P38 unit driving it).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was thinking of the "millie" conversion - fitting a PAS box INTO the relay hole as a replacement for the relay, but I can't visualise the 101 system to see if it would work.

There's a thread on the Series forum that has a few photos, it may help.

G.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Judging from the above photos, it looks like the 101 shares the same components as a SII or SIII. Just imagine a SII/SIII steering column orientated vertically, running down your shins. The box is fitted tot he chassis and the drop arm is fitted so it points upwards. Like the SII and SIII, it moves a link for and aft that acts on the top arm of the relay, set in the same way as a SII and SIII's, which operates the relay and drag link.

While it shares the same type parts as the SI-SIII, allowed by fitting the drop arm in another orientation, there is no way of using PAS like on a Series because the PAS box input needs to be horizontal to connect directly to a drag link (replacing both the box and relay of a Series system), and so there's no way of connecting that to a vertical column.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I can tell you guys that even though the relay is similar in construction it is much beefier, my Dad is restoring a 101 and just had his relay apart for servicing and everything is just one size bigger. I wouldn't worry too much about applying PAS forces through this as the car itself isn't really heavier than any other LR and though the tyres a big from a factory point of view, they are nothing compared to what people run from the aftermarket. Electric assist on the column would worry me a bit though as the steering box doesn't seem all that beefy, and further I doubt you would be able to get your feet around it in the cab.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Mike - that is exactly what I was looking for - an actual conversion rather than a hearsay conversion. We do not have the Sherpa in Australia but I do remember driving around in them when I lived in the UK. I will do some further research on this and see if I can source two from breakers and get them imported. I was a member of the 101 Club but they were not really providing much support for foreign members and their spare parts process was woeful - they still owe me some small parts from about 4 years ago that I have paid for - decided it was better to pay more at other suppliers and get the goods rather than paying less and never getting them. A number of other Aussie members have also left the club for similar reasons.

Thanks to every one else for your comments - as indicated the 101 steering is basically the same design from the relay to the wheels but nothing is common with any other Landrover - it is much more heavy duty than those. Likewise there has been a few suggestions to use electric steering etc and thanks for those but I a not looking a prototyping something that has not been done - hence my interest in those who have actually done it.

If anyone has versions that have been installed in 101s that do not involve cutting the chassis please post.

Cheers

Garry

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sean,

I had exactly the same experience with my 101. Fortunately I was just pulling into my driveway at the time. The old column had corrosion on the lower race and fatigue in the upper race. Its now been cut down to be the column for my 109 PAS but that is another story.

Part of the problem with the 101 steering box is that there is no oil drain plug reaching all the way to the bottom of the box so moisture can gather. As oil floats on water it means the lower bearing sits in a water bath. My fix was to machine a drain plug hole trough the base of the steering box on the CL of the column so now draining periodically is easy. I also put one-shot grease in there which will stick to the bearing if if it gets wet. It has worked well for the last 10 years although the truck does not get driven in the cold winter here because of the salt they dump everywhere.

Sorry Garry, not much to add to the PAS other than I don'yt think there is enough legroom under the dash on a 101 to install an electric assist.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Garry

No problem.

It was just the outrigger cut off as I remember.

I will try to have a look when I get home to see if I have any more info on the conversion.

There were two sizes of van as I remember.

The smaller single wheel rear axle, and the larger twin rear axle that were used as ambulances.

I bought the parts from a "friend of a friend" who was taking the unit off his 101 to return it to original spec for some reason!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If you were able to advise which model - that would be great.

Cheers

Garry

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Garry

This one looks similar??

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LDV-Convoy-400-Power-Steering-Box-Peugeot-Engine-Only-1993-1997-/301097930855?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item461ad5d067

I can't be 100% sure though.

The years indicated would be about right as it was 1999 / 2000 when I did the conversion.

If you still have contacts in the 101 club, try contacting Steve Taylor, as he bought the 101 from me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We use cookies to ensure you get the best experience. By using our website you agree to our Cookie Policy