Adam001 Posted June 9, 2014 Share Posted June 9, 2014 Hi Looking for some advice. I am currently fitting a BMW M52 engine into my defender and need to plumb up the powersteering. Initially I thought I would just make up a line and job done. Then had a bit of a think about the pressures and noticed they are wildly different. The label on the BMW pump is 110Bar (~1600PSI) and I believe the LR steering box is designed to work between 1000-1100PSI Does anyone have any knowledge of putting in different engines and connecting up power steering? The internet is lacking info! Thanks, Adam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retroanaconda Posted June 9, 2014 Share Posted June 9, 2014 How different is the mount? Would it not be easiest to adapt a Land Rover pump, either a 200Tdi v-belt or a 300Tdi serpentine belt, to fit the M52 engine? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam001 Posted June 9, 2014 Author Share Posted June 9, 2014 The bracket is simple enough, I could probably weld something up without too much fuss to match a different pump. M52 is a Serpentine, are they fairly standard in that if I bought a 300tdi pump it might match the pulley bolt PCD? Anyone able to measure the bolt spacing on a 300tdi pulley? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted June 9, 2014 Share Posted June 9, 2014 Have you looked in parts info to see what pump LR South Arica fitted to SA 2.8i models http://lrcat.com/#31/4/53312 worth checking the pzarts listing for power steering box too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Team Idris Posted June 9, 2014 Share Posted June 9, 2014 Coming at it as a hydraulics install issue, rather than a mixed-vehicle parts problem, I would fit a 1100psi relief valve into the feed pipe. I'm sure I've seen more than 1100psi on my 4 bolt pump with a landy diesel pump? I thought it was more like 1400 ? Or what about a steering pump spring change, if it will let you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam001 Posted June 9, 2014 Author Share Posted June 9, 2014 Yeah I tried that, it looks like a 300tdi pump but the part number is different so I can't cross reference it. Steering box is RHD TD5. So I know it's not the BMW pump at least Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted June 9, 2014 Share Posted June 9, 2014 I run a P38 power steering pump (which is the higher pressure you talk about above) on a 4-bolt box with no issues at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam001 Posted June 9, 2014 Author Share Posted June 9, 2014 Coming at it as a hydraulics install issue, rather than a mixed-vehicle parts problem, I would fit a 1100psi relief valve into the feed pipe. I'm sure I've seen more than 1100psi on my 4 bolt pump with a landy diesel pump? I thought it was more like 1400 ? Or what about a steering pump spring change, if it will let you? Good idea, although, just had a quick look and the relief valves are serious money. Think I'll probably go down the custom bracket route and put a standard pump on. If someone has the PCD of the 300tdi that would help though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam001 Posted June 9, 2014 Author Share Posted June 9, 2014 I run a P38 power steering pump (which is the higher pressure you talk about above) on a 4-bolt box with no issues at all. Oh so in that case I don't have a problem then Was concerned the Box's seals wouldn't take the pressure Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Team Idris Posted June 9, 2014 Share Posted June 9, 2014 You might be looking at pilot-operated-relief valves? Phoenix have simple valves for less than £30. But the bracket fab is a good simple choice. You know what pump you need in the future then Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zim Posted June 9, 2014 Share Posted June 9, 2014 I ran a disco 2 box for years with a pump rated to 1500 psi. You do realise that it only sees that pressure when you load it up (i.e. full lock) ? I'd run it without hesitation. G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tacr2man Posted June 9, 2014 Share Posted June 9, 2014 I am running a BMW M57 pump in a 110 with 285 tyres and works well , with no leak issues so far Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted June 9, 2014 Share Posted June 9, 2014 Yup, go for it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam001 Posted June 10, 2014 Author Share Posted June 10, 2014 Score! Next question (I am a complete newb at Hydraulics!) I am planning on using a banjo off the existing M16x1.5 thread on the pump and then have a pipe made up going straight to the box, anyone know what thread the box is off hand? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam001 Posted June 17, 2014 Author Share Posted June 17, 2014 Just to feedback a bit... Quite difficult to get people to make these lines up, due to the high pressures suppliers are quite reluctant to do one-offs which is very odd as it used to be quite easy. So instead I am going for a motorsports type set-up using Earls Performance Products parts namely.... M14x1.5 to AN6 adapter (Steering Box) 90 Degree AN6 hose end Blue Powersteering hose (Rated at 2250PSI) Straight AN6 Hose end AN6 M16 Banjo Adapter M16x1.5 Banjo Bolt (BMW Steering Pump) M16 Aluminium Crush Washers Costing the princely sum of £143, but at least I know the quality! Adam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted June 17, 2014 Share Posted June 17, 2014 That's not too bad in all honesty, hoses can get very very costly very very quickly, and 2 hydraulic lines could see you up to close to £100 depending on spec, and I assume this means you can make them up in-situ now and get the routing much better? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam001 Posted June 17, 2014 Author Share Posted June 17, 2014 Gives me a bit of confidence you saying that, was thinking it was expensive! Yeah I can build it up in situ, so brought more hose then I actually need, should mean I can make it nice and neat. Will also be using extra protection over the hose just to protect it a little, but it is triple steel reinforced hose! I'm using AN style fittings on a few other things (gearbox cooler for example) so at least it will be neat. It is surprising there is a near on total lack of info on custom powersteering hoses on the net! I will do a mini write up when I make it up I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zim Posted June 17, 2014 Share Posted June 17, 2014 Sorry, but i'd class that as expensive. But them i'm comparing it to hydraulic hoses and fittings. Our local place would probably ask for £35 for a hose with a few fittings / banjo's. G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted June 17, 2014 Share Posted June 17, 2014 Well I was too, for two hoses, but I get the impression now that this is just one? £70+VAT for 2 hoses is what I would expect made up round here, which is getting pretty close to the £100 mark. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam001 Posted June 17, 2014 Author Share Posted June 17, 2014 Yes this is for 1 hose, just the high pressure side (everything else is easy), with the different adapters to make it work. The adapters are the things pushing the cost up. Problem is, local hydraulic places are either useless or will not carry out the work due to potential liability (PAS fluid being ultra flammable under pressure) I guess one upside is that I can re-configure it in future... I'll use the excess hose to replace the return hoses Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted June 17, 2014 Share Posted June 17, 2014 Jeebus that's pricey, when I had a BMW (or TDv6) ZF pump on mine Hyphose made a pair of pipes (feed & return) up for around £50. If memory serves the fittings are an automotive sort of thing not used in the wider hydraulics industry, but I used the original fitting & a short stub of metal pipe from the donor vehicle, and they then put a compression olive fitting over the pipe with the "normal" style hydraulic hose off the back of that. Never had a problem, running a Disco 2 box and 37" tyres. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pollywog Posted June 17, 2014 Share Posted June 17, 2014 I had the same problem last year getting some made to suit a 200tdi pump to p38 box. Pirtek wanted £140+vat just to adapt the old 200tdi pipes, other hydraulics places weren't sure about doing them as they thought I'd either end up with jerky steering due to the give in their hoses or didn't think their hoses would be compatible with the fluid. In the end due to lack of options I had a local agricultural hydraulics company make me a set and have been using wilkos hydraulic PAS fluid rather than ATF. No jerky steering and so far so good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam001 Posted June 18, 2014 Author Share Posted June 18, 2014 I had the same thought as you Fridge, adapt the old pipes, nope, no one would go near! Most places couldn't do the M14x1.5 O ring seal (Typical fuel injection and power steering fitting) and would have to use a banjo, but I wasn't willing to put a banjo on the steering box as the surface isn't machined for it, the pump side however polished nicely for a banjo. Yeah Pirtek wanted in the range of £150! Some places said they needed a pipe to copy (which sounded more of a fob off really) I guess if I spent a few days driving around different places I would eventually find somewhere cheaper! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbs Posted June 18, 2014 Share Posted June 18, 2014 I've used my local to me truck repair place in Frome,Somerset-Reynolds I think it's called and they do all of the hydraulic crimping and good steel braided hoses etc. for a good price, My gearbox to oil cooler pipes on my stumpy R380 was about 60.00 all up and a patch pipe with connectors for the old and the new pipework for my milemarker when i cut into it by mistake-about 12 inches long was 12.00 too John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam001 Posted June 18, 2014 Author Share Posted June 18, 2014 Well on the upside, I will probably be the only one with cool Blue shiny PAS lines! haha Typical! Firm has just come back to me saying they can do one for £50!! Grrr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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