Ian Barrett Posted March 24, 2015 Share Posted March 24, 2015 Evening all Sorry about the title. Bloody iPad has it's own mind sometimes and this time it seems it was happy with that title and posted the thread for me! Anyhow ... I've got a 200tdi engine I bought off here a little while ago and just got started on tidying it ready to put in my truck this summer. First job is to sort out the Turbo (ETC7461) because I take it any sideways movement when you get hold of the fins is a bad thing. So how do you get the ruddy thing off. There are 4 1/2inch bolts and none of them move. I've got them soaking in penetrating oil but is it usual to have to use heat on these bolts I've also got a hole at the top rear of the engine block, just behind the fuel lift pump which is full of silicone. Any ideas what was previously in this hole and why it might just have been bodged like this.. Lastly. It's a 13L engine but has already been prepped for a defender. I take it there were no significant differences with these engines because of them being Disco auto engines originally. Any gotchas I should be looking out for? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted March 24, 2015 Share Posted March 24, 2015 It's a 13L engine it'll be a 12L [ex-discovery unit] no such thing as a 13L 200tdi front to rear play is bad, a little sideways play is ok as the turbo shaft bearings have a presurised film of engine oil to run in a turbo strip/build by Les Henson in the tech archive http://forums.lr4x4.com/index.php?showtopic=2049&page=2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ejparrott Posted March 24, 2015 Share Posted March 24, 2015 There is always a bit of movement, how much have you got? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Barrett Posted March 24, 2015 Author Share Posted March 24, 2015 Aaah, didn't think to pull/push. I'll go check that. The engine number clearly starts 13L though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Barrett Posted March 24, 2015 Author Share Posted March 24, 2015 13L01668A is the number on the block. Does this mean it isn't a 200tdi ? Are there other identifying features of a 200tdi I can check ? Good news on the turbo maybe. There is no push/pull movement I'd estimate the sideways movement at about 1mm each way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted March 24, 2015 Share Posted March 24, 2015 13L01668A is the number on the block. Does this mean it isn't a 200tdi ? Are there other identifying features of a 200tdi I can check ? Good news on the turbo maybe. There is no push/pull movement I'd estimate the sideways movement at about 1mm each way. just found there is a 13L 200tdi it's from a auto trans Discovery, wasn't aware that the engine serial number had a different prefix, found it in this engine number list http://www.glencoyne.co.uk/engno.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boydie Posted March 24, 2015 Share Posted March 24, 2015 1mm sideways movement is far too much, the bearings are kaput, a replacement "cassette" is the easy go, then in time get the existing one re-built as a possible long term spare. Removal of the four bolts is a real hassle as these can weld in due to sheer long term heat, the easy way is to remove the entire exhaust manifold and you will find it easier to do on your work bench. If need be buy a set of IRWIN sockets, these will grip the bolt head even if the edges are worn, if the heads break off you will need to have the "studs" removed and possibly even re-tapped (as I had to with mine) and Helicoil's fitted. Make sure you fit new 8.8 grade bolts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RodneyA Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 I had the same problem recently, I just used a Nut Splitter to remove each nut in seconds. I got a set of these. http://www.amazon.co.uk/9MM-manufactured-molybdenum-chemically-Capacities/dp/B00DW568R4/ref=sr_1_12?ie=UTF8&qid=1427253840&sr=8-12&keywords=draper+nut+splitter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ejparrott Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 1mm is quite a lot, as it's out of the vehicle I can't suggest running it up and seeing if it leaks. As it's out, I'd go for replacement to be honest. My Project 109, when I get on with it, is going to be getting complete engine rebuild, new turbo, rebuilt gearboxes etc, simply because I want to put it on the road and drive it, not then start changing things because they're worn out and I didn't replace them when I had the chance. Means it's going to cost a lot to get on the road, but hopefully it'll not cost me much once it is on the road. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Barrett Posted March 25, 2015 Author Share Posted March 25, 2015 I had the same problem recently, I just used a Nut Splitter to remove each nut in seconds. I got a set of these. http://www.amazon.co.uk/9MM-manufactured-molybdenum-chemically-Capacities/dp/B00DW568R4/ref=sr_1_12?ie=UTF8&qid=1427253840&sr=8-12&keywords=draper+nut+splitter Are they nuts I'm trying to get off then RodneyA ? I honestly thought they were bolts. I've been and bought a set of Irwin bolt removers like these http://www.amazon.co.uk/Irwin-Bolt-Grip-Remover-394001/dp/B0000CCXVZ/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1427292672&sr=8-1&keywords=irwin+bolt+extractor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 Those are nut splitters.... NOT bolt removers These are bolt/nut removers: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Irwin-Bolt-Grip-Remover-394001/dp/B0000CCXVZ For nuts though, if indeed they are, the splitters are excellent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 On a defender 200 its 4 nuts that keep the turbo unit on the manifold, had to take mine off sometime ago, not the easiest things to get a spanner on Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Barrett Posted March 25, 2015 Author Share Posted March 25, 2015 You aren't kidding there western. I have loads of spanners and sockets but still had to go rooting for a 1/2inch spanner that would both fit and not flex when I leant on it. Nuts or bolts - one way or another they are coming off tonight. Even if I have to get the gas on them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Barrett Posted March 25, 2015 Author Share Posted March 25, 2015 Does anyone have an idea what the hole full of silicone just above and to the back of the engine of the fuel lift pump might once have had in it ? Bloody hate silicone anywhere near an engine so I'd like to find a different way to plug it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mo Murphy Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 It's not the vacuum pump hole is it ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 Silicon sealant is used by many many manufacturers to seal their engines.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 on the block there should be 3 holes sealed with a rubber bung or sealant, these are the oil drillings for the camshaft bearings IIRC. PLUG-BLANKING ERR5034 item 13 in http://lrcat.com/#31/4/53142 http://www.brit-car.co.uk/product.php/85068/1098/plug_rubber_block_side_2_300tdi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boydie Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 Yes, they are the same on the 300Tdi, just rubber/silicon plugs to fill in a hole drilled during block machining for the cam shaft bearing lubrication, once fitted the bearing blocks off the hole and the plug is there to prevent dirt from getting in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Barrett Posted March 25, 2015 Author Share Posted March 25, 2015 Great detective work guys. I've had a scape at some of the crud on the top of the block and found another 2 bits of sealant. That makes 3 which are right under the back 3 head bolts on the fuel pump side of the engine. My OCD won't let me life with the sealant. So I'll add 3 x ERR5034 to my shopping list. As an update to the turbo issue. I've unbolted the turbo from the manifold - and all 4 nuts (yep, nuts - doh!) brought their studs out with them. But they are out intact. Now I need to work out how to get the damned thing unattached from the block. whatever the bigger hose is at the bottom just won't let it come off - yet. I think I'll have to take the manifold off to allow the turbo to twist around and wind the hose out of the block. I'll get there! Thank you for your support but I suspect its not the last time I'll be asking for your help. The good news is the truck is on the road and running nicely on its 19j 2.5TD engine. I had her up to a heady 65mph yesterday - if I had any hair I suspect it would have been blown off This is an upgrade project for the future so I'm in no screaming hurry.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 Oil drain to sump is it? about an inch round? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Barrett Posted March 25, 2015 Author Share Posted March 25, 2015 Sounds right Bowie69. Big fat thing with a little bit of flexi in the middle. 28mm nut with a locking nut on the block end. Not the little one with a banjo bolt on the end which is on the top. That came off nicely. I'll cut the flexi if I need to and replace it when I rebuild. But its loose at the block, I just cant separate the turning nut from its locking nut and they are both turning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted March 26, 2015 Share Posted March 26, 2015 You will need some sealant for the 3 bungs to ensure they are sealed in place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Barrett Posted March 26, 2015 Author Share Posted March 26, 2015 You will need some sealant for the 3 bungs to ensure they are sealed in place. The irony of that statement isn't lost on me. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted March 26, 2015 Share Posted March 26, 2015 Indeed, they are designed to use sealant.... you are making work for yourself! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Barrett Posted March 26, 2015 Author Share Posted March 26, 2015 Once I get this bloody turbo off tonight. And if we decide its too worn to risk putting in, is it a new CHRA cartridge I need Like this http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LANDROVER-200TDi-TB02-TURBO-Prt-No-465175-465171-UPRATED-CHRA-CARTRIDGE-/171639044189?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item27f67bf85d Or is it this repair kit http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LANDROVER-300TDi-T250-200TDi-TB02-TURBO-UPGRADE-MAJOR-SERVICE-REPAIR-KIT-/181669520632?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item2a4c58e4f8 Looking at the youtube vids it doesn't look THAT difficult a thing to do. Though you can bet your socks the bolts and that big eff-off circlip won't come out easily. Or am I better giving it to someone like Turbo Technics or Midland Turbo who are just around the corner from where I work, and getting them to refurb it. Is it worth the effort I guess is my question Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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