garrycol Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 EDIS 8 is almost impossible to get in Aust. I can get 4.0/4.6 Rover coil packs for a reasonable price. Will these coil packs work direct from MS/MJ or will an additional component need to be purchased when I get my MS/MJ (not yet decided whether to stay carbs or injection). Thanks Garry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 MJ required EDIS as far as I know, I don't think there is a way to handle the coil triggering without it, as there are just two lines in/out of MJ, the SAW and PIP, nothing else. MS can run coils directly, and yes you need to build it so that it will, btu perfectly doable. EDIS makes this very, very simple though, has a fall back and takes all the heavy lifting out of the ECU and into the engine bay. Did they not sell Ford V8s over there then? Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought they'd be pretty common over there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 MJ required EDIS as far as I know, I don't think there is a way to handle the coil triggering without it, as there are just two lines in/out of MJ, the SAW and PIP, nothing else. MS can run coils directly, and yes you need to build it so that it will, btu perfectly doable. EDIS makes this very, very simple though, has a fall back and takes all the heavy lifting out of the ECU and into the engine bay. Did they not sell Ford V8s over there then? Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought they'd be pretty common over there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elbekko Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 The EDIS coil packs themselves can be easily replaced by LR ones, but you'd still need the EDIS8 itself. Or, as Bowie says, make it direct coil drive, then you can use them from MS without EDIS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 Yes and I wish I could go back and edit the typos in the (duplicated) posts! :/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 I could supply you a edis 8 and plug with pigtail and ship . Pm me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garrycol Posted July 4, 2015 Author Share Posted July 4, 2015 Thanks for the information. As far as I am aware the only vehicles sold here in Aust EDIS 8 were late 90s Mustangs and virtually none were sold (not popular here) and the late 90s Ford Falcon V8 and again virtually no V8s were sold as 6 cylinder vehicles were more popular at the time. So very few available - I have never seen any for sale locally. Yes I know I can get them from overseas but they are expensive in $AUD and shipping is a killer where rover coil packs are cheap and plentyful. Nige - I will be contacting you when I have decided on my engine configuration. Thanks Garry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave W Posted July 4, 2015 Share Posted July 4, 2015 I've set up a few MS installs directly driving the coils, if you happen to have an engine with a factory crank sensor fitted you can also then make use of that rather than having to fit a toothed wheel/pickup. The MS will need to be built with the 4 coil drivers and I'd strongly recommend that, if you go down that route, you get the coil drivers themselves installed outside the MS ECU in the engine bay - I find it reduces any problems with electrical interference with the MS ECU. You can fit all 4 in a small cast aluminium box which also acts as a heatsink and provides electrical screening. One alternative you could think of, given your location, is to look at the LSx engines which I think are fitted to Holden V8s. The coils on the later engines, where each cylinder has it's own coil mounted on the rocker cover, have built in drivers and the MS can drive them directly in a coil near plug setup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheesy Posted July 4, 2015 Share Posted July 4, 2015 You have lots of options with MS. You can run 4 BIP373 chips either inside of preferably outside the MS case or you can use an ignitor form a different car, there is a 4 channel Bosch one, or you can run two 2 channel modules, the EVO lancer ones are very robust and appear to use a very similar coil pack. Some Subarus have an external 2 channel Hitachi unit which is what I am using below. There is also a Subaru 4 post coil pack with built in ingnitor, or as suggested above the LSx coil packs are probably the best option if available. There are also some Nissan 4 channel (bottom right) but from what I have read these are not very good. The Mitsubishi ignitors look like the ones on bottom left with 2 plugs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheesy Posted July 4, 2015 Share Posted July 4, 2015 Double post Just to note, that isnt a Rover coil pack it is a pair of Hyundai coil packs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave W Posted July 5, 2015 Share Posted July 5, 2015 Another idea that might be available to you as alternative coils/drivers is the VW unit - VW Part number 06A905104 It's a 4 cylinder self contained coil pack and driver unit, just takes a 12volt supply and a signal from the MS to drive each coil, fitted to all sorts of VW/Audi/Skoda vehicles. The coil driver that does all the hard work is built in. Here's one: http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/VW-VOLKSWAGEN-BORA-CADDY-GOLF-2-0-IGNITION-COIL-06A-905-097-06A-905-104-12726-/111458305540 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garrycol Posted July 5, 2015 Author Share Posted July 5, 2015 Thanks for the information on the alternatives - not sure I understand all the information that you posted up Cheesy but only because i am not yet across MS and its pros and cons - I will bookmark this so as I investigate further I will have a reference. However the LS* coil packs are a real option as they are freely available. Cheers Garry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chazza Posted July 5, 2015 Share Posted July 5, 2015 Did they not sell Ford V8s over there then? Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought they'd be pretty common over there. There was no requirement for cars to have limp-home mode in Australia so all of the Fords arrived without EDIS, unfortunately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elbekko Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Another idea that might be available to you as alternative coils/drivers is the VW unit - VW Part number 06A905104 It's a 4 cylinder self contained coil pack and driver unit, just takes a 12volt supply and a signal from the MS to drive each coil, fitted to all sorts of VW/Audi/Skoda vehicles. The coil driver that does all the hard work is built in. Here's one: http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/VW-VOLKSWAGEN-BORA-CADDY-GOLF-2-0-IGNITION-COIL-06A-905-097-06A-905-104-12726-/111458305540 How is that different from the LR coilpacks which also just need a +12V, ground, and trigger to operate? Is there an easy way to find out if there are built in coil drivers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave W Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 LR Coilpacks don't have built in drivers, they don't need 12v, ground and trigger, they have a common 12v connected to one side of both coils and the remaining 2 connectors are the other side of each coil. A built in driver in the coil has a few advantages: 1) No specialist circuit needed to drive them, in the case of 5v triggered versions you can literally hook the trigger up to the microprocessor output (although it's always a good idea to buffer it with a low power transistor). 2) The built in driver is preconfigured to give the optimum charge time for the coil. 3) Having the driver built into the coil reduces the chance of electrical "noise" being generated that can interfere with the operation of the MS. This is often a problem with MS when people mount the coil drivers inside the MS case and can cause all sorts of strange issues. (Which is why, if you use the BIP drivers, I always recommend mounting them in their own cast aluminium box in the engine bay). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheesy Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 LR Coilpacks don't have built in drivers, they don't need 12v, ground and trigger, they have a common 12v connected to one side of both coils and the remaining 2 connectors are the other side of each coil. A built in driver in the coil has a few advantages: 1) No specialist circuit needed to drive them, in the case of 5v triggered versions you can literally hook the trigger up to the microprocessor output (although it's always a good idea to buffer it with a low power transistor). 2) The built in driver is preconfigured to give the optimum charge time for the coil. 3) Having the driver built into the coil reduces the chance of electrical "noise" being generated that can interfere with the operation of the MS. This is often a problem with MS when people mount the coil drivers inside the MS case and can cause all sorts of strange issues. (Which is why, if you use the BIP drivers, I always recommend mounting them in their own cast aluminium box in the engine bay). 2. This is not the case with the LSx coil packs, they need the dwel time set in the ecu. I haven't come across many coil packs that do have dwel control built in Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave W Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Yep, you're right, keyboard working faster than my brain today The dwell has to be set by the same ECU that controls the ignition timing, I was thinking about EDIS so ignore item 2 ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheesy Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Yep, you're right, keyboard working faster than my brain today The dwell has to be set by the same ECU that controls the ignition timing, I was thinking about EDIS so ignore item 2 ! You are half right I guess, there definitely are ignitors and coil packs with built in ignitors that do this but they seem less common, or at least not used very often on MS installs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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