Croatia Trophy 2016

[Ozzy50]

Aah right ,good to know .

[FridgeFreezer]

Daan, great pics, looks like a good event... I'm not jealous...

Ozzy: As Daan said, if you're going for Ladoga, read the rules & classes first, don't screw yourself over by ending up the only knife in a gunfight! Even "Tourist" class that Mike & Ash did is a tough prospect. By the sound of it, the same applies to Croatia too.

Also very much 2nd Daan's comment that you need a reliable car - mods mean nothing, you need to be able to beat the hell out of it every day for 8 days straight and fix it every night, and ideally have a few hours left for sleeping. I'd say at the very least you want a mate with a support truck & trailer who can have the kettle on by the time you roll into camp.

[Ozzy50]

Yeah cheers Fridge ,you were/are part of The house of flying spanners team ,if I'm correct ? Have read plenty on your adventures and watched plenty of videos too ,the pig was a favourite of mine and mouse too ,all good stuff .

Might have to use a freelander ,I hear they are reliable ........................................................................................

IM JOKING !!!!!!!!! Don't shoot me !

[elbekko]

It would be fun to see a Freelander doing Grand Tourism.

[landroversforever]

It would be fun to see a Freelander doing Grand Tourism.

It certainly would be interesting! Light weight would be a bonus!

[FridgeFreezer]

If the Dutch guys can get their Pajero through Tourism and the Belgian collective can get a P38 there & back I reckon a carefully prepped FL would be decent Tourism/Grand Tourism class machinery. Seriously thought about it myself as taking the 109 would dump me in TR3 with the loonies or (worse) Proto with the big boys. Just take a spare alternator, water pump, idler, and VCU bearings I reckon.

...but this is a thread hijack now! Back towards the subject, I reckon Croatia looks like a damn good shakedown if you're thinking of that sort of event - easier to get to, easier on the wallet, hard enough to make you work by the look of it - I guess Daan could comment on the difficulty as he's done both.

[Daan]

I think the off-roading in Croatia is not necessarily ridiculous. There are no 2 mile swamps for example like you have in ladoga. But it is just the sheer amount of driving to do. Longest stage is 80 km. There were quite a few Russian teams, who needed to make a very long trip, with all those interesting events on their doorstep, so there is definitely something they have been attracted to to do Croatia.

Easier to get to? You actually do very little driving to Russia, as the ferry to Helsinki sorts all that out. Croatia door to door there is 1200 miles to drive. You don't have the problems of visas etc as Croatia is in the EU.

Easier on the wallet, no. I paid £1800 starting fee, but that includes food for a crew of 4. then you have a ferry, renting a trailer, bribing mates to tow it, all their fuel etc. Prep the car, flying tickets for me and mark, Beer, park my car at heathrow, keep the boss happy by agreeing to a new kitchen and bathroom. All in there is no change from £5k, which is more than I remember spending on Ladoga (kitchen and bathroom not included).

Croatia is a bit more of a gentlemen race: you stay on one campsite for the duration of the event, there is food and water readily available, there is a village with shops next door etc. they drag your car out of the woods if you need it, so you are never in danger of getting completely lost. When we broke our car, I just went on my mobile phone and searched topusko on google maps: it thought about it for a while and then said: turn left here...

I wouldn't take the freelander to Ladoga: without low range your clutch plates will be toast by day 2 I reckon.

Daan

[elbekko]

If the Dutch guys can get their Pajero through Tourism and the Belgian collective can get a P38 there & back I reckon a carefully prepped FL would be decent Tourism/Grand Tourism class machinery. Seriously thought about it myself as taking the 109 would dump me in TR3 with the loonies or (worse) Proto with the big boys. Just take a spare alternator, water pump, idler, and VCU bearings I reckon.

...but this is a thread hijack now! Back towards the subject, I reckon Croatia looks like a damn good shakedown if you're thinking of that sort of event - easier to get to, easier on the wallet, hard enough to make you work by the look of it - I guess Daan could comment on the difficulty as he's done both.

You could always do Grand Tourism with the 109

I think the off-roading in Croatia is not necessarily ridiculous. There are no 2 mile swamps for example like you have in ladoga. But it is just the sheer amount of driving to do. Longest stage is 80 km. There were quite a few Russian teams, who needed to make a very long trip, with all those interesting events on their doorstep, so there is definitely something they have been attracted to to do Croatia.

Easier to get to? You actually do very little driving to Russia, as the ferry to Helsinki sorts all that out. Croatia door to door there is 1200 miles to drive. You don't have the problems of visas etc as Croatia is in the EU.

Easier on the wallet, no. I paid £1800 starting fee, but that includes food for a crew of 4. then you have a ferry, renting a trailer, bribing mates to tow it, all their fuel etc. Prep the car, flying tickets for me and mark, Beer, park my car at heathrow, keep the boss happy by agreeing to a new kitchen and bathroom. All in there is no change from £5k, which is more than I remember spending on Ladoga (kitchen and bathroom not included).

Croatia is a bit more of a gentlemen race: you stay on one campsite for the duration of the event, there is food and water readily available, there is a village with shops next door etc. they drag your car out of the woods if you need it, so you are never in danger of getting completely lost. When we broke our car, I just went on my mobile phone and searched topusko on google maps: it thought about it for a while and then said: turn left here...

I wouldn't take the freelander to Ladoga: without low range your clutch plates will be toast by day 2 I reckon.

Daan

That is indeed a rather expensive event! Have you looked at the Pomerania Trophy? I quite enjoyed that, lots of driving, some tough off-road sections, and not too far and expensive.

If you take a Freelander off-road it really should be an automatic, they're the only ones that can handle crawling really.

[Daan]

Not really, from where I am there is no difference in going to Croatia or to Poland. The price of Croatia includes food at 250 euros per person (£200 each), you could argue that is too much, but either way those 4 mouths need feeding, what ever you do. I quite like to do the main events were all the big guns go, just out of curiosity.

I wouldn't want to take an automatic car to ladoga to be fair. Automatic boxes were a favourite retirement cause in Croatia (and ladoga), along with burnt out winches and cooked engines.

Daan

[Bowie69]

Is it the sludge killing seals that takes the boxes out?

[Daan]

No you just cook them. Bathtub did a transfer box on day one and a gearbox on day two. I reckon that makes his total amount of gearboxes he did to 5. I still run the same Ashcroft lt 77 +lt230 that I fitted in 2002....

What does brake is the tensioner bearing for the fanbelt (on a 300 tdi). I started with a new tensioner, which got very sloppy after 3 days, I fitted a new one, which is now ready for a new bearing again.

cam belt timing chest is another one which is suffering from the crank seal dying.

[Bowie69]

Hmm, so with REALLY good cooling you may get away with one?

£5K is a lot of dosh, but then you I guess when you don't do it every year it can be justified

Sounds like you have some good mates!

[Daan]

Bathtub had about a square meter of radiators with 4 large fans on the back of his car. But he has about 600 hp to kill in that auto box.

You couldn't give me an auto box for free, I hate the damn things with a passion, mainly for reliability reasons and you can't control wheel spin.

It might be interesting to mention that the winning car had the same engine and similar gearbox as us: a standard 300 tdi with an r380 box and LT230 transfer. The second car had a VW 1.9 diesel. So it is definitely not horsepower that wins.

People easily spend 5 k on doing a championship at mud monsters or Viking offroad, I just think doing an occasional international event is more challenging and entertaining. It is out of our comfort zone, which is the whole attraction of it. I just fancied something we had not done before.

Our mates Steve and Ken were great; we kept feeding them with beer and take them to the swimming pool in town.

Daan

[FridgeFreezer]

Interesting on the costings etc. Daan, I know some guys from the UK did drive rather than take the ferry but it works out about equal ferry cost Vs fuel cost, and 24 hours of enforced lounging about on a boat with all-you-can-eat buffet and a bar is most welcome.

I must say I like the idea of a fixed camp with catering laid on, makes logistics much easier, I'd pay extra for that.

Freelander wise, what led me to the idea was comparing Leo & Benny's (immaculately prepared) Pajero to a FL with a winch, a bit of lift, some under-guards, and a set of muds. I don't know about the 4WD having low-box or not on the Pajero but if you've got a decent winch (and a light vehicle) you can compensate for lack of low-box by winching through - I never said it would be easy or the best vehicle for the job but there's a part of me that thinks it would be a hell of a fun challenge to get a FL through. The Pajero has indy suspension, low clearance, and relatively low power compared to the bigger machinery, I reckon it's not a million miles away from a FL. That said, given you're up against Defenders on (relatively) much bigger tyres I'd perhaps say Grand Tourism for a FL.

[dangerous doug]

All in there is no change from £5k, which is more than I remember spending on Ladoga

Daan

If events like this are your hobby then 5k is not unreasonable for an all inclusive break for 4 people (don't want to use the word holiday)

I know people who spend a lot more than that and sit on a beach all week, not my idea of fun so for that money your making memory's and having a bit of an adventure.

It is nice to know what your looking at for such a trip, Croatia and ladoga were both on the bucket list, better get saving lol

[finnarne]

problem with a trayback is that this changes the silhouette of the car, which puts you in TR3, were all the protos play. That will make your life hell!

Daan

I guess I would get a problem with my D1 bobtail pickup as well, then.

That is indeed a rather expensive event! Have you looked at the Pomerania Trophy? I quite enjoyed that, lots of driving, some tough off-road sections, and not too far and expensive.

This year in Pomerania, we brought my car on a trailer, and stayed at the "hotel" at the camp site. Cost for us, driving from Norway through Denmark and Germany, the cost with 2 nights in hotel in Germany as well, ended up at approximately 1400 euro.

[Daan]

What's the entry fee of the event?

Daan

[finnarne]

For Pomerania Trophy ?

For Adventure Class, it's 1700PLN; which is something like 370€

For Sport class, it 1900PLN, which is something like 415€

There is also Tourist and Lorry-class, which is lesser demanding (Lorry is for those with stock vehicles, but with larger than 32 inch tyres)

Tourist is for stock vehicles, should be possible without winch, but ...

Adventure Class is for slightly modified car with at least front mounted winch.

Sport is for modified cars, with winch front and rear.

We were placed in Sport class, as my car is clearly modified. On 90 with shortened front entered in the Adventure class. Adventure is the large class, we were 3 cars in Sport.

Next Pomerania Trophy is in beginning of October: http://njz.pl/stronaeng.html

But then again, this is of topic. Back to Croatia. I need to rethink my tyres and winch, I guess.