200tdi water ingress, bent conrod

[ash]

Round 2 of my bad luck.

so green laning and went through a little water which suddenly dropped deep.

wading was not planned etc so please leave those comments.

 

anyway, sucked water up through filter and also into turbo and engine cut out. Pulled it out and with help of my friends 

- took out wet air filter

-drained inter cooler and pipes

-removed glow plugs and cranked it over firing all the water out of Pistons

- put it all back together (minus wet filter ) prayed and fired her up.

started and is missing and blowing white/grey smoke. Left it running then went for a drive to try clear it as it needs to get me 170 miles home.

very lumpy and stutters at low revs and blows smoke. At hard revs and speed it's ok.

we think it has bent a conrod due to missing on the fact that it has sucked water into cylinders.

plan to compression test when I get home. What would you check prior to Conrod as its obviously a biggish job?

check pushrods aren't bent?

dont think its bent a valve.

 

ideas and suggestions on the engine please not the stupidity of no snorkel etc as it wasn't planned or intended 

 

 

 

[Happyoldgit]

You dropped the oil, changed it and the filter right?

[Retroanaconda]

Bad luck

 

Head off and measure piston heights is the next step I guess. I wouldn't drive it home - that's what AA/RAC etc. is for.

[vulcan bomber]

If you find a bent rod try and source 4 From the same engine, the rods are balanced in sets so you'll get a smoother engine if you do.

[Snagger]

If you didn't replace the oil before driving home, check the crank journals and bearings, and probably the cam shaft, it's bearings and the followers - they may be damaged by mud particles making their way around.  You also need to strip down the turbo to clean out the innards.  You'll need a large "inside" circlip plier to remove the compressor housing.  Four bolts hold the retaining clamps for the turbine housing.  I'd use a tub of diesel and suspend one end of the turbo core vertically in it to release the dirt and let is settle downwards tot he bottom, being careful not to agitate it, leaving it to soak and clean out for 24 hours.  Any dirt than doesn't come off I'd use an aerosol of WD40 to gently "hose" off, using a tooth brush if required.  Keep the unit vertical until cleaned and dry to keep the dirt away from the shaft and seal - if it gets into the bearings, the turbo will be ruined.  Repeat for the other end.

[Les Henson]

If a con rod is bent, then water in the cylinder on the compression stroke. Valves may have been partly open, so inspect rocker, roll pushrod on a flat surface, etc. Small and big end shells may be damaged due to the impact.

 

 

Les

[ash]

Most likely as I did try to start it as soon as it cut out. It didn't start but obviously I have turned it over there.

when I opened expansion tank it let the pressure out and then gurgled air bubbles which to me suggests it's getting gas into the coolant.. Valves??

i plan to take the head off and start with the rockers and push rods and work my way down until I find the culprit ...... Unless I find a mot failed disco in the meantime

[Orgasmic Farmer]

If you are lucky you may have only bent 1 conrod. I did the same starting an engine that had been stood and snow melt had gone down the snorkel. Was able to change the offending rod by removing head and sump with engine in situ. I had a used con rod from a mate who breaks trucks, Cost me £10 for the rod and about £15 for a new head gasket. Has been perfect since.

[Ex Member]

1 hour ago, Orgasmic Farmer said:

If you are lucky you may have only bent 1 conrod. I did the same starting an engine that had been stood and snow melt had gone down the snorkel. Was able to change the offending rod by removing head and sump with engine in situ. I had a used con rod from a mate who breaks trucks, Cost me £10 for the rod and about £15 for a new head gasket. Has been perfect since.

Not on a Defender 200TDI.  The engine must come out to get the ladder frame off and access the crank.  IME, the bent rods won't clear the bore and need to be cut in half.

Pull the head and have a look.  It does not take very long to pull the head.

[ash]

It's a disco 200 in Def, does that make a difference 

[Bowie69]

Yep, all the difference

[Snagger]

I drilled clearance holes to allow the four countersunk caphead bolts I used in the ladder frame to be removed without pulling the bell housing away from the engine.  Saves a lot of work if I need to get at the crank shaft or oil pump!.

[Orgasmic Farmer]

4 hours ago, Red90 said:

Not on a Defender 200TDI.  The engine must come out to get the ladder frame off and access the crank.  IME, the bent rods won't clear the bore and need to be cut in half.

Pull the head and have a look.  It does not take very long to pull the head.

Mine was a 200 tdi, albeit a disco one, but it still had the ladder frame in there. However, the conrod that was bent corresponded to the only place in the ladder where you can access the big end without dropping the frame. As I said. I got lucky. I think it was number 3 cylinder (but it might have been number 2).

[reb78]

14 hours ago, Snagger said:

I drilled clearance holes to allow the four countersunk caphead bolts I used in the ladder frame to be removed without pulling the bell housing away from the engine.  Saves a lot of work if I need to get at the crank shaft or oil pump!.

Snagger, this sounds like a good idea, but I'm struggling to envisage exactly what you did. Can yiu describe it further? Some pics?

[Snagger]

I don't have any photos and the car is about 3500 miles from me, so I can't rush out to it, but ill try to explain more clearly.

I fit the 200Tdi in a Series 109.  The majority of studs lines up with the bell housing, two holes in the Disco flywheel housing needed drilling and tapping for the studs.  The four bolts that would go through the Disco LT77 bell housing, the flywheel housing and ladder frame had no corresponding holes in the Series bell housing, so I countersunk the flywheel housing holes to take four cap head bolts that would fit under the bell housing flange.  All neat and strong (most people just omit those four bolts), and I understand much the same effect as the Defender arrangement, but this presented the same problem - the box and engine would need to be separated a long way to get the bolts out for ladder removal.  So I drilled holes matching the cap bolt heads diameter through the flange of the bell housing in line with each bolt so the cap head bolt can pass through the flange without removing the box.  It may be possible to do the same for the Defender LT77 bell housing.

[Snagger]

Just now, Snagger said:

I don't have any photos and the car is about 3500 miles from me, so I can't rush out to it, but ill try to explain more clearly.

I fit the 200Tdi in a Series 109.  The majority of studs lines up with the bell housing, two holes in the Disco flywheel housing needed drilling and tapping for the studs.  The four bolts that would go through the Disco LT77 bell housing, the flywheel housing and ladder frame had no corresponding holes in the Series bell housing, so I countersunk the flywheel housing holes to take four cap head bolts that would fit under the bell housing flange.  All neat and strong (most people just omit those four bolts), and I understand much the same effect as the Defender arrangement, but this presented the same problem - the box and engine would need to be separated a long way to get the bolts out for ladder removal.  So I drilled holes matching the cap bolt heads diameter through the flange of the bell housing in line with each bolt so the cap head bolt can pass through the flange without removing the box.  It may be possible to do the same for the Defender LT77 bell housing.  The drilling wasn't as neat as I'd like to admit because it was done with the engine and box fitted, and was done in order to remove the latter and pistons.  It was done with a normal pistol drill and HSS bits, and then they were expanded to clear the cap head bolts with a Dremmel.  I'll tidy them up when the box is removed, but they're not too bad.  But they work.