Barna Posted October 27, 2009 Share Posted October 27, 2009 Hi, I like to ask some help about that I can't find the spider unit under the dash on 1998 300tdi non EDC with EGR Discovery manual with 3 wires from fuel pump. Sometimes (every one or two week) the car is not starts and the red symbol visible. Battery replaced in the key fob, but not solved the problem. I ordered bypass for immobilizer, but not find the unit. With my 96 discovery I had no problem to bypass it. Can you please give some ideas where can be the spider, or how can bypass it? Thanks, Barna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cipx2 Posted October 27, 2009 Share Posted October 27, 2009 There isn't a spider on your Discovery. The late 300tdis non EDC with EGR have a DDS (Digital Diesel fuel Shut-off immob) device on the injection pump (the 3 wires you were mentioning lead to it) - this is the 'spider' equivalent. There can't be two devices doing the same thing one after the other, i.e a DDS and the spider. So, if you have a DDS then there's no spider and vice versa. On the other hand the red blinking key warning light in the dashboard is activated by the alarm control unit. I don't know if you read the thread in the tech archive http://forums.lr4x4.com/index.php?showtopic=86 - see Diagnosis, 2nd phrase. Or, in other words, the warning light in the dash has nothing to do with the spider or the DDS, both these devices are slave units, they don't provide feedback signals to ECUs etc, they simply enable/energize the starter and the shut off solenoids upon receiving the correct signal from the alarm control unit. So even if these devices are broke or even missing, they can't be the cause for the red warning light to come on. In your case there must be something wrong with one of these: alarm unit, dodgy wires/connectors, exciter ring around the ignition switch or the transponder in the keyfob (which doesn't require a battery to work so don't worry about that) By the way way, have you tested both fobs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barna Posted October 27, 2009 Author Share Posted October 27, 2009 Thanks the quick response. I tested both key fobs with the same result The symptom when not start: Red warning light is active on dashboard. When I try to crank the radio goes off, starter not do anything. If I remove the key from the switch, close and open the door with key fob, after starter cranking. Car will start. The problem is depends that the car is “cold” or “warm”. Starting problem more times happens with warm engine. Still not tested the starter solenoid, but it should be ok. Both key fobs do the same result. How can I test the exciter ring and alarm unit, or is it possible to replace it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cipx2 Posted October 27, 2009 Share Posted October 27, 2009 The radio (as well as all the accesories) is supposed to turn off so that's normal. Don't worry about the starter solenoid or the DDS as they're not supposed to work if the vehicle it's still immobilized. The only way to test the alarm unit is with a Testbook (but it might work ok when tested - you say the fault is intermittent) at a LR dealer or to replace it with another one (mind that it need to come with the fobs as well or you'll have to go to a LR dealer to syncronize your old fobs to the new alarm unit). The exciter ring is a coil so a continuity test is all you can do. Next time the error occurs try these methods: - when the red warning light comes on press Unlock button (with the key in the ignition) - while keeping the key on the Starter position press the Lock button and see if engine starts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barna Posted October 27, 2009 Author Share Posted October 27, 2009 Dear Cipx2. I tested the method that you mentioned. Red warning light up When I’m keeping the key on the crank position and press the lock button, that engine start immediately. What does this mean? Barna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cipx2 Posted October 27, 2009 Share Posted October 27, 2009 It means the reason the system remains immobilized is the fact that the alarm unit (AU) doesn't receive the information from the transponder in the fob. The possible causes are about the same: - faulty AU - faulty exciter ring (this is like an antenna, if you like) - faulty/rusty wiring/connectors to/from the exciter ring Let's exclude the fobs for the moment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barna Posted October 28, 2009 Author Share Posted October 28, 2009 Thanks Cipx2. This is a huge help for me! I’ll start to check first the connectors and the “antenna” Barna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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