Jocklandjohn

March 26

Spoke too soon!

Very bright sun in the middle of the day and the voltage went up to 15v. I think I'll need to reconnect the spare battery again and let it fry for a few hours and watch what happens. At least that will bypass the vehicle systems and allow me to figure out if its controller issue or a van electric gremlin.

Sigh....

March 25

1 hour ago, Peaklander said:

Great to hear of your problem solving and feedback about the effect of dodgy connections!

P.S. please explain more about this thing called "full sun"?

Right sit down, because this might be a long explanation. Basically every so often pagans (usually in Wales) do some weird thing or other involving 'stuff' and this sends a ripple of cosmic-ness up in to the..er...cosmos and this then stimulates a chain reaction of things, first ice-cream deliveries fail, then people in the north of England open their curtains in anticipation, the Scots actually get out of bed, and then if we're all lucky you'll notice sparkly bits outside as the rain is briefly 'sparklyfied' and then it all gets a bit dim again. If you've not experienced it yet you're in for a treat.

March 25

Update: Over this past weekend I disconnected the relay from the Auxiliary battery so no linking function but the voltage stayed at 14.8v and later in the day the Steca data logger issued an alert message and recorded a 14.9v in brighter sun.

So I thought I’d experiment.

I have a spare starter battery which is exactly the same brand/capacity as the installed one in the vehicle. I completely disconnected everything from the Steca controller, the load circuits, and both batteries, but kept the solar input connected. Then using fused 6mm wire I connected the spare battery to the controller and watched the voltage in real time, measuring with my meter. It stayed at 14.45 rising to 14.5V in bright sun. I watched over a hour or so and voltage stayed steady not going above 14.5v.

This seems to confirm the controller is working ok.

Then I reconnected the vehicle starter battery to the Steca and I was metering 15.5V at the battery, also metering same at the controller and this reading was logged/confirmed by the Steca data logger as an over-voltage, as well being flagged as an error on my separate system monitor.

This indicated a wiring issue on the vehicle side. So I completely disconnected the Steca, took it out of the vehicle and used some contact cleaner on the terminals and cable ends and then reinstalled and reconnected all the wiring. I’m always wary of over-tightening terminals in case I strip threads, but this time I tightened all the connections very tight.

In full sun, readings at all points was 14.4v rising to 14.5v. All the various readouts at battery, Steca logger, separate monitor showed exactly the same voltage. I then reconnected the auxiliary battery via the split charge setup and it rose to 14.5v from its resting (disconnected) 13.8v and the whole system continued charging at 14.5v max. until the sun disappeared.

This morning I started the van and ran it and voltage so far is staying steady at 14.5V.

So…preliminary conclusion - it looks like it might have been a dodgy terminal connection on the solar controller. I'll see what happens one the next few days running about and in sunshine.

Thanks all for your guidance and assistance!

March 22

All the cables from controller to battery are 5 or 6mm as well. I was careful in the choice to ensure it was up to appropriate spec for functionality as well as safety.

I've got a few pointers from the solar tech lad who's advising from the vendor so I need to watch it for a day or so and see what additional messages get flagged when its going into over-voltage. Not had repeated 15.5V since I adjusted the charge ratio, but the occasional wanders into apparent 14.8V territory still strikes me as not normal. The numerous 'Deep Discharge Protection' alerts its logged strikes me as being really odd too and suggests something is malfunctioning.

March 21

Well the wiring was all as recommended - 6mm solar cable and appropriate connectors.

Might the run length be a factor?

Because I have the lifting roof and the panel is at the rear end above the back door, the cable needs to run the full length of the roof (it enters at the back above the rear door) and runs all the way to the front above the windscreen and comes back to just behind the drivers seat where the controller is. so just under 4m from panel to controller. All the other wiring is either to appropriate specs or slightly over.

March 21

5 hours ago, FridgeFreezer said:

Either that's a naughty controller or something else thinks it should be generating 15.5v - if it was doing this when the only power source was solar I'd suggest there's something wrong with the controller, either for real or in its measurement section.

With the technicians help I've got into the Event Log and have found a series of 15.5V highs the device recorded (but has not warned about) and one logged high voltage of 14.85 which it HAS warned about.

Curiously there's a string of logged warnings of under voltage and 'Deep Discharge Protection Active'. What thats all about is anyone's guess as this is two new batteries, fully charged and showing fully charged as per alternator output and readings taken at the batteries.

Tech guys are getting perplexed and suggested disconnecting everything and only connection the batteries to see if something else connected is doing odd stuff. They do note that the pulse bit of the PWM function might hit 14.9-15.5V if its compensating for cold, but that....

"Otherwise, we’ve seen it with PWM controllers that the pulses are very close together pushing battery voltage up – it’s not actually representing overcharging as such because it’s just the pulses – he can try changing frequency see if that helps."

March 21

13 hours ago, simonr said:

Something worth mentioning here is your Volt Meter (Multimeter).

The accuracy of a mid-range meter can easily be +/-1.5%. Cheap ones, even worse.
Even a high-end meter will only be +/-0.3V DC Volts just after it's been calibrated. I would never rely on it to be better than +/-1%.

A mid-range meter showing 14.5V could actually be anything from 14.3V to 14.7V. (On a high end meter, 14.35V to 14.65V)

Thus I shouldn't worry too much about such small apparent voltage differences.

Good point.

There's three separate LCD voltage displays in the van, addition to me occasionally using my handheld meter and all of them show identical readings. One is the dedicated Steca Solar data logger/control and it not only gives a real time read out but stores High/Low recordings for the previous 30 days so I can see the peaks/troughs over time and in fact have been able to relate the highs to the recent very clear sunny days we've had. This includes several days where it was logging 15.5V highs which was what had me alarmed. I can also see the days when I've disconnected the solar input and the voltages stay in the 14.3 - 14.5V range.

I'm in contact with the really helpful supplier tech representative/engineer and he's talking me through various possible solutions.

March 20

18 hours ago, hurbie said:

no to sure what battery's youre running , but 14.8 seems to be pretty high for a lead acid battery , most you read is 14.4 to max 14.7

but maybee you have different battery's and i'm talking nonsens 😉

Apparently with AGM batteries this is ok as they require a different charging profile and up to 15V can be seen during charging. I dont have AGM and the solar controller is not set to AGM type batteries - I checked that.

17 hours ago, FridgeFreezer said:

I thought the same, I still think the "smart" parts are not being as smart as they claim to be or are getting confused / fighting each other. Setting it to 50/50 may be masking the problem not solving it.

You might be correct. Its sunny today and the hand held voltmeter is showing 19+V coming into the charge controller off the panel and the charging V to each battery sitting at 14.75.

There might be less 'smart' going on here than I thought. I did change the battery priority to suit the existing IBS unit so they shouldn't 'fight' each other, but thats no guarantee they want to play nice!

I'm giving the tech rep I spoke with an update in a few days so will see what he's got to say.

March 19

UPDATE

Disconnected and reconnected the panel and solar controller, checked all the settings for 'battery type' & 'charging profiles' & 'cut off voltages' etc are correct (they were), then changed the charge ratio from 90/10 to 50/50 (unit can control two batteries, default was 90/10) and I'm not getting any more >15V readings. (The data logger in the system picked up a series of 15.5V highs across the last few weeks.)

I am getting no more than 14.8V highs now and I spoke with the Steca supplier tech rep a few days ago (very helpful folk) and they advised a unit self-test which I did and the units are functioning correctly and in-spec. They think that the 15.5V highs may have been an anomaly possibly due to the LR battery box being exposed to the cold (it was very cold at ground level but with warm sun on the roof/solar panel) and the batteries low temp was having some effect on the charge profiles and that this may have triggered the highs. They did say these would have been transient highs and not necessarily continuous, and suspect that the change of the charge ratio to 50/50 has alleviated it.

They suggested monitoring it for a spell to see what occurs especially if the temp drops again, but certainly the last few days have not revealed any unusual highs sufficient to trigger any over-voltage warnings.

SO it *might* be resolved.

Its been hovering at

March 10

6 hours ago, FridgeFreezer said:

I'm slightly curious about your overall setup - it sounds like you've got other controllers (IBS?) in the system as well as a fair few extras wired in, more complexity equals more chances for weird interactions to happen.

Most likely IMHO is either a controller that's forgotten what battery type is fitted as Hurbie says, a fault in the solar controller so it's not actually shutting off the panel, or some weirdness in the wiring / interaction with another device in the system.

Yes an IBS doing starter battery priority, with excess to aux when starter is charged. And the solar setup doing the reverse, priority to aux, delivering 90% of available solar input, and 10% to starter battery.

Both vendors were asked about the ways these would interact and if there would be issues, both said no they should be ok, self managing and voltage limiting if excess detected. However as you suggest there may be either a mismatch of some sort or an actual malfunction.

6 hours ago, hurbie said:

a decent sollar controler can be set to different type's batterys, for example a lithium battery needs a higher voltage then a lead acid one . so might be that your problem is there .

Yes I checked that in the initial setup and its set to lead acid. But I will go back into the menus and check its all ok. Its entirely possible its reset some functions when I discnnnected it all to renew the battteries/alternator last year.

There may also be a distinct set up sequence required eg attach X, then Y, etc so I'll give it a good look over.

March 10

Just had a thought - I think I will try switching the Steca battery termnals and allow the solar to prioritise the starter rather than auxiliary battery - the net result should still be the same - the starter gets prioritised (as per alternaotor-side system), and the surplus goes to the auxiliary and the overall energy management/storage will remain the same. This might remove an unforeseen electronic 'hurdle' that may be causing issues. Will report back!

March 10

16 hours ago, FridgeFreezer said:

Show us a pic of your solar controller and ideally the wiring - otherwise we're just guessing.

Any even vaguely decent solar controller should be protecting against reverse voltages and cutting off the charge at a set voltage.

Here you go. Wired in accordance with instructions, using appropriate gauge wire. All run in protective plastic tubing to batteries.

As indicated on the device left to right -

Battery 2 is starter

Panel is solar (wire with tape on it is disconnected earth)

Battey 1 is Auxiliary/leisure battery

Last one is Load (conencted to a fridge, Wiring to fridge is switched and fused, switch is currently off)

LED's are currently:

Green indicating all is functioning as it should, the two batteries I've just metered when I took picture show 12.7V (at rest overnight) Panel LED is unlit because disconnected, Load LED is Green becasue its indicating sufficient charge to run a load if needed.

Steca's vendor advised choice of whether Battery 1 is starter or leisure is dependent on how I want it set up, however if only connecting one battery to the system it MUST be connected on terminal 1 Main. Because I have a separate manager on the alternator system, an IBS I fitted 25 years ago, which is prioritising the starter battery this combination should mean each battery is maintained and managed appropriately. All the led light combos designed to fault-find show no issues and that all is running as it should

Vendors of both systems were consulted and both said there was no issues with me connecting a system in this way.

I metered the panel output when I took the photo, 8.40AM overcast and weak sunlight and it was delivering 3.6V so its working ok.

March 9

Excellent! Compact and bijou as they used to say! I flipped it for you to save others turning their monitors upsde down!

March 9

23 minutes ago, stevebus said:

Hello fella, I actually live off grid got solar and wind running different parts of my plot, I had the same problem and naturally thought its going to be the charge controller, after doing a bit of research it turned out, in my case anyway that I needed to fit one directional diodes in the live to stop it power returning to the panels, apparently, and I'm only spouting off what someone told me, if the power end up tracking back it will give you allsorts of readings, I've sent some photos of what they are with the number on it but it's so small I had to take two, hopefully you can work it out from the pictures, I think you buy 10 for pennies,

Thanks Steve that a useful observtion too. I went into the 110's solar setup with a fair degree of interest becasue I wanted to explore the possibilities of doing what you're doing at some point and be off grid, and as I use the van for working out of anyway, it made sense from that point of view as well, as that has given me real world experience of being away from mains power.

I have an alternator-side management setup, which prioritises starter battery & when its fully charged switches to send surplus to the auxiliary battery. And on the solar side the charge controller is prioritising the auxiliary battery and sending a trickle charge to the starter battery.

Vendors of both systems said there would be no issues with them operating in this manner. The solar charge controller has four sets of terminals: two separate battery-out circuits for main & aux batteries, one circuit for solar-in, and one for a load which has a low-draw compressor fridge on. The overvoltage state was apparent on each battery so that suggests the charge controller was responsible for causing it.

I think I need to experiment with my voltmeter and figure out what readings I'm getting and where, starting with the soalr panel leads and see what coming off that and take it from there. Certainly without the panel connected all is back to normal so that narrows it to the solar side I think.

Thanks for the input.

March 9

33 minutes ago, Bowie69 said:

Charge controller controls the voltage, so I would start there.

That said, some of these controllers have a higher voltage/frequency mode to help maintain the battery, often run just once a month, it could have been that?

Worth checking the manual, I would think.

I wondered about the charge controller, but the "higher voltage/frequency mode to help maintain the battery" point hadn't occurred to me. So thats a good shout.

All its other functions are spot on - the diagnostics and voltage tracking etc all seem perfectly normal.

Curiously the charge controller has an overvoltage warning via Red LED but that has not lit up at all. The overvoltage warning I oobserved was via a separate device, so bit peculiar the charge controller didn't pick it up....unlesss...its doing as you suggest. I shall dig deeper. First thing I'll do is disconnect and reconnect all the wiring I think.

An chance a dodgy MC4 solar connector could cause this?

March 9

I've noticed since the weather got sunny in the last few weeks I've been getting an overvoltage warning on a battery system monitor. This has been flashing when I go to use the van after its been parked up outside the house so obviously not occurring when driving.

The vehicle alternator was replaced with a new one last autumn, also two new batteries installed, one starter one leisure, so I'm pretty sure none of them are at fault as its all been working fine over the winter, starting and charging as expected. And the solar panel was replaced last autumn because the previous one died completely (after many years of solid and reliable use).

When driving, the various LCD monitors have always showed the alternator output being within normal charge range.

However today the voltage went up when driving, to 15.5V. I switched on heater blower and lights to add a load and got the overvoltage warning to go off and the indicated voltage in the system came down and showed 14.5V

So having recalled this was only recently happening and seemed to be when NOT driving I assumed it could be the solar panel. So I disconnected the solar input cable from the charge controller and immediately voltage dropped to normal. I left the vehicle for a while, watched voltage drop and stabilise - all as expected 12.75V on both batteries. Started vehicle and measured voltage at alternator 14.4V or thereabouts and similar at both battery’s terminals.

Took a drive about - all as expected, no overcharge warnings and indicated voltage normal.

Reconnected the solar input to the charge controller and voltage immediately went over 15v and up to 15.5v eventually, so disconnected it again and it all returned to normal.

Any suggestions as to what might be going on and where I should start looking for a cause? Panel? Charge controller? Wiring?

March 9

14 hours ago, obtama95 said:

Wow!!! This is incredible!! Yes I would love to dive down this rabbit hole if it is cheaper than an alu-cab 😂 I have time, tools and resources to do something like this for sure

Well the build thread is on here in the link above so worth reading that first. But there is a longer thread and far more images in the US site Expedition Portal where I posted stuff after each day of working ion the 110 - you dont need to pay to access simply register and you're good to go.

March 8

This one is mine - if you want to dive down that particular rabbit hole I'm happy to offer advice and aspirin!

apr20jmp35646.jpg.62d054b804a9c98d406ea31e6edfb59b.jpg

December 24, 2023

10 hours ago, miketomcat said:

Not sure it classifies as really cool but it's interesting. I've got a five seat car and a four bed trailer, that is a three seat car (at most) with a trailer to accommodate about thirty. It would be interesting to see the layout inside but I don't see how it wins over a normal caravan.

Mike

I think you missed my slightly sardonic intentions! Up close it looked even less impressive. I'm not sure what the fabricator was using as a fixed point for reference when measuring but there are several squinty bits. When I get home I'll post the pic of the bright pink Disco towing a bright pink half-Disco sleeping compartment which was a tad ott.

December 24, 2023

On 10/30/2023 at 8:24 PM, landroversforever said:

No where near that much, but my parents are swapping to a sensible sized motorhome (4 berth, 6m long I think) and its crazy how expensive they get, and very quickly at that!!

I can see how a couple would end up with some kind of monster motorhome with a trailer/car in tow. I got chatting to a guy a few years back at a caravan club site with a monster US RV and it's their home. They live full time after downsizing their house and renting it out (so a future safety net in case of il-health).

On 10/30/2023 at 5:16 PM, Peaklander said:

I won't derail anymore but at one site I thought I would Google a model there which was a Flair by Niesmann-Bischoff. Unbelievable pricing, depending on options, of £250-300K.

On 10/30/2023 at 10:16 AM, FridgeFreezer said:

We found that in Alaska, our rented F350 camper was usually the smallest thing on site. One site we camped behind a Canadian chap with a Volvo estate and a small Eriba bathtub caravan, we were having a very similar conversation and he said "talk about conspicuous consumption, eh?" - there were motorhomes there that brought along their own patch of artificial grass & plastic picket fence to define their own (not so) little fake garden in front of their behemoth. Usually just a retired couple in the thing.

This sort of nonsense was far too common:

They usually have ridiculous features like granite worktops and of course at least one absolutely huge TV and of course a built-in generator to annoy everyone else with.

If you want a really cool motorhome/detachable fifth wheel travelling vehicle look no further.... (Spotted in the highlands a few years ago.). 🙂

December 21, 2023

If not oily smoke any possibiltiy of a leak in the heater matrix firing hissy steamy smelly guff into the cab? Or have we ruled that one out? Frightened the pants of me when it suddenly happened as I was belting along and turned the cab into a passable imiatation of a sauna (without the nudity!). It would drip down underneath and hiss on contact with the hot bits.

December 17, 2023

On 12/16/2023 at 12:38 PM, Bowie69 said:

To be honest, if your heavy and are mostly doing those speeds, depending on tyre size then you may find it much more enjoyable to drive with a 1.4.

I know what you mean. I had a 1.4 previously and it certainly gives lots of low down flexibility, but thought I'd try the 1.2 when I had the 200tdi overhauled. With the 1.2 5th is pretty much an overdrive, which I can use when I get on the other side of 50mph and it certainly eases back the revs. I'm on 235/85/16 so not anything overly sized. I'm not a regualr m.way/dual carriageway user but when I've had jobs in the south and had to go beyond Perth/Glasgow its come in handy having that taller gear. I guess the ideal is a 1.4 and overdrive!

December 16, 2023

On 12/12/2023 at 10:00 AM, reb78 said:

I don't know if this helps, but its almost as if there is incomplete combustion until you get going? I say this as I can get something like your signs if I am running on SVO and I mess around for too long with the engine idling when cold. I try not to do it but on the odd occasion where I do (hitching up a trailer or something), when I do then go to pull away, I create a smokescreen like battleships used in WW2 to mask their exact positions from enemy ships, and then when that clears it runs absolutely fine. I imagine this is burning off unburnt fuel. Its bad for the engine so I avoid situations where it happens when on SVO and try to just start and go (initial run if from home is straight up a 1 i n6 road for a mile so its warm by the top) but occasionally its not possible to start and head straight off.

Yes there's a bigh pooof of black smoke whih is obviously unburnt fuel, sluggish beforehand then after 'clearing its throat' its running pretty splendidly. I'm part way through a tank of Forte diesel/cleaner/additive/injector/fuel line degunger so I'll see what effect that has at cleaning things up.

On 12/12/2023 at 9:56 AM, reb78 said:

I am sure I spoke to Pete Bell years ago and he pretty much said not to bother. It was mostly around the fact that I wanted more top end. I have what I want at the bottom end which is where the VNT is most effective. Trade off with more top end is that you would need a bigger turbo and if it is not VNT I think that would have an effect at the bottom of the rev range. So I think what we need for both is a bigger VNT turbo that is properly controlled...

I remember quite a bit of discussion about all of this VNT stuff years ago on here. My need was for low speed oomph rather than top end, as the van is pretty heavy as is and even more so with full load of fuel and water, partner, dog and assorted tat, and occasionally bicycles hung off the towhitch carrier, and couple woith the 1:2 gearing. Not doing a huge amount of motorway use, so its usually either plodding up and down on Highland single-track roads at 30-40mph or up and down on A roads in the 45-55mph range, which seems to suit the set up. I think I'll experiment with preheater warmup starts and engine idling warmup starts and see if theres a significant difference.

What I can say is that after solving the desperately poor running due to the dodgy intake pipe its running and pulling better than it has in years. So any other improvements are the cream on top of the icing on the top of cake!

December 10, 2023

Has there been any resolution to this?

December 8, 2023

3 hours ago, Snagger said:

The top of that dash trunking is held in by perimeter self-tapping screws, all hidden under the black plastic tray (you can see the holes in the photo). To get that tray out, you need to remove the plastic trim that hides the dash vent. With the older models, that grey panel can be removed with the top fascia in place but is considerably easier with it removed. I don’t know about the 2002+ models with black panel, but I imagine that comes out the same way - the rest of it is the same.

You can see in John’s photo the torque rod running about mid-height of the bottom slope, the two flaps below it and the two spring steel clips between the rod and a lip near the bottom of the vertical face of the duct. The strips keep the rod seated in the clasps which act as hinges and locators for the rotating assembly. The vent flaps should have foam seals on the bottom face, invisible in the photo, that gets squashed a little when demist is selected as per the position in the photo. A 2-3mm pad of neoprene makes a very good replacement, but it needs to be a bit bigger than the hole it is sealing and needs to overlap from the flaps themselves by about 5mm in all directions but the rod side to give a good seal for optimum demisting.

The heater matrix has the matrix mounted across only a part of the void at an incline. The matrix is set to one side with a vertically hinged diverter flap adjacent that allows fan air to bypass the matrix when cold is selected and blocks the bypass to force the fan air through the matrix when hot is selected. If you slacken the grub screws on the heat Bowden cable connections, select full hot on the lever and then manually turn the flap to the full hot position by twisting the rope end of the pivot rod where it pokes through the top of the housing, you can then set the cable to ensure the flap gives maximum blocking of the cold bypass and maximum output temperature.

Grand explanation, thank you. I have had the heater out and it was pretty easily understood, but the arcane interaction of cables and flaps is something you definitely instructions to follow to get right!

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