RR bmw 2.5d, 96, no fuel, BCM ? ECU ? Imobiliser?

[blackswan555]

Hi all and thanks in advance for your thoughts,

I have inherited a 3rd hand range rover fault, 96, BMW diesel powered, The car originally went in for a new battery, The installing mechanic should not have been trusted to put a battery in a torch, The inevitable immobilizer problems happened, So they decided to hot wire it, with a resulting quantity of smoke from behind the radio area of the dash (I have not investigated the damage there yet and am hopeful it is only radio wiring damage, I was not there at the time)

The fault,

key / immobilizer seems to work fine, opens and shuts doors, dash does not show disabled and engine cranks but will not start ( if you do "a bad entry" does disable start and show it)

No power to fuel pump @ fuel cut sol,

My first suspicion is immobilizer, on reading a fair few other posts on here, the door lock micro-switch seems to play up, I have put the EKA in and it seems to work, but from my reading you should get a confirmation side repeater flash when you turn the key BOTH ways, Talking to the so called RR specialist on the Island (Ibiza) he was adamant that it was only on the lock position you get a flash, if the switch was faulty , wouldn't it also cut cranking ?

Thanks in advance

Have a good one

Tim

PS the only guy on the Island with the correct RR fault reading equipment refuses to plug it in due to hearing about smoke behind the dash, I have old OBD reading kit somewhere, (inc k) any use digging it out ? If I do not fix it, It is scrap, oops

[David Sparkes]

Can't guarantee to get it working, but just to nibble at the periphery....

key / immobilizer seems to work fine, opens and shuts doors, dash does not show disabled and engine cranks but will not start ( if you do "a bad entry" does disable start and show it)

All that is positive news.

I do quibble about the word 'immobilizer'. What you have passed through with the key fob is the vehicle security, contained within the BECM.

At this point I don't think you have got past the BECM to engine ECU handshake, necessary to start the engine.

on reading a fair few other posts on here, the door lock micro-switch seems to play up, I have put the EKA in and it seems to work,

Good to read you have done some research, but the quote I've extracted contradicts itself. If the EKA reliably gets you in then the door microswitch is OK. When considering 'reliably' note there is plenty of scope for a manual error. In the previous quote you use the phrase "a bad entry", does this mean a bad EKA entry, or perhaps locking the vehicle with the window down, then reaching in and opening the door from the inside? (IE simulating a broken window).

but from my reading you should get a confirmation side repeater flash when you turn the key BOTH ways

This isn't my understanding, IF, by 'side repeater flash', you mean the lights fitted in the outside of the wings.

What should flash, when the key returns to the vertical after each single clockwise or anticlockwise turn of the key, is the small internal flash indicator - the green double headed arrow between the main dials in the instrument console. To see this you may have to wind the window down, close and lock the door (the volumetric detector will not set itself), then view the indicator light through the open window. Due to the viewing angle you have to adopt to see the indicator from outside it is quite dim. Having the window open removes any degrading due to the (possibly tinted) glass.

you should get a confirmation side repeater flash when you turn the key BOTH ways, Talking to the so called RR specialist on the Island (Ibiza) he was adamant that it was only on the lock position you get a flash,

I've covered the possible confusion about which light flashes, so ignoring that, you are possibly both correct.

It doesn't matter which way you turn the key, to lock or unlock, the light will flash, but ONLY when the key is returned to the normal position.

PS the only guy on the Island with the correct RR fault reading equipment refuses to plug it in due to hearing about smoke behind the dash,

Understandable.

I have old OBD reading kit somewhere, (inc k) any use digging it out ?

I don't understand (inc k), but in any case you would be wasting your time.

After all that 'nibbling', the bottom line is that I think you have lost synchronisation between the BECM and the Engine ECU. I'm not certain, but with the Diesel I think you have to manually read the code from the Engine ECU and re-input it into the BECM. (With one of the Petrol engine systems I think there is a relearn button, but I can't recall which engine system uses which (Gems Petrol, Bosch Motronic Petrol, Bosch Diesel EDC).

Without access to a Blackbox, Autologic, or Testbook / IDC system, I can only suggest you do some more internet research around Security Codes BMW 38A Diesel. That isn't an exclusive list of search terms.

There may be some people who claim that they have forced a relearn by disconnecting the battery and waiting, or by reconnecting the battery while the ignition switch is in a certain position. (leave the door open when doing this sort of thing, to guard against the vehicle locking you out, with the key inside the car).

There are others on here with more frequent dealings with these machines, and can be more certain than I am about the official method of doing a Security re-learn on the Diesel EDC. (AllyV8, possibly 'CallRova' (Google that, it's an approximation of a Trading Name).

You might be able to remove the BECM and Engine EDC and send them away for re-synchronisation.

HTH, and good luck. If you make the car work do you get to keep it?

[Ally V8]

The BECM is mobilised,what has happened is the security link between the engine ecu and the BECM is lost.It needs a quick re-sycnh on Testbook - 2 mins work.I have to go out to a DSE tomorrow morning with what sounds like exactly the same issue.Blackbox communications do a tool to do just this job,not sure of cost etc.

I recently did the resynch job for a P38 based in Cuba,the owner brought the BECM,engine ecu,instrument pack and keys to the UK so I could fit them in a car,set them up and test,change the language to UK etc.Bit of a pain for the owner,but it now runs......

[blackswan555]

Thanks for your help !! the sync loss is along the lines that I was thinking, Any suggestions of if/who/what I could send it off to for sorting ? and approx cost?

David, Sadly I do not get to keep it, the Garage that "broke it" are saying it is nothing to do with them, The owner is a friend of a friend who also does not think it is his responsibility (which I agree with) So I will be hanging onto the keys until I am paid, But I can see it is not going to be fun, Should have kept my mouth shut lol

Thanks in advance

Tim

timharris2006ATgmail.com swap the AT

PS if any of you need help with solar/alternative energy, I post under the same name on http://www.outbackpower.com/forum/?page_id=forum

[blackswan555]

Can't guarantee to get it working, but just to nibble at the periphery....

All that is positive news.

I do quibble about the word 'immobilizer'. What you have passed through with the key fob is the vehicle security, contained within the BECM.

At this point I don't think you have got past the BECM to engine ECU handshake, necessary to start the engine.

Thats what I was thinking, basically a 2 stage cut,

Good to read you have done some research, but the quote I've extracted contradicts itself. If the EKA reliably gets you in then the door microswitch is OK. When considering 'reliably' note there is plenty of scope for a manual error. In the previous quote you use the phrase "a bad entry", does this mean a bad EKA entry, or perhaps locking the vehicle with the window down, then reaching in and opening the door from the inside? (IE simulating a broken window).

Yep deliberately "doing it wrong" then clearing it

This isn't my understanding, IF, by 'side repeater flash', you mean the lights fitted in the outside of the wings.

What should flash, when the key returns to the vertical after each single clockwise or anticlockwise turn of the key, is the small internal flash indicator - the green double headed arrow between the main dials in the instrument console. To see this you may have to wind the window down, close and lock the door (the volumetric detector will not set itself), then view the indicator light through the open window. Due to the viewing angle you have to adopt to see the indicator from outside it is quite dim. Having the window open removes any degrading due to the (possibly tinted) glass.

Thanks, hadn`t seen that

I've covered the possible confusion about which light flashes, so ignoring that, you are possibly both correct.

It doesn't matter which way you turn the key, to lock or unlock, the light will flash, but ONLY when the key is returned to the normal position.

Understandable.

I don't understand (inc k), but in any case you would be wasting your time.

After all that 'nibbling', the bottom line is that I think you have lost synchronisation between the BECM and the Engine ECU. I'm not certain, but with the Diesel I think you have to manually read the code from the Engine ECU and re-input it into the BECM. (With one of the Petrol engine systems I think there is a relearn button, but I can't recall which engine system uses which (Gems Petrol, Bosch Motronic Petrol, Bosch Diesel EDC).

Without access to a Blackbox, Autologic, or Testbook / IDC system, I can only suggest you do some more internet research around Security Codes BMW 38A Diesel. That isn't an exclusive list of search terms.

There may be some people who claim that they have forced a relearn by disconnecting the battery and waiting, or by reconnecting the battery while the ignition switch is in a certain position. (leave the door open when doing this sort of thing, to guard against the vehicle locking you out, with the key inside the car).

There are others on here with more frequent dealings with these machines, and can be more certain than I am about the official method of doing a Security re-learn on the Diesel EDC. (AllyV8, possibly 'CallRova' (Google that, it's an approximation of a Trading Name).

You might be able to remove the BECM and Engine EDC and send them away for re-synchronisation.

HTH, and good luck. If you make the car work do you get to keep it?

Thanks for your time & input, Probably a silly question , But what would I need to be able to do it my-self, I have laptops, OBD, K line, and Canbus connectors,(I was an auto-electrician for many years, escaped about 8 ago) not as simple as getting a program I suppose ? (I saw testbook T4 software for sale & a testbook without leads, both no use lol ?

Have a good one

Tim