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mturri

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  1. mturri

    Td5 ECU questions

    Eric, Re monitoring fuel pressure see this thread http://forums.lr4x4....showtopic=62675 (just don't pay much attention to the 'findings' section) Cylinder balance readings only make sense when engine running in steady state (i.e. no transient), that is when idling or running totally floored on straight flat road no wind gusts etc. As for the programmer any model capable of handling the 29F200 EPROM (inc PSOP 44 adapter) shall suffice. Don't recall you saying your FPR leaks but if so it could certainly be causing the power loss. Rgds Matt
  2. mturri

    Td5 cfm

    Max MAF values are around 600 kg/hr, dividing that by air density (e.g. 1.2 kg/m3 at sea level & 20°C) equates roughly to 500 m3/hr = 300 cfm IME the driving factor when choosing a pre filter is not cfm rating but pressure drop at high flow rates (too high and turbo will starve). Have used a Mann Europiclon 500 air cleaner with much success.
  3. mturri

    Td5 ECU questions

    Eric, Not exactly sure of the differences between D90 and D110 fuel/config tunes but they are AFAIK fully interchangeable and should not be the cause of your troubles. I've used both Nanocom Mk1 and Evo to reflash NNN ECUs but admit not without a backup ECU at hand. Make sure your Nanocom is up to date in the upgrade department (the latest upgrade was released last week) and run it in standalone mode (no laptop to hang up or USB cable to accidentally disconnect). If statistics should count, have personally never bricked an ECU in about 4 years of playing around with maps. If for any reason the remapping goes wrong, you'd need to desolder the EPROM to have it reprogrammed or replaced (soldering a socket instead of the EPROM makes lots of sense). To program the EPROM will need the likes of a Willem unit and a 'Virgin' config/tune file. Re the jerky/rough running it could be due to a number of things (or combination of): oil in loom, dirty/faulty IAT/MAP/MAF sensor, dodgy fuel pressure regulator, dying fuel pump, dirty fuel pump... what's the engine mileage, what sort of fuel has it been run on (sulphur content) and what do the cylinder balance figures look like when at idle (or steady full throttle)? I assume the EGR has been blanked off and the exhaust manifold modified to take the extra heat... A remap (specially stage 2 and above) puts the engine under additional stress which means all components/systems/sensors have to be in top shape & any problems will manifest as well as aggravate sooner. Would gladly look at fueling recordings to try spot anything abnormal, just PM to exchange email addresses. Rgds Matt
  4. mturri

    TD5 won't start no matter what....

    Carlos, This is the stock Td5 fuel delivery system: If I'm reading you correctly you're using the original filter as an HP stage filter and going straight to the engine, then on exiting the FPR taking returns through the fuel cooler and back to the tank. If that's the case then the system has indeed lost its ability to self purge!! To try get the air out and the engine started, you could temporarily run the HP line straight to the engine, then route the return from the fuel cooler to the filter housing (just block the LP feed --blue line) so that diesel can go back to the tank the normal way (black line) and all that air gets purged out! (white line) Re your ECU it looks completely normal -- that's isolating varnish there. As said if it was working the day before no reason to believe it's failed. Re the system de-pressurising albeit nothing particularly wrong with it, it is due to --as pointed out by Dave W-- the absence of the non return valve which if installed sits where the LP feed enters the filter housing.
  5. mturri

    FPR Modified?

    Check your engine's serial no. as well is the vehicle's VIN against this information: Then you'd know which regulator & gasket to choose.
  6. mturri

    discovery 2 td5 auto wiring diagram

    Can PM diagrams, but what year and what diagram?
  7. Well a new battle has been won in the war against annoying noises in the Disco 2... Every time I use the heater for more than 15-20 minutes the blower motor (underneath the glove box) would start making a high pitch chirping sound, intermittent at first but irritatingly continuous in the end. Cross-forum research confirmed the blower motor as primary suspect, but no sure fix other than replacing it was stated. Here’s what was done (on LHD vehicle, RHD roughly the same but symmetrically opposed): 1- Remove glove box: unscrew (4) 7mm hex screws (2 per hinge). Recommend to mark position of screws on each hinge to facilitate alignment during reinstallation. 2- Remove bottom cover by pulling out 4 clips: Blower on sight: 3- Disconnect blue plug from blower motor (male plug comes free towards back side): 4- Blower motor is secured to blower assembly by (3) T27 torx screws located as shown: Remove the shown screws. Easier to start with the back one (toughest to reach) and leave front one as last, so that motor stays in place. 6- Carefully manoeuvre blower motor out – some tight cables to negotiate through but perfectly doable… Note how the blower motor “cools” itself by taking air from the front of the casing and ducting it to the back, this design causes potentially dusty air to be blown through the motor bearings. 7- Prepare to release the “air wheel” by taking the clip out and slightly prying off the plastic tip out of the axle’s groove. 8- Then hold the wheel and pull the motor out (I suspended the wheel and carefully hammered down the axle). Give the wheel a good clean (sink, water, liquid soap & brush…). Note the amount of cr@p behind the wheel coming from within the motor: 9- Release the blue plug and pull the rubber cover around the area where the cables enter the motor casing, undo the (2) T15 torx screws and free the motor: Pull the motor out of the casing: Motor details: 10- As seen the bearings are not serviceable. So what I did was: a- Cleaned the motor thoroughly with high pressure air b- Held the motor in vertical position, flooded the upper bearing with dry Teflon bicycle chain lube and let it stand for a few hours to allow it to gradually percolate (lube would not penetrate instantaneously), then turned upside down and did the opposite bearing c- Air blew rotor extensively as to remove any lube excess d- Reassembled motor & reinstalled in place (reverse work of what has been described). And apparently it worked since so far the bird hasn’t been back (fingers crossed)… Tools needed: ¼” or 3/8” ratchet, wobble or flex extension assortment, 7 mm drive socket, T27 torx drive, T15 torx drive, mirror, lighting, optional vacuum cleaner, etc.
  8. Here's a follow up on this post. Whilst experienced no more misfiring issues, soon enough lost the A/C and tracked it down to a lack of conductivity between the A/C compressor clutch and the red plug. Again had to cut cables off the engine harness and laid in a parallel loom. Two weeks later I happened to take the Nanocom for a ride and it came to my attention that fuel temperature remained still at 30°C... Shortly after the new engine harness arrived and proceeded to replace it. Needless to say, the fuel temperature issue was immediately solved. Had suspected the engine harness had become damaged by sitting over & rubbing against the ACE lines as marked by the red arrows: And seen from below: And was right... this is how the harness looked: After being cleaned out: Note the yellow cables are the injector conductors (no wonder the misfiring problems and shorting between injectors!) Cheers Matt
  9. Reckon the in car temp sensor is only used by the A/C system.
  10. A rather annoying but inconsequent issue that sooner or later comes up in Discos series 2 (either V8 or S5): on moving the starter switch to position "II" a vibrating sort of whirling noise comes from aside the steering column. The trouble lies with the in-car temperature sensor (ICTS) mounted behind the grills, comprised by a small blower which draws air over a thermistor. The blower is powered by a tiny brushless type electrical motor which has no bearings and tends to get clogged up with dust, hair, lint, etc. Here's how to work this problem out. 1- ICTS (behind grills) next to steering column of LHD Disco (RHD is perfectly symmetrical) 2- Access the main fuse box by removing the fixings and opening the cover underneath the steering column 3- Locate the ICTS assembly, unbend the loom retainer attached to the motor, pull the connector out and disconnect it 4- Undo the two screws holding the ICTS against the panel -- takes a bit of patience -- a small hex drive ratcheting wrench was perfect for this job: 5- The ICTS as it came out, and after being cleaned out: 6- Undo the two screws, beware of falling nuts as they are not captive, and open up the motor: 7- Thorougly clean the impellers shaft (both sides) as well as where it seats in within both the cover and stator: 8- Smear with a small quantity of light, thin, low friction grease. Do not over grease or use anything too sticky as the motor has very little force and it would prevent the impeller from rotating. I used the teflon grease that regularly apply to my mountain bikes bearings: 9- Reassemble blower motor, connect to loop and screw back in place. 10- Turn key to switch position II and enjoy the silence! Total time for this job: 30 mins Rgds Matt
  11. Couldn't say as not familiar with UK garage rates... But as said even if knowledgeable with this type of vehicle it could take a garage a good 24 man hrs to carry out this job. Obviously the more you drive it the faster it'll pay out. Personally after seeing the results couldn't care less about whether it ended being economical or not.
  12. My autobox Disco Td5 developed a slight shiver just before every gear change, between 2200-2800 rpm. Over the past 6 months the shudder gradually turned into a harsh vibration, eventually sounding like coarse gravel agitated in a tin can type of noise. ATF & filter checked and replaced regularly. No abnormal slipping or other autobox issues. No fault codes stored in EAT ECU. Historically Td5 torque converters fail by cracking at the base plate but upon a visual check through the opening in the bottom of the bell housing confirmed no visible cracks or missing bolts at the T/C which TBH was a bit discouraging… In addition to being a mechanical weak point, the Td5 T/C suffers from an excessively high stall speed (~2800 rpm) which is better suited for a petrol engine (Td5 engine torque peaks at around 2200 rpm). Many owners concur in that the Td5 autobox changes gears too late causing the engine to rev up unnecessarily (throwing gears well above 3000 rpm under medium to heavy acceleration), giving the feel of one being rather driving a 140HP outboard and not a modern diesel engine. A fellow autobox Td5 owner did in fact coin the term speedboat effect to best describe this phenomenon. So in order to hopefullyfix the vibration problems, get rid of the speedboat effect, and eliminate the known weakness between engine and transmission (thinking of future remap), opted to replace the torque converter for an uprated version from Ashcroft Transmissions. This is nothing but the T/C used for the 3.9 & 4.0 P38s but with a sturdier billet base plate modified to match the triangular 3-bolt flex plate on the Td5 as well as an altered spigot to fit the 4HP22 oil pump. With a lower stall speed (2200 rpm) it is meant to provide torque to the transmission a lot earlier than the factory standard T/C. Had done the Td5 clutch several times but the autobox was totally unknown territory. Went down to my mates place both for his helping hand and pit. Initially thought the job could be tackled in a day if started early enough but this soon proved impossible. Ended taking a total of 20 hrs over 2 days. Encountered numerous difficulties but the complexity lied in the number of details that had to be taken care off. Getting the autobox back in with the new T/C installed and partially filled with ATF was a complete b*tch and had to call for reinforcements at this point. Reckon the whole job would have taken 4-5 days in a regular garage. Upon reenergizing the vehicle all kinds of errors showed up, especially within the EAT ECU which did not like at all being disconnected from the autobox, and had to reset it various times before it started talking to the ECM. Filling the whole system with ATF took quite a while as there was air everywhere. The last task on the list was resetting the adaptative values in the EAT ECU. The EAT knows the nominal time that each gear shift should take. To counteract for wear in the autobox components as well as differences in the engine torque/power vs speed delivered, the EAT monitors the pressure modulation used for each gear change and applies a pressure adaptation so that shift duration is restored to the nominal value. These adaptative pressure values are stored in a volatile memory within the EAT ECU and in this scenario I thought it necessary to wipe them clean since an essential component of the auto transmission had just been replaced. Unfortunately HawkEye was not up to the task (function not included) and had to resort to my mates DEC system. Finally went out for a spin… felt as if was driving a different vehicle!!! Not only was the infamous vibration gone but the driving completely changed! No more gear shifts at +3000 rpm, on a light throttle gears go at 1700-1800 rpm, and 2300-2400 rpm on a heavier foot. Overall the engine runs a lot smoother and even all the time. Other noticeable changes: 1) Engine and auto transmission feel closer and more in tune rather than catching up with each other all the time (reduced T/C slippage?). 2) More inertia: the uprated T/C is roughly 2 wider and 10 lbs heavier (plus the extra ATF volume) than the original one which gives an increased flywheel effect. Engine feels firmer, solider. 3) Gear shifts are a lot smoother (likely also a consequence of having completely changed the ATF) and on T/C locking up no longer feel the slight pull-push the old T/C had, now can only tell by the drop in engine revs. 4) A totally non-anticipated yet very much welcome side effect: a significant drop in fuel consumption! Still evaluating it but would dare say between 10-15% (quick calculation shows I should be able to repay the new T/C in ~10 months). Logically without the constant revving up it had to burn less fuel. Pictures: All (3) available T/Cs side by side (photo from Ashcroft Transmissions), on the left the original Td5 T/C (also used on the 300 Tdi and diesel P38), in the middle the medium T/C fitted to the 3.9 and 4.0 P38s (this is the one that Ashcroft modifies for the Td5) and on the right the large one used on the 4.6 P38: Transfer box & autobox out of the way: flywheel and flexplate: New T/C: New T/C vs old one: New T/C base/fix plate: Old T/C base/fix plate: Bowl & flex plate: Flywheel (the holes line up with the fixing points in the flex plate, for factory mounting of T/C?): Autobox: New seal in converter housing: Rgds Matt
  13. After years of outguessing Td5 fuel pump and/or fuel pressure regulator problems finally came up with a gizmo to measure live fuel pressure. In the past I had rigged up a mechanical pressure gauge (glicerine type) but for obvious safety reasons it could be only used in static mode (driveway idling). Although the mechanical set up did contribute to fuel pump diagnostics, I wanted something more precise that would allow to closely monitor fuel pressure while driving. It is based on a full sweep electrical fuel pressure gauge (0-100 psi scale) kit from Autometer. The set up comprises (3) parts, firstly the pressure gauge which was mounted on a modified cheapo suction cup type cell phone holder for quick installation and removal: Secondly, the harness, which connects the pressure sender to the pressure gauge, and branches off to a cigarette lighter male type connector where it gets power from: A section of the harness was deliberately left naked so it could be run from the engine to the cabin through the bonnet & door weatherstripping. And thirdly and most importantly the pressure sender part: This is in essence a ‘fuel line extension’ (male x female fuel line connectors) with a side outlet on which the pressure sender is mounted. Used left over parts from a failed fuel pressure regulator (fuel return union with hose + fuel feed union with pipe) and machined the “T” as to have non-sealing threads on the side ends but the same bowl type shape in the interior where the o-rings seat (copied from fuel pressure regulator housing). Fitted new o-rings which are LR p/n STC4509. For the side outlet cut a ¼” NPT female thread to match the 1/4” NPT male x 1/8” NPT female adapter included in the pressure gauge kit (pressure sender is 1/8” NPT male). Made up sender with PTFE thread sealant. The whole thing put together: Not really good looking, but that’s not the point… Bill of materials: - Autometer Sport Comp Fuel Pressure Gauge Kit #3363 which includes: 1. Full sweep electrical fuel pressure gauge 0-100 psi 2. 8 foot harness with connectors 3. 1/8” NPT pressure sender 4. 1/4” NPT male x 1/8” NPT female adapter 5. Wiring instructions - Cigarette lighter type male connector (with internal fuse holder) - 3 Amp fast acting fuse - ¼” convoluted slit tubing - (busted) Fuel Pressure Regulator, complete with union pipe and hose - (2) LR STC4509 o-rings or equivalent - Machined “T”: (FPR sample thread) M x F x side ¼” NPTF - Suction cup type holder - Solder, tin, black tape Usage and findings: It has been a few weeks since it went into service and after having scoped four different Td5s as well as having it permanently installed in my own, have learned the following: Raw fuel pump pressure (sender installed upstream of FPR): - Runs between 6 and 7.5 bar (different vehicles) - Not a steady value, even when idling oscillates in a 0.5 bar range - Decreases as fuel heats up - Decreases slightly as consumption rises (full boost) Regulated fuel pressure (sender installed downstream of FPR and injectors, i.e. downstream of fuel cooler) - Runs at 4 bar steady (nothing new) - Decreases sharply when consumption rises (down to 3.5 bar) - Can be used to diagnose FPR!! i.e. if not sufficciently steady or below 4 bar then FPR is toasted. Regards Matt
  14. Back in July my Disco Td5 started misfiring & cutting out, not in the classic oil in loom way, but rather massively. Nanocom would show a scramble of the following fault codes: FAULT 27-01 injector 1 peak charge long (CURRENT) FAULT 27-02 injector 2 peak charge long (CURRENT) FAULT 27-03 injector 3 peak charge long (CURRENT) FAULT 27-04 injector 4 peak charge long (CURRENT) FAULT 27-05 injector 5 peak charge long (CURRENT) FAULT 28-01 injector 1 peak charge short (CURRENT) FAULT 28-02 injector 2 peak charge short (CURRENT) FAULT 28-03 injector 3 peak charge short (CURRENT) FAULT 28-04 injector 4 peak charge short (CURRENT) FAULT 28-05 injector 5 peak charge short (CURRENT) FAULT 31-01 injector 1 open circuit (CURRENT) FAULT 31-02 injector 2 open circuit (CURRENT) FAULT 31-03 injector 3 open circuit (CURRENT) FAULT 31-04 injector 4 open circuit (CURRENT) FAULT 31-05 injector 5 open circuit (CURRENT) Engine had been thoroughly maintained, injector harness replaced not long before and absolutely no traces of oil in wiring as well as critical connectors including the red plug. Checked continuity between each individual injector connector & the respective pin in the red plug. Checked ECU grounding, battery voltage, fuses, relays, etc. everything even remotely associated with the ECU was verified and found ok. Replaced CKP sensor, fuel pump, and controlled regulated fuel pressure was right (replaced FPR last year). The cutting out gradually worsened over a 2-month period to the point at which the engine would stop altogether (without any previous misfiring) under high load and the check engine light showed up. The fault code in this scenario was always: FAULT 28-07 topside switch failed pre injection (CURRENT) This new evidence pointed the finger towards the ECU so started looking for a replacement. Won a used one on fleabay and a few long weeks later fetched it from customs, plugged it in, programmed injector codes, learned security code and fired up the engine. Warmed engine up a bit and came down the driveway, but as soon as I let weight on the throttle the engine cut out immediately, would not take any load at all, over and over. Turned out the 'new' ECU was twice as buggered as mine! Could even see traces of dry oil around the four tiny ports on the back (eBlag dispute ongoing). Back to the start and another few weeks before I located a 'tried, tested & guaranteed' ECU off a breaker yard. At this point the Disco was barely drivable so took advantage of the sit time and did several low key but time consuming jobs in preparation for a future remap. Pulled out and cleaned intercooler, radiator, hoses, etc. Blanked off EGR, modified exhaust manifold, changed out studs, replaced oil cooler, oil centrifuge & oil filter housing gaskets. Replaced suspicious clips, secured cables, installed silicone hoses; cleaned plugs, changed out engine mounts, springs, shocks, track rod, link rod, etc. It was during this process that I noticed that the section of engine harness conduit going from the back of the battery compartment to the engine, had been rubbing against the ACE lines (right below the coolant reservoir), and it was literally mounted on top. More concerned about a potential leak development in the upper ACE line, wrapped it with a slit piece of hi temp rubber hose (engine harness getting moved around in the process). Anticipating a frustrating journey drove the Disco to town for a wheel alignment session but experienced no misfiring or cutting at all. Drove it around lightly for another 5 days, still good! Took the highway and got rough with her this time but still not a single miss. Though uneasy about not knowing what the problem truly was or how it was involuntarily fixed, declared the Disco once again healthy. Soon came a planned long weekend family trip and decided to take the now well behaved Disco. Drove about 70 km on a paved road and took a shortcut through a rough mountain pass with plenty of corrugated dirt sections, deep holes and rock outcroppings. About 30' into it the engine started cutting out again. It became progressively worse & to the point where even a small bump would cut the engine out! The difference this time was that the misfiring and cutting out were not random but in response to road surface features! Turned around & managed to get home giving the starter motor the day of its life, as well as infuriating the wife & kids… With the ECU still weeks away and evidence that the problem could be laying somewhere else (although ECU was still ‘topsiding’ under heavy load and continuity was re-checked good between ECU and each injector… in static conditions), resolved to try out a different approach... Disconnected the plug going into the engine (C0171) and peeled off enough tape on the conduit going back to the ECU as to be able to freely pull a good 8 inches on the 7 wire bundle coming from the said plug. Cut the 7 cables about 6 inches from the injector harness connector (right before the conduit dives down through inlet manifold), ran heat shrink tubing, soldered 7 new wires, heat shrank, ran into 1/4" slit conduit, and taped & zip tied in place. Then ran the conduit and the 7 cables inside down through the inlet manifold and followed the engine harness path all the way to the plastic receptacle where the ECU is housed. Pulled off the cables corresponding to pins 1, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26 & 27 on the red plug and cut, soldered, etc. Fired her up and never again has it missed a beat let alone cut out! Despite this, have a new engine harness on order as I have my doubts about the long term integrity of the soldered connections. Here's where the engine harness had been chaffing against the ACE lines & suspect the conductors had been damaged: It's a low point therefore if any oil or dirt built up between partially peeled conductors then that could explain the ECUs topside switch failures (partial shorting between conductors at higher loads) and why they have not come back since the ‘bypass surgery’, though always keep the spare ECU handy just in case there was permanent damage inflicted to the ECU and it eventually decides to give up. Put together the following diagram as to help me out in the process: Rgds Matt
  15. Need to replace an MSB101330 ECU (2001 manual Disco Td5) but so far have only managed to source an MSB101184 ECU (coming from exactly the same vehicle type) which is the immediately previous model. The MSB101184 ECU was only fitted between VINs YA251680 through YA288370 then superceded by MSB101330 which ran through VIN 2A736339 (then the later flashable NNN type ECUs were released). Although both are the early MSB type, they feature different config tune and fuel tune IDs: MSB101330 has sttdp008 and sthdr006 tunes respectively, while MSB101184 has sttdp007 & sthdr005, which by the numbers do look "earlier". Being the early type ECU, tunes are 'stamped' and cannot be updated (pls correct me if I'm wrong) unless the ECU is 'given' a PLCC44 socket, new chip, etc. which is out of the question as the owner has no interest in optimising engine power delivery (unfortunately!) So I'm wondering: Will using an ECU with earlier tunes have an impact on engine running performance? Is it possible that MSB101184 may not have in its 'internal injector code catalog' codes from injectors released after the said ECU was superceded? (injectors released when MSB101330 came out for instance...) These may well be dumb questions for the ECU erudites... just trying to cover all areas so I don't end up spending owners dosh on the wrong ECU. Thanks ahead of time.
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