New Defender Purchase

[Tanick]

Hello there. I've been reading as much as I can about Defenders on here and other forums and am about to take the plunge. I didn't know much about them when I started getting interested and don't know much more now but I'm in the market for a car around the £5-8k mark. I want it mainly as a shooting wagon and for a bit of fun.

I'm looking for a SWB 90, and for this money I'll probably end up with something around 1995-98 year? I understand this will probably have the 300 TDi engine rather than the TD5 - I've read they are more reliable and easier to work on. I'm no stranger to spanners having restored all the mechanicals on a 1972 Porsche 911 over the last few years - nothing left to do on it now other than polish and fettle it - which I'm really not into (although driving it is fun!). I don't weld however so my main concern is falling into the trap of buying a rust bucket - I did this with the Porsche and it cost me a lot to sort out (including not having it on the road for 18 months). I know what waxoyl impregnated rust looks like now!

So, a few questions:

1. What do I look for in terms of rust? I see quite a lot of light surface rust on exposed areas such as the door hinges, rear cross member etc - does this means there's much worse lurking underneath? Are there any areas that are really obvious to check? Is any rust acceptable or does anything at all men there are horrors that will show up at the first MOT? I know how easy it is to hide nightmares so what should I be looking for.

2. I like the look of the Hard top versions more than station wagons and prefer the security aspect. Is there much loss in all round vision? How easy is it to add rear fold up seats and belts and what's the cost likely to be? Are seatbelt mounts tapped into in the body of all the cars? If not how do you affix rear lap belts if they're not already done at the factory?

3. If I buy a hard top and its registered as a commercial vehicle can I change this to a private vehicle? I'm worried because I live in the sticks but if it snows I'll need to drive it into London and Ken's new emissions zone will charge me £100 per day.

4. Anything else I need to look for? Is it worth having an inspection done before purchase?

Thanks in advance.

Nick

[gruntus]

Hi Nick,

Welcome on board

In answer to 1) I would do the following if you have little experience with Land Rovers:

Find your nearest friendly Land Rover club and befriend someone who knows what their talking about and get them to look at any prospective purchases for you.

I would expect them to don a pair of overalls and get underneath the potential buy with a big screwdriver and check the chassis and bulkhead thoroughly before you proceed to startup the engine.

You could end up buying something that looks tidy and is a complete pile of rubbish, it is worth considering something a bit older that has been rebuilt on a galv chassis and new bulkhead.

You wouldn't believe what people do to patch up a chassis to get it through an mot (newspaper and pon or really thin plate that will look ok to the mot station but will need replaced by the next mot).

Don't find out the hard way and take your time looking!

Best regards

Grant

[FridgeFreezer]

What Grant said - joining a good club will pay dividends. Having a poke round the forums here will give you insights into ownership - what goes wrong, how to fix it and stuff you can tweak.

An older rebuilt vehicle with a galvanised chassis and a good bulkhead could be a better bet than just buying the newest you can afford, condition is more important than mileage.

A truck covered in accessories is never worth the sum of its parts so don't fall for anyone who tries to make out that a £2k vehicle with £3k worth of extras is worth more than about £3000, and that's if it's tastefully done, well-fitted and quality stuff that you actually want.

Chequerplate is worth precisely nothing and goes down in value the more of it there is plastered over the thing, especially when it's used to hide crusty panels, dents, and rusty bits of chassis.

As for what to look for:

- Chassis rust, have a damn good poke and be suspicious of stuff caked with waxoyl/black sealant, it should ring true not rattle or thunk (or fall apart) when tapped with a knocking stick.

- Bulkhead rust, see above but be on the lookout for filler and stuff hiding behind hinges/panels and bubbling out.

Everything else is varying degrees of nuts and bolts. If it's a 200/300 TDi check it's good as a new one is money. Although most things can be fixed, TDi heads can still get expensive.

A few oil leaks are usual but nothing should be dripping wet or need constant topping up. The power steering box will always leak from the bottom seal, a little moist patch is probably to be expected, more than that and expect to have to fork out for a new box at ~£200.

Door frames and body cappings can rust, doors are money (£250 pair) and can get beyond repair without showing it past the plastic trim. Cappings are a fiddle to replace but not rocket science and early galvanised ones stop the problem.

Gearbox should shift nicely and not be noisy.

Transfer box (hi/low & difflock lever) may be stiff to change if it's not been used off-road, they are pretty solid. Only weak spot is input gear which will manifest itself as a clonk on taking up drive and going from forward to reverse. Assuming the gearbox splines aren't too worn it's £50 for a cross-drilled input gear and ten minutes crawling round underneath to change it.

[Tanick]

Thanks for the advice. I am going out looking tomorrow but probably won't buy. In the last few yeards I've seen enough rust to know what it looks like - I could show you pics to make your hair curl!

I've seen some photos of rotten chassis and am not going to buy anything with any patches. I can't find many pics of what the bulkhead should look like. Are you taking about the one that separates the front /back seats or the firewall between the engine and cab? How best to see potential bad things there?

Also, I've read lots about aluminium corrosion. Is there any point in adding sacrificial anodes or doesn't it work like that?

[Guest mortus]

aluminium corrosion is good, aluminium + oxygen = aluminium oxide, which sticks ontop of the existing aluminium and protects it.

[Early90]

Sacrificial bodywork.........

edited because i posted wrong pic

[FridgeFreezer]

Thanks for the advice. I am going out looking tomorrow but probably won't buy. In the last few yeards I've seen enough rust to know what it looks like - I could show you pics to make your hair curl!

I've seen some photos of rotten chassis and am not going to buy anything with any patches. I can't find many pics of what the bulkhead should look like. Are you taking about the one that separates the front /back seats or the firewall between the engine and cab? How best to see potential bad things there?

Also, I've read lots about aluminium corrosion. Is there any point in adding sacrificial anodes or doesn't it work like that?

Patches on the chassis aren't necessarily bad - a couple of neat patches on a rust-prone area tells you it's at least been done properly. However, most tend to be orrible bodges involving offcuts of washing machines and usually more filler/silicone sealant than actual welding.

The bulkhead is the firewall, yes. It rusts at the bottom, the top by & under the door hinges / vent flaps, the footwells, and under the windscreen. Hell, it rusts everywhere that's not immediately next to a hot engine

Weld-in repair panels are available for not much but it's a pig of a job what with all the wiring can such like running through it and lots of other bits attached to it. A complete galvanised bulkhead can be yours for around £300 if memory/eBay serves me correctly, however a bulkhead swap is also a right old job. Not technically difficult, just a hell of a job.

Aluminium corrosion generally shows up round fasteners, especially where ali bodywork meets steel brackets / chassis etc. and where the metal frame of the door meets the aluminium skin - most often seen as a load of bubbles along the bottom ~2" of the door skin. You can attack it with paint / waxoyl to slow it down but if it's really got hold there's not much you can do as it turns to powder. New panels are easily available but swapping them can be a task.