Propshaft

[Anthony4x4]

Hi peeps just after a little  advice I have just got another freelander td4 2002 auto and notice the  complete propshaft has been removed what I wish to no is will the propshaft off my manual 2001 Td4 fit It 

[Glenlivet]

If the prop shaft has been removed you can guess the VCU is shagged. 

 

You didnt check before you bought??

[Anthony4x4]

Only  realise when I got home it never had no prop shaft on it but what I want to no is will the propshaft off my manual fit on the automatic one or are they  different 

[garrycol]

They should be the same - noting the gearbox fitted is irrelevant as the prop goes from the IRD to rear diff.

As mentioned it would have been removed for a reason - I would be looking at the PTO in the IRD that takes the drive to the rear  - is it still there (is the output coupling still there or is it blanked off) if the shaft/coupling is still there then it may have just been the VCU that failed - if the IRD output shaft is not there and is blanked off then there were IRD issues as well and the PTO pinion and crownwheel have been removed and replaced with a blanking plate.

Garry

 

[Glenlivet]

You should also check with your insurance company as you are driving a non standard vehicle. 

[Anthony4x4]

Cheers Garry everything else is there apart from the prop and vcu will check the diff and ird before fitting my prop and vcu and that a good point about that insurance glenlivet never thought about that cheers guys 

[garrycol]

Unfortunately a busted IRD, with the propshaft removed, will still allow the vehicle to drive OK in many circumstances.  With no load the PTO can still turn OK with no noise.  My VCU failed and caused the bearings in the PTO to fail so the pinion and crownwheel would not mesh - with the prop shaft removed so no load, all was good and I was able to drive around in 2wd for about 6 months until I sourced parts and replaced the IRD.

[Anthony4x4]

Thanks for that but I have a few spaces I have 3 ird and 2 diffs but only one vcu which I think is on it way out am I right in thinking the way to test the vcu is Reverse round a  sharp corner and if it feels like it's braking on its own then the vcu is on its way out  I got all these spares but are the ird boxs the same on auto as manuals

Edited June 4, 2017 by Anthony4x4

[garrycol]

The gearing of the IRDs is different from early models to later models - you want IRDs from the later TD4/V6 models - if there is a difference between auto and manual is is only in gear ratios and are minor and not an issue.

The test you suggest is not the greatest - basically steering on lock drive forward and if it drives as if the handbrake is on a bit then your VCU is OK.  If the car will not drive or constantly stalls the engine (may not happen in an auto) then the IRD is stuffed.  Then there is the Tippex test.  Mark the front propshaft and the rear spot with marks that are aligned.  Go for a drive and if the marks no longer align then the VCU is OK (it has slipped as it should) - if they still align the VCU has not slipped so is stuff.

This Vid is the best test - in first gear (park), handbrake off, jack up the drivers rear wheel - leave the front wheels on the ground - then follow the vid - steady pressure is required - no jerking - if the wheel moves slowly with constant steady pressure the VCU is OK and if it will not move the VCU is stuffed.

VCU test.mp4

Edited June 4, 2017 by garrycol

[FridgeFreezer]

I thought the gearing change was in the rear diffs not the IRD's? Regardless, the "improvement" was made with the arrival of the TD4 so all standard parts for that vehicle should be what you want.

Also I thought the V6 had different props etc. to the rest of the range.

[Anthony4x4]

Cheers guys very helpful stuff and thanks for vid 

Edited June 4, 2017 by Anthony4x4

[garrycol]

9 hours ago, FridgeFreezer said:

I thought the gearing change was in the rear diffs not the IRD's? Regardless, the "improvement" was made with the arrival of the TD4 so all standard parts for that vehicle should be what you want.

Also I thought the V6 had different props etc. to the rest of the range.

I understand that the rear diffs are the same ratio - the front diff ratio in the IRD is what had changed - the early ratio was too different to the rear ratio and is what caused the VCU failures - the later IRDs corrected this with a front ratio closer to the rear diff ratio.  My 98 L series used to rev at 3100RPM at 100kph and when I changed it to a IRD out out a mid range TD4 revs were 2750RPM at 100kph.

Not sure whether the V6 propshafts are different to the TD4s but the IRDs are the same but may have a slightly different front diff ratio.

 

[Tanis8472]

Ird is same regardless of model.

Rear diff is where the ratio was changed.

It's not a pto either 

 

If vcu is gone it won't turn easily on full lock.  It will feel like brakes are on and will try to skip.

[garrycol]

3 hours ago, Tanis8472 said:

Ird is same regardless of model.

Rear diff is where the ratio was changed.

It's not a pto either 

 

If vcu is gone it won't turn easily on full lock.  It will feel like brakes are on and will try to skip.

The IRD is the same but does have different diff ratios.  I have compared them side by side.  the 1.8, L series and TD4 IRDs all have different diff ratios - not sure of the V6.

The rear diff ratios are certainly the same in an L series diff and a mid vintage TD4 - again compared them side by side

The rear drive from the IRD is a PTO system

 

 

[Tanis8472]

In the Land Rover sense its not a PTO (although it applies elsewhere).  That was a seperate power take off for running machinery

The IRD is the same on the petrol 1.8 and 2ltr diesel (1.467:1).  The 2.5 v6 is slightly different ratio internally (1.359:1)

 

This is from another LR site.

Quote

The rear diff ratio's are all the same from all years and all models, the only difference is from around 2000-01 the rear diffs had larger bearings fitted to the carrier. This was done due to diff failures which were in fact caused by VCU and tyre issues, so in fact was completely pointless. Most people want the latter type as they are deemed stronger, but what we have seen is that the later diffs that overheat due to tyre or vcu issues usually destroy the casing as its weaker due to the lesser amount of material in the diff casting sue to the larger bearing.

The final drive ratio from the gearbox is different depending on engine type. The IRD ratio is the same apart from the V6 which is different to all other models, although the majority of the IRD is the same, just a couple of gears in there which do this.

 

[garrycol]

That is not what the RAVE manual I have says - which also confirms my own experiences with the various IRDs and diffs on the workshop floor.

 

 

 

Edited June 5, 2017 by garrycol