Auto conversion on Defender 300tdi - few clarifications needed please

[Ben Spray]

Hi All

I've been thinking about it for a while but a friend wanting my manual box for his 300tdi conversion has pushed me to get this done now, the auto conversion is being done to a factory 300tdi Defender using Disco 300tdi parts. I had the full disco and removed all of the parts myself so I'm pretty confident I have everything needed (ie unless I have lost anything in the year between removing it all and now ) however I have a few questions that I'm not sure on and I've lost epc/microcat at the moment as I've just got a new PC - feel kind of lost without it for checking parts etc hence some of the questions, I've spent a while on Google but still not 100% sure on these points.

So I have:

The engine backing plate

The flex plate

the ring gear

3 x smaller plates that bolt to the crank and secure the flex plate

then obviously torque converter and box

kick down brackets are already fitted to the IP on the Defender ready for the conversion

First question is what order do the 3 small plates/spacers and the flex plate go in? I thought I had them in order but things have been moved around in the garage and I think they may have been disturbed.

Next up, how is the ring gear keyed ie it has a small notch for aligning with a hole in the face of the engine back plate, this obviously needs to align at TDC but is a case of having to align it manually or will everything ONLY bolt up with it in the right place? (reason I ask is I'm getting a local gearbox place do the swap and I need to make sure I'm clear on everything that I need to ask them to do) and also does it go on the engine facing side or the gearbox facing side of the flex plate (this may be obvious when they are held up together but I don't have the parts here to check as everything is with the gearbox place now)

I think I'll be using my existing transfer box off the R380 as its a 1.4 and I think that the gearing will be too high if I go to the Disco 1.2 bearing in mind the autobox top gear is already higher than the R380 and I run 255/85r16 tyres so around 33 odd inches on a heavyish 110 (ie winch bumper/8274/roof rack/spares/tools etc)

Anyone used an auto with 1.2 transfer on a stockish 300tdi (minor pump tweaks only at this stage) on that size tyre? if so how is it? when I can afford it I will be fitting a bigger intercooler and further IP tweaks to compensate for the auto loses so may be a case of 1.4 for now and changing IF it has the torque to pull a higher gear after that?

Are the mountings on the transfer box the same on both auto and manual / Defender and Discovery? ie does it matter if I use mounts off the discos transfer box or do I need to use the ones on the current Defener 1.4 box? - I'm guessing they are the same but want to make sure. linkages will obviously be used as they are on the auto ie the FRC8558 hi lo mounting (as per Ashcroft's site) - all answered now thanks

Next question, starter motors are they the same for manual and auto engines? google suggests they probably are but without microcat I'm not 100% - answered now thanks

Lastly anything else I need to be aware of/let the gearbox place know?

I'm having them change the rear crank seal while the box is off and also the input and output seals between the autobox and transfer box - none of these are leaking at the mo but better to do them while its all apart and I'll probably get them to do a filter and oil change on the auto too, I've let them know that there is a spigot in the crank that will need removing and printed out the torque converter fitting depths from the Ashcroft site

PS they are just doing the heavy work ie swapping the boxes, I will be doing all of the interior trimming and wiring once back with me so I may have some wiring questions later

Cheers all

Ben

[dirtyninety]

This might help a bit!

I would definitely use the 1.4:1 transfer box.

The starters are the same.

[Ben Spray]

Cheers, trying to get microcat to work still (pretty old version now though being the installed version) thanks for the link I may not need to install now, it looks like the transfer box mountings are the same across Disco and Defender / auto and manual

1.4 it is

starter is good news thanks as I think the one on the auto was getting a bit tired.

Will try and edit the original post I think to remove the above

[Ben Spray]

Hi All, anyone got any ideas on the other questions, microcat online shows the three spacers together before the flex plate but I'm not sure that is right? I thought the ring gear was sandwiched in between 2 of them ie the thicker 2 and the shim then went to the crank?

Cheers

Ben

[Ben Spray]

300tdi overhaul manual doesn't overly help as it doesn't seem to show one of the spacers, worrying part though is about measuring and shimming, I assumed that the shim from the disco would be ok but it seems that its shimmed to the engine rather than shimmed to the gearbox - perhaps best to order in a set of shims to take with the parts (thats assuming that just 1 shim will be needed rather than a large stack)?

[tacr2man]

dont forget trans oil cooler . The 1.2 would be too high , i run 1.2 on 90 with edc, and 265/75 and its just about ok , more at home on dual carriageways than backroads , particularly if towing . HTSH

[Ben Spray]

Cheers 1.4 it is, the 255's are a good inch or so taller so I think it will have issues as you say.

For the purpose of getting the gearbox place to do the swap the disco oil cooler will just be left in place for a trial run then I need to get something decent on there once back with me I have some adapters here to go from the M16 or M18 (can't remember which but checked they were right with Ashcrofts) so that I can just run normal hose and JIC type fittings and probably a large mocal type cooler - havent worked out how/where to mount yet though!

I managed to get over and see the parts again today and looking at it, the ring gear can only fit in one position as it has dowels that locate into the flex plate and then the spacers have dowels to locate the flex plate and the crankshaft. so thats ok

Looking at the 3 plates, one is a shim, one is a spacer and I'm not sure what the other is called BUT it came off from the other side of the flex plate, so on mine as removed:

Crank

Shim

Spacer

flexplate

other spacer/small ring

then TC/gearbox etc...

Sound right or not? I can see thats how it came apart as there is a ring of rust and marks where bolts have tightened up against the parts

Cheers

Ben

[steve b]

That sounds right Ben

The ring that goes directly under the bolts is to spread the load to avoid any stress raisers around the bolt head . Check the flex plate carefully

for any signs of cracking before it goes in .

cheers

Steveb

[Ben Spray]

Cool thanks Steveb

I have a new flexplate to go on, just trying to find the correct spacer order with the old one as it has marks etc to show where things went.

Thanks

Ben

[tacr2man]

In my 90 (with auto) I am using a mitsubishi engine oil cooler rad , as they are about right size , and very inexpensive , compared with a mocal IIRC paid £14 for mine .

see here

http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_trksid=p3984.m570.l1313.TR2.TRC0.A0.H0.Xmitsubishi+oil+cooler&_nkw=mitsubishi+oil+cooler&_sacat=0&_from=R40

Make sure to use proper hydraulic (oil resistant) type hose , and I used double hose clips for security , all ok so far

HTSH

[Ben Spray]

Cheers, will give it a look where is yours mounted? any pics of how its fitted?

Cheers

Ben

[Ben Spray]

Hit a snag, it seems the transfer box on the manual ie the 1.4 is either a later spec one or its the original but with the later input gear fitted so it won't bolt up to the auto, seems that part FTC5090 is needed but cant get one in time for the guys at the gearbox place - how big a job is it once back with me to swap the output shaft and the transfer box? didn't really want to be messing about doing that but no choice now really..

Other question is how have people with 300tdi auto Defenders fitted the dipstick tube ie will it bend around the air filter and pipework?

Cheers